Not enough said Moore....

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by officer_dibble » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:45 pm

That’s it for me. I’m fully Hill out. If this clown is given the chance of managing us next season god help us - we’ll end up in the Conference. With every passing game it gets worse and worse and worse, he’s tactically inept, an absolute dinosaur. The players should be competing at this level, not passing the ball out of touch, failing to beat the first man with a cross...it’s as bad as I’ve ever seen and it’s been this way since Accrington. Sooner we realise giving him and flitcroft jobs on the basis they were local the better - absolute shockers.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by bristol_Wanderer3 » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:47 pm

I wonder what the league table would look like if each half was 35mins?

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:47 pm

As it read: We had chances, didn't take them, defended poorly gave two goals away. Bottom line; lost a game that sounded winnable.....again..... ae:) .
The wisest and the best of men, nay, the wisest and best of their actions, may be rendered ridiculous by a person whose first object in life is a joke...Darcy. Pride and Prejudice.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by officer_dibble » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:49 pm

bristol_Wanderer3 wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:47 pm
I wonder what the league table would look like if each half was 35mins?
We’d be above Southend with a proper manager
I’m not saying we would have stayed up, but we’d be having a go

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by DJBlu » Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:08 pm

TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:47 pm
As it read: We had chances, didn't take them, defended poorly gave two goals away. Bottom line; lost a game that sounded winnable.....again..... ae:) .
We're not good enough Tango. We are poor and getting worse.

We can't defend nor attack as a unit. We have no mission statement nor plan going into the game.

It made me giggle when Marc Iles confidently said the team had a set piece meeting before Lowe took a quick free kick and we then lost possession. Such expectation and let down in one foul swoop.

The only reason we scored was as someone on twitter put it "Doncaster out Bolton'd Bolton"

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by DJBlu » Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:13 pm

officer_dibble wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:45 pm
That’s it for me. I’m fully Hill out. If this clown is given the chance of managing us next season god help us - we’ll end up in the Conference. With every passing game it gets worse and worse and worse, he’s tactically inept, an absolute dinosaur. The players should be competing at this level, not passing the ball out of touch, failing to beat the first man with a cross...it’s as bad as I’ve ever seen and it’s been this way since Accrington. Sooner we realise giving him and flitcroft jobs on the basis they were local the better - absolute shockers.
I'm slowly coming round to the thinking that Hill might be out of his depth. I really wanted him to do well but I don't think he knows what the plan is.

He clearly has one style of playing and at the start we could see glimmers of it. Now it's like he's putting a team of trialists to see what they can do.

When people say it can't get any worse you sort of hope that it's true. We've just lost against a very poor Doncaster side, a side that was begging not to play us as they feared they were going to lose.

That is a low point. A very low point.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:44 pm

DJBlu wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:08 pm
TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:47 pm
As it read: We had chances, didn't take them, defended poorly gave two goals away. Bottom line; lost a game that sounded winnable.....again..... ae:) .
We're not good enough Tango. We are poor and getting worse.

We can't defend nor attack as a unit. We have no mission statement nor plan going into the game.

It made me giggle when Marc Iles confidently said the team had a set piece meeting before Lowe took a quick free kick and we then lost possession. Such expectation and let down in one foul swoop.

The only reason we scored was as someone on twitter put it "Doncaster out Bolton'd Bolton"
Can't obviously disagree mate, but are we really the worst team in this league? It could so easily be different if we took the chances we get and stopped giving away soft goals every single week. We've had a tough time undoubtedly, but that should be behind us now and we're surely no worse than most of the bottom half of League 1? Time we go a grip somewhere or we'll be playing Pub Sunday League soon.
The wisest and the best of men, nay, the wisest and best of their actions, may be rendered ridiculous by a person whose first object in life is a joke...Darcy. Pride and Prejudice.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:31 am

officer_dibble wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:45 pm
That’s it for me. I’m fully Hill out. If this clown is given the chance of managing us next season god help us - we’ll end up in the Conference. With every passing game it gets worse and worse and worse, he’s tactically inept, an absolute dinosaur. The players should be competing at this level, not passing the ball out of touch, failing to beat the first man with a cross...it’s as bad as I’ve ever seen and it’s been this way since Accrington. Sooner we realise giving him and flitcroft jobs on the basis they were local the better - absolute shockers.
Hmmm - the problem is that clearly initially there was a galvanizing effect but since that wore off and everyone knew we'd go down - how much is down to a lack of spirit/morale an ever changing cast list and injury and how much is down to Hill's clear lack of ability?

I'd argue the former is significant here. The latter - well time will tell.

What I will say and I said it at the time - we've downgraded from Parky to Hill. No question whatsoever. Parky is a good manager a proven manager especially in league one. Hill is not.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by irie Cee Bee » Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:04 pm

Cant get into the Phil vs Hill comparison. Give them both proper players then I can judge them. Phil was horrible with us but with a good side backed by money look at what he is doing at Sunderland. Hill does not have players at the moment who can compete with the best sides in League 1. We are starting to be more competitive against them but they are much better than us at the moment. Most of our players are rejects by clubs and very young kids. The comparison is unfair.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:26 pm

irie Cee Bee wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:04 pm
Cant get into the Phil vs Hill comparison. Give them both proper players then I can judge them. Phil was horrible with us but with a good side backed by money look at what he is doing at Sunderland. Hill does not have players at the moment who can compete with the best sides in League 1. We are starting to be more competitive against them but they are much better than us at the moment. Most of our players are rejects by clubs and very young kids. The comparison is unfair.
Absolute bollocks of the highest order. He took us up and kept us up. With fook all to spend in an embargo.

And as pointed out on twitter the side Hill has now has more championship experience than the one Parky had - and more League One experience for that matter.

With Parky as manager we finished two seasons celebrating on the pitch. When before him was the last time that happened? "Horrible" - that's just utter rubbish. The final season was indeed awful for many reasons but its clear that Parky was probably one of the least of those - but he took the brunt for the club being in the shitter.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by irie Cee Bee » Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:44 pm

So Phil is now a top Manager .. smh. I still maintain we are not comparing apples with apples. I carry no brief for Hill, but I do remember us not winning a lot of games last year under Phil or am I wrong? I do believe both of them should be cut some slack due to the situations which one fell into, and the other inherited to rebuild.

Also having a 28 yo with Championship and league one experience playing for you is definitely not the same as a 33 year old and 36 yo with Championship experience playing for you so that twitter argument is a joke. Let me let you in on a little secret. A footballer peaks at 28-30. Afterwards he goes downhill. So the fact that this side has more experience at those levels means nothing if they are well past their peak.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:52 pm

irie Cee Bee wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:44 pm
So Phil is now a top Manager .. smh. I still maintain we are not comparing apples with apples. I carry no brief for Hill, but I do remember us not winning a lot of games last year under Phil or am I wrong? I do believe both of them should be cut some slack due to the situations which one fell into, and the other inherited to rebuild.

Also having a 28 yo with Championship and league one experience playing for you is definitely not the same as a 33 year old and 36 yo with Championship experience playing for you so that twitter argument is a joke. Let me let you in on a little secret. A footballer peaks at 28-30. Afterwards he goes downhill. So the fact that this side has more experience at those levels means nothing if they are well past their peak.
A "top manager"? We were in league one - what top managers were we getting? In terms of a league one manager - Parky all day over Hill. Parky has promoted us and Colchester from this division - both against the odds.

I think we should be cautious. Hill has managed 3 clubs. At Rochdale he has a 40% win record. At Barnsley 25% at Bolton so far - 22%. That's perhaps suggestive that he could cope at Rochdale but struggles under pressure elsewhere. I certainly think it looks that way thus far.

I'd give him a lot of slack over results - but performances, organisation and structure are severely lacking and getting steadily worse. His interviews are odd in the extreme and he's not a likable character at all.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by bristol_Wanderer3 » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:39 pm

I am increasingly struggling to see how Hill fits into the direction FV want to take the club. A modern, data driven approach with a football director or equivalent, would usually involve an enterprising coach open to the latest methods and tactcics, and one that would encourage and improve younger and unproven players. I am not seeing those qualities in Hill who seems more old school and appears to rely on his personality and man management abilities to get the best out of his squad.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by LeverEnd » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:58 pm

bristol_Wanderer3 wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:39 pm
I am increasingly struggling to see how Hill fits into the direction FV want to take the club. A modern, data driven approach with a football director or equivalent, would usually involve an enterprising coach open to the latest methods and tactcics, and one that would encourage and improve younger and unproven players. I am not seeing those qualities in Hill who seems more old school and appears to rely on his personality and man management abilities to get the best out of his squad.
This is exactly my thinking, you clever, clever man. :D
...

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Feb 12, 2020 10:48 pm

I hope Peter Kenyon has some decent contacts for our next manager. I get all the mitigating circumstances (another new centre half partnership last night for example), but we can’t keep writing seasons off. Start next season badly (which we will under this clown) and we are staring down the barrel of being well and truly fecked.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:38 am

bristol_Wanderer3 wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:39 pm
I am increasingly struggling to see how Hill fits into the direction FV want to take the club. A modern, data driven approach with a football director or equivalent, would usually involve an enterprising coach open to the latest methods and tactcics, and one that would encourage and improve younger and unproven players. I am not seeing those qualities in Hill who seems more old school and appears to rely on his personality and man management abilities to get the best out of his squad.
Well heaven help us then!

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by Worthy4England » Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:26 pm

officer_dibble wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 10:48 pm
I hope Peter Kenyon has some decent contacts for our next manager. I get all the mitigating circumstances (another new centre half partnership last night for example), but we can’t keep writing seasons off. Start next season badly (which we will under this clown) and we are staring down the barrel of being well and truly fecked.
I think the circumstances around writing seasons off are pretty well chronicled. We stayed in the Champo a couple of years ago - against the odds in my opinion. Last season was beset with financial woes that spilled into this season with us playing the U16's and recruiting 19 players (or whatever) on the same day. There's not much about that, that a Manager can resolve. Trying to gee up players who hadn't been paid and didn't know if they were going to get paid, probably isn't that easy. Having set my "success measure" at still have a Club in June/July last year, at one level I'm not disappointed.

That said, I agree that next season should hopefully have a different outlook. I would expect financially that we'll be little different than most L2 Clubs - maybe a bit better off than some, so you'd have to hope we had a chance. Nothing much I've seen this season suggests that we'll be anything other than mid-table at best - which is a worry.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by Hoboh » Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:14 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:31 am
officer_dibble wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:45 pm
That’s it for me. I’m fully Hill out. If this clown is given the chance of managing us next season god help us - we’ll end up in the Conference. With every passing game it gets worse and worse and worse, he’s tactically inept, an absolute dinosaur. The players should be competing at this level, not passing the ball out of touch, failing to beat the first man with a cross...it’s as bad as I’ve ever seen and it’s been this way since Accrington. Sooner we realise giving him and flitcroft jobs on the basis they were local the better - absolute shockers.
Hmmm - the problem is that clearly initially there was a galvanizing effect but since that wore off and everyone knew we'd go down - how much is down to a lack of spirit/morale an ever changing cast list and injury and how much is down to Hill's clear lack of ability?

I'd argue the former is significant here. The latter - well time will tell.

What I will say and I said it at the time - we've downgraded from Parky to Hill. No question whatsoever. Parky is a good manager a proven manager especially in league one. Hill is not.
Well hang on there a touch, ain't that supposed to be part of the managers job to sort? I have never worked anywhere when a poorly performing department has not be the managers problem but because it's football we'll excuse that? Ffs!
Hill clearly is a problem, tactics, personality, how he fits in with our staff, who knows but he is becoming more and more the apparent problem.
The only reason I can see FV not getting shut is having to fork out his remaining contract given they already accept we are down and out. Not good PR to be honest for in football terms relative small change.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:20 pm

Hoboh wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:14 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:31 am
officer_dibble wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:45 pm
That’s it for me. I’m fully Hill out. If this clown is given the chance of managing us next season god help us - we’ll end up in the Conference. With every passing game it gets worse and worse and worse, he’s tactically inept, an absolute dinosaur. The players should be competing at this level, not passing the ball out of touch, failing to beat the first man with a cross...it’s as bad as I’ve ever seen and it’s been this way since Accrington. Sooner we realise giving him and flitcroft jobs on the basis they were local the better - absolute shockers.
Hmmm - the problem is that clearly initially there was a galvanizing effect but since that wore off and everyone knew we'd go down - how much is down to a lack of spirit/morale an ever changing cast list and injury and how much is down to Hill's clear lack of ability?

I'd argue the former is significant here. The latter - well time will tell.

What I will say and I said it at the time - we've downgraded from Parky to Hill. No question whatsoever. Parky is a good manager a proven manager especially in league one. Hill is not.
Well hang on there a touch, ain't that supposed to be part of the managers job to sort? I have never worked anywhere when a poorly performing department has not be the managers problem but because it's football we'll excuse that? Ffs!
Hill clearly is a problem, tactics, personality, how he fits in with our staff, who knows but he is becoming more and more the apparent problem.
The only reason I can see FV not getting shut is having to fork out his remaining contract given they already accept we are down and out. Not good PR to be honest for in football terms relative small change.
I mean over time yes. But he had to arrive sign a whole squad in a day - most of which were not match fit - then lose several to injury, have loans recalled in January - replace them again with players not regularly playing...not sure that's his fault.

I don't think he's very good but there are mitigating circumstances.

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Re: Not enough said Moore....

Post by officer_dibble » Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:51 pm

There are mitigating circumstances. Just like there were for PP. From what I have seen and heard though I don’t think Keith is the man for the job.

Back on Parky - I think Sharon tried to keep him but he could see where this was headed and knew he could get a gig at L1 or above. He has been proven right as well.

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