Tooling up: The summer 2024 transfer thread

[irie Cee Bee]

If we go up and Jones Santos Toal are our starting Centrebacks, we will come right back down. One out of the 3 plus 2 better quality CBs as starters are needed for the Championship.

[The_Gun]

If we go up and Jones Santos Toal are our starting Centrebacks, we will come right back down. One out of the 3 plus 2 better quality CBs as starters are needed for the Championship.

Toal, Santos and Johnston would be the starters. I think that’s probably a Championship quality group.

[BWFC_Insane]

If we go up and Jones Santos Toal are our starting Centrebacks, we will come right back down. One out of the 3 plus 2 better quality CBs as starters are needed for the Championship.

Toal, Santos and Johnston would be the starters. I think that’s probably a Championship quality group.

Honestly I think that is not. Johnston as he was a year ago maybe.

Toal a ways off for the wide role currently. Not enough pace and would be exposed in the championship on current form I think.

And Santos has big question marks over him re fitness and concentration for a league up. The step up is large. At the very least we’d need a viable alternative for that role.

Defensively we are struggling league one. The step up would be huge

If we stay down it’s fair to say that’s the back three and it’s good for the level. Go up and I think it needs work.

[The_Gun]

I think it’s fair to suggest that Johnston may not come back at the same level, at least initially, but it’s also easy to forget that he was one of our best players last season.

I’m confident that having a naturally left footed player of that quality for the LCB role would’ve had a significant positive impact on our defence this season, and we wouldn’t be looking at the back three as an area of concern if so.

[GhostoftheBok]

Hmm, well I wrote a post and then got booted. Plus side, it'll save you all a lot of reading.

Basically, the main issues with our defending isn't who's in the back 3, it's where we lose the ball and how often the defenders have possession when we attack.

Wide players who can dribble past defenders will not only make more goals, they'll make us much, much better defensively. We'll lose the ball further up the park and the back three will spend less time on it.

*edit* Also, and maybe more importantly, we'll see the end of this "man for man, leave a centre back free" system every club wants to play against us now. It's only so effective because we've nobody out wide they need to double mark.

[TANGODANCER]

Wide players who can dribble past defenders will not only make more goals, they'll make us much, much better defensively. We'll lose the ball further up the park and the back three will spend less time on it.

Add the word, fast, pacey and physical in there and I'm all for that Ghost.

[BWFC_Insane]

I’m all for better wing backs but they don’t stop the goals we are conceding. The back three are making mistakes. Every single game. Stopping that would stop the goals to an extent but they also at times need a proper midfield screen. That has been absent and better sides have exploit it. Sheehan isn’t a screen and when teams have two proper strikers who are handfuls it’s not enough.

The championship will exploit us with this back three and a midfield that doesn’t do the defensive side enough. Forget the championship the top end of league one is doing that. We simply concede too many and it’s been a problem this season.

[Worthy4England]

Hmm, well I wrote a post and then got booted. Plus side, it'll save you all a lot of reading.

Basically, the main issues with our defending isn't who's in the back 3, it's where we lose the ball and how often the defenders have possession when we attack.

Wide players who can dribble past defenders will not only make more goals, they'll make us much, much better defensively. We'll lose the ball further up the park and the back three will spend less time on it.

*edit* Also, and maybe more importantly, we'll see the end of this "man for man, leave a centre back free" system every club wants to play against us now. It's only so effective because we've nobody out wide they need to double mark.

See, this is where I have a bit of a problem, with Ogbeta. Going forwards it's a bit "no shit Sherlock." We have it, down their end, all is good. Sure, we're not defending. But life isn't always like that, and when it's not, he has to do something in the MF or Defensive third. V Pompey at home, we didn't have it, he got roasted a couple of times, the second they scored from, but they'd had a decent go 5 minutes earlier on exactly the same situation.

For the CDs, again I agree, that if they're effectively not having to defend it's all strawberries and blow jobs. But for me, too many times, we lose out on important "win your personal battle" type situations (and the really frustrating set piece to the apex)...

Barnsley's first on Tuesday. What are the two defenders trying to do with Cosgrave? Why are neither attacking the ball?

You get the drift...

[jmjhb]

Whilst the defence is unquestionably an issue, how much of that is because we are seemingly much more attacking this season? With a total of 121 goals scored this year, it's obvious the trade-off has been with defensive rigidity.

[Worthy4England]

Whilst the defence is unquestionably an issue, how much of that is because we are seemingly much more attacking this season. With a total of 121 goals scored this year, it's obvious the trade-off has been with defensive rigidity.

That's part of my grump. Something around 30% we'd have to score 3 or more to win and in tight games like Pompey, Derby you have to be able to do both...121 goals don't help much there.

[GhostoftheBok]

An increase in defensive errors is directly related to how much of the ball the centre backs see.

In a possession system you want centre halves who can play, but you also don't want them on the ball constantly; because they will always be the most likely to make errors. That's why they're defenders. Typically your best players are further up the pitch, at any level and in any league.

This man-for-man system teams are using against us now means it's the backs who end up on the ball and then the opposition can force mistakes.

We need to crack that man-marking, at which point space opens up up the park and the backs play less. That means fewer errors.

That's not to say there aren't other defensive issues and that we don't need to fix lots of other issues too, if we can. However, the biggest "bang for your buck" is going to be wide players who can rip apart a defender. They'll draw markers, open up the pitch and mean we see fewer defensive errors and fewer high turn overs.

[Worthy4England]

Well, yeah. Of course the number of errors has a direct relationship to them not having the ball and being defensive v them having the ball and attacking. I mean, that just feels intuitively logical. But however good they system is on the front foot. You will need to defend, pretty much every game. So you have to do it well. As I say, 30% of games you concede 2 or more in, feels way too high for me.

[GhostoftheBok]

Well, yeah. Of course the number of errors has a direct relationship to them not having the ball and being defensive v them having the ball and attacking. I mean, that just feels intuitively logical. But however good they system is on the front foot. You will need to defend, pretty much every game. So you have to do it well. As I say, 30% of games you concede 2 or more in, feels way too high for me.

I agree and I have issues with plenty gaps in our play, like marking on set-pieces.

The better your players the more likely you are to win games. That's about as "intuitively logical" as football gets. So if we can add a centre half who is much better than we have we should do that - just as we should do it anywhere else. It's not like we've got a squad of world class players you can't improve on. These are lads we are hoping can step up to the Championship and there are better players out there.

The question is where we put our money as a priority and which areas we improve will have the biggest impact.

I suspect the priority order is probably: Wingbacks > Mids > Centrebacks > Strikers > Goalkeeper.

Unless we have a lot of money or have done some worldie recruitment work, in which case a stupidly good centre forward is almost always higher up everyone's shopping list. Plus if we keep Paris then mids immediately drop behind centre backs in order of importance.

[plymouth wanderer]

I think top priority is regardless of which division we're in is Paris and a midfield enforcer. I been saying we need someone to protect that back 3 for the last 2 years. Even ehen MJ was here. Our record against the top teams this season isn't great. An enforcer is a must in tight games and when you want to see games out. We got nothing in midfield like that. Tomo, Demps and Morley can all tackle to an extent, but aren't out and out DM.

If promoted, id move on
Coleman
Morley ( decent range of passing, and decent at set plays but I don't think that's enough)
Jerome ( I think will retire and join coaching team)

[GhostoftheBok]

We only just gave Morley a contract to 2027.

Hard to see him leaving in the summer.

[sonicthewhite]

I think top priority is regardless of which division we're in is Paris and a midfield enforcer. I been saying we need someone to protect that back 3 for the last 2 years. Even ehen MJ was here. Our record against the top teams this season isn't great. An enforcer is a must in tight games and when you want to see games out. We got nothing in midfield like that. Tomo, Demps and Morley can all tackle to an extent, but aren't out and out DM.

If promoted, id move on
Coleman
Morley ( decent range of passing, and decent at set plays but I don't think that's enough)
Jerome ( I think will retire and join coaching team)

I'd include JDB in that list as well.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Positional flexibility means it's not always this simple, but one basic way to look at squad depth is XI vs XI. Without descending into "he's better than him" arguments, next season we have these players under contract:

.............Charles Collins.........
Williams Thomason Dempsey JDC
................Sheehan..............
.......Johnston Santos Jones......
................Baxter................

........Adeboyejo Nlundulu.......
????........CMG........????........????
................Morley................
........Iredale Toal Forrester......
...............Coleman..............

That shows clearly that it's the 4 of our 3142 that needs boosting - purely in numbers to start with. Ogbeta or Ashworth could be the LWB, and most will hope Maghoma returns. If we sign the modern Ashley Cole on one side and Cafu on the other, then Williams and JDC move down a notch. We also have Gethin/Iredale as nominally more 'defensive' wingbacks, if such a thing be needed, but they can't play two positions at once.

After making up the numbers, you're into subjective decision-making, and a huge swathe of that is decision-dependent. If we do manage to go up, which of those players, especially in the bottom XI, could play in the Champo? If you think someone couldn't, do we loan them out, or attempt to sell ("Hello, Stockport! Hello, Wrexham!") while they've got contract length?

[GhostoftheBok]

If we do manage to go up, which of those players, especially in the bottom XI, could play in the Champo? If you think someone couldn't, do we loan them out, or attempt to sell ("Hello, Stockport! Hello, Wrexham!") while they've got contract length?

Yup. Can we make space if needed? If we stay down I don't think that'll be a problem, as some will have offers and want out.

It's the same as its always been. You cover your gaps and then you aim to put a cat amongst the pigeons in each compartment (except keepers, they're weird).

We need wingbacks and mids to have a full squad. Then we need to make sure the defence and attackers know they're training for their places.

Collins' arrival may still have the required impact, but the defenders probably need that pressure of a new guy walking in through the door.

Equally the lads need to feel like they've been reinforced and have the talent in the dressing room to make an impact a level up (or win the league if we lose on Saturday).

[GhostoftheBok]

One thing on Coleman, we have no idea what he's like in training. He may be part of a really good department and have loads of value in terms of development.

Given that he's a Bolton lad on a low wage he may naturally evolve into a 3rd choice keeper who sets standards and helps the culture.

You don't automatically get rid of a keeper who isn't really good enough to start games like you would an outfield player. It's an odd dynamic.

[Worthy4England]

Well, yeah. Of course the number of errors has a direct relationship to them not having the ball and being defensive v them having the ball and attacking. I mean, that just feels intuitively logical. But however good they system is on the front foot. You will need to defend, pretty much every game. So you have to do it well. As I say, 30% of games you concede 2 or more in, feels way too high for me.

I agree and I have issues with plenty gaps in our play, like marking on set-pieces.

The better your players the more likely you are to win games. That's about as "intuitively logical" as football gets. So if we can add a centre half who is much better than we have we should do that - just as we should do it anywhere else. It's not like we've got a squad of world class players you can't improve on. These are lads we are hoping can step up to the Championship and there are better players out there.

The question is where we put our money as a priority and which areas we improve will have the biggest impact.

I suspect the priority order is probably: Wingbacks > Mids > Centrebacks > Strikers > Goalkeeper.

Unless we have a lot of money or have done some worldie recruitment work, in which case a stupidly good centre forward is almost always higher up everyone's shopping list. Plus if we keep Paris then mids immediately drop behind centre backs in order of importance.

In that sense, we're in the same place, because I agree with your order of priority. I just don't think Ogbeta is the answer to priority 1 at the moment and if I was looking at who instead of Ogbeta, I'd be delighted with someone better attacking and a LOT better defending...similar on the right too.

For the defence, I'd like us to focus on our gaps in play (or goals against as I call them) and depending how that goes and which Division we're in and whether we land Maghoma, might stay in "third" or at least hit joint second.

Strikers has the capability to "evolve" depending what happens to Bod/Cam. I'd prefer to have an alternative 70 minute option to Dan, unless he's kicked on a bit, post injury.