Gartside Out

[BWFC_Insane]

If my Chief Exec tells me I have to cut my budget as a priority then as a manager that is what I do.

Football is the same.

I'm not claiming it is some great skill to sack folk or let them go but if that was an objective laid out for Freedman, and it clearly was, then he has achieved that. It seems that Eddie is happy that has happened and isn't so concerned with what is happening on the pitch side.

[EverSoYouri]

If my Chief Exec tells me I have to cut my budget as a priority then as a manager that is what I do.

Football is the same.

I'm not claiming it is some great skill to sack folk or let them go but if that was an objective laid out for Freedman, and it clearly was, then he has achieved that. It seems that Eddie is happy that has happened and isn't so concerned with what is happening on the pitch side.

I think you're right on this... although how far that will hold if we fail to win either of our next two home games is another question. I'm pretty sure (though it took too long) the increasingly hostile atmosphere tipped the balance in Megson's fate. How much worse do things need to get at the Macron before Freedman goes the same way?

The pity of it is, I think a lot of us would be willing to cut DF quite a bit of slack (given the financial constraints you quite rightly mention) if there were any signs of him shaping up in other respects.

He persistently tinkers with personnel and formation and yet it's unimaginative tinkering which seems to have the sole outcome of ensuring that we continue to play like a team of strangers. Hard for the fans to climb on board with a man who seems to be determined to drive blindfold.

[TANGODANCER]

All this has to make you wonder where football will be in ten years' time? I'll probably be beyond caring by then, but......

[Worthy4England]

It's a bizarre thread. People point to the only thing Gartside getting right was the appointment of Allardyce, yet we were still in the Prem 5? Years later.

They point to the debt, which is all pretty much owned by one bloke who's bankrolled us. How the hell else did anyone think we were going to get top 10 in the Prem? Fairy dust? What do people expect? That Gartside said no thanks, we'll just chug along and maybe get relegated, see if we can bounce back?

For me, Lee was a poor manager, he recognised that and got shut quickly. Megson was dire performances, but he didn't take us down, we stabilised under Coyle season 1. He should have shunted Coyle 12 months earlier.

Freedman nearly (and probably should have) got us into the playoff's first go. You can talk about luck all you like - I don't care how he might have achieved it. After last season's start, he should probably have been looking again, but if we can't afford to get shut, we can't afford to get shut.

I have Gartside down for one hanging offence at the moment. That being holding on to Coyle too long.

[BWFC_Insane]

It's a bizarre thread. People point to the only thing Gartside getting right was the appointment of Allardyce, yet we were still in the Prem 5? Years later.

They point to the debt, which is all pretty much owned by one bloke who's bankrolled us. How the hell else did anyone think we were going to get top 10 in the Prem? Fairy dust? What do people expect? That Gartside said no thanks, we'll just chug along and maybe get relegated, see if we can bounce back?

For me, Lee was a poor manager, he recognised that and got shut quickly. Megson was dire performances, but he didn't take us down, we stabilised under Coyle season 1. He should have shunted Coyle 12 months earlier.

Freedman nearly (and probably should have) got us into the playoff's first go. You can talk about luck all you like - I don't care how he might have achieved it. After last season's start, he should probably have been looking again, but if we can't afford to get shut, we can't afford to get shut.

I have Gartside down for one hanging offence at the moment. That being holding on to Coyle too long.

Yep think that is about right. And people forget he is only doing what Eddie wants or let's him do. Whatever the strategy we are following, changing Gartside isn't going to change it at all.

[bobo the clown]

I have Gartside down for one hanging offence at the moment. That being holding on to Coyle too long.

Phew ... the voice of reason.

Mind you, he's edging close to a second. If not already there. Maybe should have shunted this guy 11 months ago too.

[EverSoYouri]

Yep think that is about right. And people forget he is only doing what Eddie wants or let's him do. Whatever the strategy we are following, changing Gartside isn't going to change it at all.

I hope he's doing a bit more than that for the money he's drawing down from the club.

Just as an example of why our directors might enjoy "working with the club" here's an extract from The Guardian report on football finance in 2012.

"Highest-paid director: £858,000, presumed to be Allan Duckworth, includes £397,000 pay-off."

Duckworth was our Chief Executive for 14 years. Taking off the pay-off this suggests his salary was £450k. Gartside might have to struggle by on less, but then he's also on the board of Wembley Stadium.

For that money, I want something more than the owner's Yes-man.

[Lord Kangana]

They point to the debt, which is all pretty much owned by one bloke who's bankrolled us. How the hell else did anyone think we were going to get top 10 in the Prem? Fairy dust?

Dangerously close to Ridsdale's "we lived the dream" philosophy, though. And I suspect the debt only started growing well beyond manageable proportions once Allardyce left (which, quite frighteningly is now!) 7 1/2 years ago.

But thats really Eddie Davies' look out.

From Gartside's perspective, the potted history of his managers is probably 1) Appointed a mate who's been busy intriguing whilst Allardyce is busy daydreaming about the England job. 2) Appointed a mate of a mate after original decision is disastrous. Only for him to prove about as popular as syphilis. 3) Get yourself back in the fans' good books by appointing a guy who was a terrace hero. Only for him to also turn out about as popular as syphilis. 4) No idea, probably to do with Crystal Palace's shoestring budget. Signs of Syphilis emerging.

[Gravedigger]

Probably a bit clapped out by now.

[Harry Genshaw]

I have Gartside down for one hanging offence at the moment. That being holding on to Coyle too long.

Phew ... the voice of reason.

Mind you, he's edging close to a second. If not already there. Maybe should have shunted this guy 11 months ago too.

I've not forgiven him for the Carling cup final ticket fiasco. That was his first hanging offence

[jonnybwfc]

Geez, I don't know ... accumulating and overseeing a debt, which grew year-on-year, for 10 consecutive years, whilst we were in the Prem, seems like "a case of gross negligence".

That's how a former BWFC CEO put it to me a few months ago. The way he explained it made it hard to disagree.

[TANGODANCER]

Geez, I don't know ... accumulating and overseeing a debt, which grew year-on-year, for 10 consecutive years, whilst we were in the Prem, seems like "a case of gross negligence".

That's how a former BWFC CEO put it to me a few months ago. The way he explained it made it hard to disagree.

That the debt grew is undeniable, but by the same yardstick, Eddie Davies certainly must have been aware of the same thing since every AGM would be complete with financial statements. If gross negligence is the case it's more than just P.G's fault. Either they were both (plus the board members) sure we'd get back in the Premiership and the finances would improve or they're on some sort of winding up excercise? (note the question mark as I really have no idea)
For sure, E'D seems to have said enough's enough as regards spending and an awareness of F.F.P.. The debt remains a very pertinent question should something happen to him.

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

Geez, I don't know ... accumulating and overseeing a debt, which grew year-on-year, for 10 consecutive years, whilst we were in the Prem, seems like "a case of gross negligence".

That's how a former BWFC CEO put it to me a few months ago. The way he explained it made it hard to disagree.

Not if he was told to spend the money. The debt grew over a number of seasons and Eddie had every opportunity to say enough. It's only in the last few years he's decided enough. There's no doubt Gartside has made mistakes, maybe he's given Eddie some bad advice, but the spending is on Eddie - a highly successful businessman.

[Worthy4England]

Geez, I don't know ... accumulating and overseeing a debt, which grew year-on-year, for 10 consecutive years, whilst we were in the Prem, seems like "a case of gross negligence".

That's how a former BWFC CEO put it to me a few months ago. The way he explained it made it hard to disagree.

Not if he was told to spend the money. The debt grew over a number of seasons and Eddie had every opportunity to say enough. It's only in the last few years he's decided enough. There's no doubt Gartside has made mistakes, maybe he's given Eddie some bad advice, but the spending is on Eddie - a highly successful businessman.

Indeed - if we owed it all to banks, I'm sure they would've possibly foreclosed by now and that would be irresponsible.

If Eddie says "take it don't worry about paying it back" then that's hardly negligent - we don't know the terms, so it's difficult to tell...

[bobo the clown]

If Eddie says "take it don't worry about paying it back" then that's hardly negligent - we don't know the terms, so it's difficult to tell...

Even then they'd be HIS terms, to HIM. What accountants call 'wooden money'.

It's just that he's decided not to add to it, and probably actively can't add to it due to FFP.

It does appear to be years of overspending, underinvestment and build up of money owed to the owner. It does seem to have been poorly handled and maybe he made some presumptions which proved to be rather ambitious. We ARE in a pickle. But we ain't being foreclosed upon anytime soon.

[Lord Kangana]

You've well and truly done it now Bobo!

[EverSoYouri]

If Eddie says "take it don't worry about paying it back" then that's hardly negligent - we don't know the terms, so it's difficult to tell...

I think what he actually said was "take it, and pay me unreasonably high annual interest...oh, at least until the press compares me unfavourably with Mohammed al Fayed."

[Prufrock]

Yup ^.

[Athers]

The most interest I can remember BWFC paying to ED from my annual poke through the accounts was about £5m which was about 5% of the debt at the time, although on turnover of over £50m that seemed alright to me.

The club has been for sale for years and no good offer has come in so I imagine ED and PG (a long term partnership here) are staying on more because they have to than for any great joy of doing it.

Cue 'I'd stay on if I had to for £400k a year' etc. !

[Lord Kangana]

Surely it makes it less of a chore though?