Should Phil Parkinson be sacked?

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

Freedman, Coyle and LSL could come in and do a lot worse.

What worse than having the worst start in about 100 years, 2 points from 27, no goals scored in the last 6 games.

I'd take Parky over those 2 clowns.

[Nicko58]

'No one could do any worse'

I'm getting deja vu.

No one could do worse....they could. They could relegate us and the struggle in league one.

Under normal circumstances Parky would be sacked. But these have been anything but normal circumstances. And we still don't know what restrictions, if any, we are still under from the football league.

I know. That's the point I was making. We've heard it before only to find out that it isn't the case.

[Peter Thompson]

So we write off this season, and keep Parkinson just so that we'll have a chance of getting promotion next season in League 1

Is that it....?, are there no other reasons to back up your support for Parkinson ?

[Hoboh]

To be totally honest unless Sam fancied a go with his miracle tactics, I cannot see anyone coming in and 'doing a job' on us.
I cannot see Ken as someone Sam could work with so I guess that's a non starter, reckon we are back in the brown stuff again.
Let's hope Parky has a streaky spell soon.

[Nicko58]

So we write off this season, and keep Parkinson just so that we'll have a chance of getting promotion next season in League 1

Is that it....?, are there no other reasons to back up your support for Parkinson ?

My post wasn't really about him, it was about the sentiment, often heard when we're struggling, that the manager is so bad that we just need to get rid and appoint literally any bugger and we'll be alright. Yet when we've done just that, we've ended up saying the exact same thing a year-and-a-half later about his replacement. Maybe it's worth sacking managers just for the initial new manager bounce, but, clearly, our problems run deeper than who we have in charge.

As for Parky, he doesn't have my undying support and I've commented earlier in this thread that he needs to change things to make us more competitive. Selecting a midfield three of Cullen, Karacan and Morais was asking for trouble and if he continues with that then it might not be long before I join your side, but I do recognise the constraints that he's working under and the affect that that would have on any manager's ability to keep us up.

Anyway, I've said my piece and I'm now off to binge watch Narcos.

[BWFC_Insane]

To be totally honest unless Sam fancied a go with his miracle tactics, I cannot see anyone coming in and 'doing a job' on us.
I cannot see Ken as someone Sam could work with so I guess that's a non starter, reckon we are back in the brown stuff again.
Let's hope Parky has a streaky spell soon.

See unusually I agree with Hoboh.

Allardyce is being courted by ITV for I'm a celebrity, so even if by some miracle he wanted to come here, we'd never match that sort of money, not by a long stretch.

Apart from day dreaming about Allardyce the only other person I've seen mentioned on twitter is Nolan. Which to me looks like a potential disaster waiting to happen for all involved.

[TANGODANCER]

Apart from day dreaming about Allardyce the only other person I've seen mentioned on twitter is Nolan. Which to me looks like a potential disaster waiting to happen for all involved.

Kev Nolan was great on the pitch, but we need somebody who's great off it.As the sayin goes: "the impossible we do right away miracles take a little longer " Give Parky a bit of time ......The poll's on the side of the angels right now.

[LeverEnd]

If Parky was the main problem, then yes. I genuinely don't see how sacking him would improve anything. Let him get Vela and Ameobi back and see if things improve. I also think he could keep us competitive in league 1 next season, because that's where we going under any manager, short of a change of ownership and a massive cash injection in January.
He's not my ideal manager but I do also think he's a decent genuine bloke with something about him and to keep that squad togetherness last season while losing key players, bedding in new ones amid all the off field shite was very impressive man management.

So it's a no from me.

[Tombwfc]

We weren't so good last season, that Parky is worth staying with because he can do a job next year. And certainly not off the back of the type of season we could be looking at, where you have to imagine at some point fairly soon the players will start blaming the manager.

[BWFC_Insane]

We weren't so good last season, that Parky is worth staying with because he can do a job next year. And certainly not off the back of the type of season we could be looking at, where you have to imagine at some point fairly soon the players will start blaming the manager.

The other scenario though is that someone else comes in, makes no difference and then having been tainted with that failure struggles in league one. And we end up mid table in league one.

The thing is that we've had enough bad managers who couldn't motivate us at all to know getting out of league one was no given. Hand on heart, do you honestly think a different manager makes a huge difference to our ability to stay in this league? I'm struggling to see how much can be changed.

[Peter Thompson]

We weren't so good last season, that Parky is worth staying with because he can do a job next year. And certainly not off the back of the type of season we could be looking at, where you have to imagine at some point fairly soon the players will start blaming the manager.

The other scenario though is that someone else comes in, makes no difference and then having been tainted with that failure struggles in league one. And we end up mid table in league one.

The thing is that we've had enough bad managers who couldn't motivate us at all to know getting out of league one was no given. Hand on heart, do you honestly think a different manager makes a huge difference to our ability to stay in this league? I'm struggling to see how much can be changed.

So I'll try again for the umpteenth time....so we just write off this season then ?

Close the Macron & tell the supporters to come back next August in League 1

No one knows what a different manager (and his coaches) could do - again I've said it before, until we know who would come or who KA can afford how do we know that they couldn't get the players more organised, more motivated, more fired up, fitter, more aggressive, pressing more, attacking better, passing better, better off the ball movement, being more creative, supporting the forwards more - just enough to survive.

Perhaps, just perhaps the current set of players think that our current lower league coaching set up is amateur and just rubbish. No one knows unless you socialise or know some of the players.

Just because people are guessing that we can't get anyone better is not a good enough reason to blindly support a manager who is clearly out of his depth at championship record and by Saturday evening will very likely have 2 points from 33, no goals in 8 games and a team that he's admitted that 'we've lost our way', 'at the moment it looks like we don't have enough quality to survive', 'the supporters have just seen their team lose structure & have no cohesion in there play', 'that is the first time I have seen a team completely lose its way'

90% of the team on Saturday were Parkinson's players, Parkinson's signings.

[Peter Thompson]

So I'll ask another question I've asked peviously - what are Parkinson's strengths as a manager ?, what does he get teams doing well ?

Defensive solidity
Organisation
Motivation
Passing & moving
High pressing
Players fitness
Midfield fluidity
Midfield supporting the forwards
Tough tackling
Creativity
Attacking play
Wins games of football
Always plays for 90 mins / never give up

[LeverEnd]

PT I think we accept that under the current ownership and their lack of finances we can't compete in the championship and that we'll probably we relegated. We try to improve, which I think Parky will do without giving up. We introduce youngsters like turner, king, earing. We go again in league 1 hopefully having salvaged some pride.
If we continue to turn in abject, gutless performances for another 9 games then you can't really keep him in place and I'll accept he has go to.
I don't know much about Joey O'Brien but I'd be signing him on a short term deal and getting him out there asap, fitness permitting, and hope he has the character and experience to make a difference.
Now I imagine you will see that as a write off scenario, and I'm not arguing too strongly that you're wrong, just trying to be a glass half full type for once in my life! Or 'glass has some possibly alcoholic dregs swilling about in the bottom'.

[BWFC_Insane]

We weren't so good last season, that Parky is worth staying with because he can do a job next year. And certainly not off the back of the type of season we could be looking at, where you have to imagine at some point fairly soon the players will start blaming the manager.

The other scenario though is that someone else comes in, makes no difference and then having been tainted with that failure struggles in league one. And we end up mid table in league one.

The thing is that we've had enough bad managers who couldn't motivate us at all to know getting out of league one was no given. Hand on heart, do you honestly think a different manager makes a huge difference to our ability to stay in this league? I'm struggling to see how much can be changed.

So I'll try again for the umpteenth time....so we just write off this season then ?

Close the Macron & tell the supporters to come back next August in League 1

No one knows what a different manager (and his coaches) could do - again I've said it before, until we know who would come or who KA can afford how do we know that they couldn't get the players more organised, more motivated, more fired up, fitter, more aggressive, pressing more, attacking better, passing better, better off the ball movement, being more creative, supporting the forwards more - just enough to survive.

Perhaps, just perhaps the current set of players think that our current lower league coaching set up is amateur and just rubbish. No one knows unless you socialise or know some of the players.

Just because people are guessing that we can't get anyone better is not a good enough reason to blindly support a manager who is clearly out of his depth at championship record and by Saturday evening will very likely have 2 points from 33, no goals in 8 games and a team that he's admitted that 'we've lost our way', 'at the moment it looks like we don't have enough quality to survive', 'the supporters have just seen their team lose structure & have no cohesion in there play', 'that is the first time I have seen a team completely lose its way'

90% of the team on Saturday were Parkinson's players, Parkinson's signings.

I'm not a believer in things going badly = automatically change the manager. I look at where that has led us to over the past decade. I realise that you must have the "right manager" but there is a perception that a magic manager is out there - reality is I'd have thought we'd have seen enough to realise this isn't often the case.

Changing the manager short term doesn't always (or seemingly ever in our case) work out in the longer term. I don't think that sticking with a manager indicates giving up, always. Sometimes it does. But I do think there is a very valid counter opinion to yours. We've seen Parky motivate most of these players. They've pretty much all signed on for him again this summer. I doubt that they've done that because they think he's amateurish.

The midfield he picked on Saturday was absolutely wrong. Cullen simply isn't up to it. Morais isn't a central midfield player. And Karacan had a stinker. But the right choice was putting Pratley in. Therein lies a major issue, the centre of midfield isn't good enough. We are at least 2 high quality midfield players short. Is that partly Parky's fault? Aye. But is it entirely his? I'd say absolutely not. We played a team who've been able to spend money on quality players. We haven't. The quality gap showed.

Surely you must acknowledge that simply changing the manager offers no guarantees and is expensive. Ken might choose to. Equally he may choose to save his money to invest in better players. If it were an either or, I think longer term better players (long term signings) would be more beneficial to the club. At this stage.

[Peter Thompson]

Surely you must acknowledge that simply changing the manager offers no guarantees and is expensive. Ken might choose to. Equally he may choose to save his money to invest in better players. If it were an either or, I think longer term better players (long term signings) would be more beneficial to the club. At this stage.

Absolutely I agree that simply changing the manager offers no guarantees and is and would be expensive.

However, I would counter that on this occasion perhaps it may be more costly for KA to stick with Parkinson and go straight back down in a whimper, the revenue from the championship is greater than in League 1 - also I might add that there is no guarantee that Parkinson would get us back up again from League 1.

I'm grateful that he managed to get us up last year, but I'm one of those who thought that it was expected with the squad that he had and with KA backing him by bringing in ALF, Karacan etc in the Jan window....lets be honest up to going to Fleetwood last March (I think it was March ?) we were fecking awful in League 1 (apart from the 1st few games in August / Sept) with a squad of players costing probably 4 times or more (in salaries) than your average league 1 side

Also, like I have asked in one of recent posts, apart from some sort of loyalty for getting us up last season what are Parkinson's actual strengths as a manager....I haven't seen one area that Parkinson has improved the side, I seriously don't & can't see what he does or coaches during the week, we aren't good at anything - we can't defend, don't create, don't press, can't attack, can't tackle, can't shoot - just because he comes across as a decent guy doesn't mean that we should stick with him.

If someone asked you to sum up Parkinson as a manager, you'd be hard pressed (I know I would be) to name one area of the game that his teams are good at (perhaps hoof ball to a big striker) - most would probably say he's just a decent guy....which isn't enough for me and doesn't mean that someone else (with championship experience, better coaches etc) couldn't get more out of this squad

[BWFC_Insane]

Surely you must acknowledge that simply changing the manager offers no guarantees and is expensive. Ken might choose to. Equally he may choose to save his money to invest in better players. If it were an either or, I think longer term better players (long term signings) would be more beneficial to the club. At this stage.

Absolutely I agree that simply changing the manager offers no guarantees and is and would be expensive.

However, I would counter that on this occasion perhaps it may be more costly for KA to stick with Parkinson and go straight back down in a whimper, the revenue from the championship is greater than in League 1 - also I might add that there is no guarantee that Parkinson would get us back up again from League 1.

I'm grateful that he managed to get us up last year, but I'm one of those who thought that it was expected with the squad that he had and with KA backing him by bringing in ALF, Karacan etc in the Jan window....lets be honest up to going to Fleetwood last March (I think it was March ?) we were fecking awful in League 1 (apart from the 1st few games in August / Sept) with a squad of players costing probably 4 times or more (in salaries) than your average league 1 side

Also, like I have asked in one of recent posts, apart from some sort of loyalty for getting us up last season what are Parkinson's actual strengths as a manager....I haven't seen one area that Parkinson has improved the side, I seriously don't & can't see what he does or coaches during the week, we aren't good at anything - we can't defend, don't create, don't press, can't attack, can't tackle, can't shoot - just because he comes across as a decent guy doesn't mean that we should stick with him.

If someone asked you to sum up Parkinson as a manager, you'd be hard pressed (I know I would be) to name one area of the game that his teams are good at (perhaps hoof ball to a big striker) - most would probably say he's just a decent guy....which isn't enough for me and doesn't mean that someone else (with championship experience, better coaches etc) couldn't get more out of this squad

You look at it, from such a one-eyed angle that its hard to really discuss it. We didn't have 4 times the wage bill of sides last season though we were more than competitive. This season we're playing teams with 15 or 20 or more times our budget. So its inevitable we'll look worse.

As for Parky's strengths - he took a team that looked destined for league 2, and breathed life into it, got it organised and stopped us conceding goals. He isn't doing that now, but I ask, hand on heart, do you think we've genuinely got a good enough group of players to stay up? I looked at Brentford, entirely dispassionately on Saturday and I don't think they'd be interested in a single one of our players. They have better players all over the pitch. This is Brentford we're talking about. They should be better given the fact they've invested money into their side. But still.

We're doing worse than I thought, but clearly we lack a midfield player who can break up play. Big miss and absolutely Parky needs to take some blame for not getting that. Equally had he signed one and not a winger (given we've been restricted on numbers) no doubt you'd have called him negative etc etc...

Fact is this season our only hope is to put 10 scrappers out. Or maybe 9 with one flair player. Because we've tried to attack teams as we did Saturday and been absolutely and utterly exposed for it.

[Peter Thompson]

You look at it, from such a one-eyed angle that its hard to really discuss it. We didn't have 4 times the wage bill of sides last season though we were more than competitive. This season we're playing teams with 15 or 20 or more times our budget. So its inevitable we'll look worse.

As for Parky's strengths - he took a team that looked destined for league 2, and breathed life into it, got it organised and stopped us conceding goals. He isn't doing that now, but I ask, hand on heart, do you think we've genuinely got a good enough group of players to stay up? I looked at Brentford, entirely dispassionately on Saturday and I don't think they'd be interested in a single one of our players. They have better players all over the pitch. This is Brentford we're talking about. They should be better given the fact they've invested money into their side. But still.

We're doing worse than I thought, but clearly we lack a midfield player who can break up play. Big miss and absolutely Parky needs to take some blame for not getting that. Equally had he signed one and not a winger (given we've been restricted on numbers) no doubt you'd have called him negative etc etc...

Fact is this season our only hope is to put 10 scrappers out. Or maybe 9 with one flair player. Because we've tried to attack teams as we did Saturday and been absolutely and utterly exposed for it.

What and you don't look at it from a one eyed angle ? I keep asking questions and you can't or don't answer

You say that we didn't have a wage bill 4 times that of the majority of League 1 clubs - I was actually being kind, it was probably more like 7 or 8 times greater than the majority of teams in League 1.

In regards to a midfield player to break up play, Parkinson obviously didn't think we needed one....he just thought we needed 4 wingers. Also putting 10 scrappers out - personally I don't think that we have any proper scrappers, never mind 10 - the side is soft as shite & shows little desire to get involved in the physical side of the game, we don't even have any leaders on the pitch (another thing that Parkinson didn't see).

Your summation of Parkinson's strengths as a manager is that he breathes life in to it and got team organised in League 1....and for that he deserves to keep his job, made me laugh

I'll leave it at that for now, until our next shambolic capitulation....

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

I haven't seen one area that Parkinson has improved the side

If you mean since he arrived, "the division we play in"?

[Peter Thompson]

I haven't seen one area that Parkinson has improved the side

If you mean since he arrived, "the division we play in"?

I think it was quite obvious that I meant an area of our play that he's improved....but carry on

[BWFC_Insane]

You look at it, from such a one-eyed angle that its hard to really discuss it. We didn't have 4 times the wage bill of sides last season though we were more than competitive. This season we're playing teams with 15 or 20 or more times our budget. So its inevitable we'll look worse.

As for Parky's strengths - he took a team that looked destined for league 2, and breathed life into it, got it organised and stopped us conceding goals. He isn't doing that now, but I ask, hand on heart, do you think we've genuinely got a good enough group of players to stay up? I looked at Brentford, entirely dispassionately on Saturday and I don't think they'd be interested in a single one of our players. They have better players all over the pitch. This is Brentford we're talking about. They should be better given the fact they've invested money into their side. But still.

We're doing worse than I thought, but clearly we lack a midfield player who can break up play. Big miss and absolutely Parky needs to take some blame for not getting that. Equally had he signed one and not a winger (given we've been restricted on numbers) no doubt you'd have called him negative etc etc...

Fact is this season our only hope is to put 10 scrappers out. Or maybe 9 with one flair player. Because we've tried to attack teams as we did Saturday and been absolutely and utterly exposed for it.

What and you don't look at it from a one eyed angle ? I keep asking questions and you can't or don't answer

You say that we didn't have a wage bill 4 times that of the majority of League 1 clubs - I was actually being kind, it was probably more like 7 or 8 times greater than the majority of teams in League 1.

In regards to a midfield player to break up play, Parkinson obviously didn't think we needed one....he just thought we needed 4 wingers. Also putting 10 scrappers out - personally I don't think that we have any proper scrappers, never mind 10 - the side is soft as shite & shows little desire to get involved in the physical side of the game, we don't even have any leaders on the pitch (another thing that Parkinson didn't see).

Your summation of Parkinson's strengths as a manager is that he breathes life in to it and got team organised in League 1....and for that he deserves to keep his job, made me laugh

I'll leave it at that for now, until our next shambolic capitulation....

Paragraph in bold - so how will a new manager change that? We don't even know if we can sign players (and we definitely can't till January).

You make a big play (overstating our financial advantage last season) but don't acknowledge that we are now in a league where every single team has a bigger wage budget and has spent more money on players than we have. Many not just by a bit but by orders of magnitude greater than 10 times. You can't have it both ways. Either our financial competitiveness is a major factor or it isn't. If it isn't then Parky did an amazing job last season given you think this squad is soft as shite and shows little desire....