Derby

[TANGODANCER]

Never bothered looking it up, but where did the word "Derby" come into use when two local sides play each other? Anybody know?

[Hoboh]

When United first played City someone was overheard to say "look at these two teams of Donkeys". Donkeys take part in the Donkey derby so when two local teams of Donkeys meet each other it's the Derby
Thats my theory anyway.

[CrazyHorse]

The phrase may have originated from an all-in football game (Royal Shrovetide Football) contested annually between the two halves of the English town of Ashbourne, Derbyshire. This match has been and still is played on Shrove Tuesday. Another theory is that it originated from The Derby, a horse race in England, founded by the 12th Earl of Derby in 1780. Yet another theory is that the 'derby match' saying arose from when Liverpool played Everton. Their two grounds were separated by Stanley Park, owned by the Earl of Derby. This latter suggestion can be discounted, however. The Widnes Weekly News of 9 March 1889 describes a game between the (rugby) football team of that town and the touring Maoris as 'the local Derby'. This usage was three years before Liverpool FC came into existence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_derby

Prefer hoboh2o's version myself though.

[hisroyalgingerness]

mentioned in bits around th'web as crazy's found saying originates Ashbourne and coming from the Derby horse race blah blah blah but nobody knows

[perfan]

The phrase may have originated from an all-in football game (Royal Shrovetide Football) contested annually between the two halves of the English town of Ashbourne, Derbyshire. This match has been and still is played on Shrove Tuesday. Another theory is that it originated from The Derby, a horse race in England, founded by the 12th Earl of Derby in 1780. Yet another theory is that the 'derby match' saying arose from when Liverpool played Everton. Their two grounds were separated by Stanley Park, owned by the Earl of Derby. This latter suggestion can be discounted, however. The Widnes Weekly News of 9 March 1889 describes a game between the (rugby) football team of that town and the touring Maoris as 'the local Derby'. This usage was three years before Liverpool FC came into existence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_derby

Prefer hoboh2o's version myself though.

At uni I did a module in 'Football and Society' and was taught that the Ashbourne reason was correct.

[Montreal Wanderer]

CH, you did not put in the next paragraph which states:

Another widely reported, and somewhat more plausible theory (although not accepted by the Oxford English Dictionary) is that the phrase came about from the city of Derby itself. The traditional Shrovetide football match was also common place in the city. It was renowned as a chaotic and exuberant game which involved the whole town and often resulted in fatalities. The goals were at Nuns Mill in the north and the Gallows Balk in the south of the town, and much of the action took place in the Derwent river or Markeaton brook. Nominally the players came from All Saints' and St Peter's parishes, but in practice the game was a free for all with as many as 1,000 players. A Frenchman who observed the match in 1829 wrote in horror, 'if Englishmen call this play, it would be impossible to say what they call fighting'.

Sounds a bit like Belfast on one of its livelier nights.

And for the more prosaic explanation:

It is widely reported that the phrase originates from the town of Ashbourne, Derbyshire, England. There, since as early as the 12th century, two teams from opposite ends of the town play a rough and tumble football/rugby type of game called the Royal Shrovetide Football Match. The match is between the 'uppers' and the 'downers' - townspeople from opposite sides of the river that runs through the town. The object of the game is to get a painted leather ball into the opposition's goal by fair means or foul. You might get a flavour of the scene from the fact that the goals are three miles apart and that one of the (few) rules is that 'unnecessary' violence is frowned upon. This type of game used to be common on feast days throughout England, and this example is still played out annually at Ashbourne.

In normal circumstances evidence linking an event with a phrase having a 900 hundred-year pedigree would be persuasive. Unfortunately, there's nothing apart from local folklore, which is always present when locals lay claim to a phrase, to link the phrase to the town or to the Shrovetide match. After all, the phrase isn't 'a local Ashbourne'.

The actual source is more prosaic. The Derby is the name of the premier horse race in England and the contest was founded by the twelfth Earl of Derby in 1780. Since at least as early as 1840 'derby' has been used as a noun in English to denote any kind of sporting contest. A local derby is just a sporting contest between local rivals.

Early uses of the phrase referred to football (soccer) matches and the first printed citation appears to be the Daily Express, October 1914:

"A local Derby between Liverpool and Everton".

Such matches between the two clubs are still energetically contested. Many other clubs in this and other sports now meet to contest their own 'local derby'.

[Bruce Rioja]

I believe that it originates from Nigeria where one set of villagers would try to kick a water melon into that of their neighbours. The phrase itself coming from the line "Derby da nice people from next village".

[William the White]

CH, you did not put in the next paragraph which states:

Another widely reported, and somewhat more plausible theory (although not accepted by the Oxford English Dictionary) is that the phrase came about from the city of Derby itself. The traditional Shrovetide football match was also common place in the city. It was renowned as a chaotic and exuberant game which involved the whole town and often resulted in fatalities. The goals were at Nuns Mill in the north and the Gallows Balk in the south of the town, and much of the action took place in the Derwent river or Markeaton brook. Nominally the players came from All Saints' and St Peter's parishes, but in practice the game was a free for all with as many as 1,000 players. A Frenchman who observed the match in 1829 wrote in horror, 'if Englishmen call this play, it would be impossible to say what they call fighting'.

Man, that feckin Gallows Balk end was worse than the Shed on a hard day in February...

[Worthy4England]

Feck Tango, you'll be posing the question "how does the snowplough driver get to work?" next....