Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:07 am

DJBlu wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:03 am
.. or Mr Phoenix did.
If Evatt did not then he should say so rather than bawling out a 20 year old. That could be kept to private. How will it help?

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by DJBlu » Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:11 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:07 am
DJBlu wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:03 am
.. or Mr Phoenix did.
If Evatt did not then he should say so rather than bawling out a 20 year old. That could be kept to private. How will it help?
By getting us to talk about a manager bawling out a 20 year old instead of talking about how bobbins the 20 year old has been for the past 3 games.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:16 am

DJBlu wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:11 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:07 am
DJBlu wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:03 am
.. or Mr Phoenix did.
If Evatt did not then he should say so rather than bawling out a 20 year old. That could be kept to private. How will it help?
By getting us to talk about a manager bawling out a 20 year old instead of talking about how bobbins the 20 year old has been for the past 3 games.
Ha. How very Mourinho. I don’t mind a manager pointing at players collectively or in limited circumstances individuals but generally I think it happens when managers have lost the plot themselves.

I’d rather keep most of it in house. Especially as in this case unless he’s doing it deliberately then I’m not sure he can do much to improve other than keep playing and building his experience and skills in training.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by Worthy4England » Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:21 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 10:09 am
brommers95 wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 12:38 am
“I’ve just spoken to Bill in there. He’s a fantastic young goalie with lots of attributes and assets. But we cannot afford him to keep making mistakes, it’s that simple. He costs us the first goal in my opinion at Barrow on Tuesday. Maybe the second one as well and then today. So this is me saying to him publicly ‘man up’. I’ve had that conversation privately. This is a man’s game, three points are at stake and my team deserved to win today.”

Personally I see nothing wrong with Evatt’s comments. Crellin will know he’s got to cut those sorts of mistakes out. It’s not like IE has come out and said he’s f*****g s**t. He even starts by saying what a fantastic keeper he is.

Professional sport is cut throat, continued mistakes won’t be tolerated and I’m sure Crellin is more than aware of this. People can’t be mollycoddled all the time, sometimes they need to be told how it is.
Not sure how manning up is a fix for that. Concentrating harder perhaps. Working on your game perhaps.
Without getting into the "pc" bit.

Probably flattening all in front of him to make sure of his punch/catch (not sure he has the attributes to take Santos out). He does seem a bit scared on the physical front. When he signed, he knew he was signing up for the Men's Senior team. That's factual not sexist.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by nicholaldo » Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:03 pm

DJBlu wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:11 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:07 am
DJBlu wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:03 am
.. or Mr Phoenix did.
If Evatt did not then he should say so rather than bawling out a 20 year old. That could be kept to private. How will it help?
By getting us to talk about a manager bawling out a 20 year old instead of talking about how bobbins the 20 year old has been for the past 3 games.

I think it's more likely he just couldn't keep his frustration in check.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by The_Gun » Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:51 pm

It seems that context is given little consideration in this 'hot take' world we live in. Everyone's so keen to row in with their opinions at the earliest opportunity.

Anyway, back to the infinitely more interesting topic of the football, I do think Crellin has looked a little shaky in general, but also that the impact of the horrendous wind yesterday can't be ignored when considering his error. Overall I'd say he looks ok, but I also hope we didn't turn Matthews away in favour of loaning this lad.

As alternatives, are we realistically likely to go out and pick-up a free agent keeper at this point? I know some names have been bandied about, but you'd think anyone half decent would have a club by now. Personally I had thought Matt Alexander looked a good young keeper in the making, but he clearly doesn't solve the inexperience issue. Also whilst Evatt did praise him in the press a few weeks ago, the fact he won't even put him on the bench now isn't exactly a ringing endorsement.

I also don't get the logic behind the decision to not put a sub keeper on the bench. Yesterday we had Mascoll and Gordon as subs, and surely there's no chance they're both going to get used, so why run the risk of Crellin picking up a knock and having to put an outfielder in net? I find it baffling tbh.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by nicholaldo » Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:14 pm

The_Gun wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 1:51 pm
I also don't get the logic behind the decision to not put a sub keeper on the bench. Yesterday we had Mascoll and Gordon as subs, and surely there's no chance they're both going to get used, so why run the risk of Crellin picking up a knock and having to put an outfielder in net? I find it baffling tbh.

I guess he thinks having to substitute goalkeepers happens so rarely it's worth the risk in exchange for the benefit of having an additional outfield option. A marginal gains thing.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:28 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:21 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 10:09 am
brommers95 wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 12:38 am
“I’ve just spoken to Bill in there. He’s a fantastic young goalie with lots of attributes and assets. But we cannot afford him to keep making mistakes, it’s that simple. He costs us the first goal in my opinion at Barrow on Tuesday. Maybe the second one as well and then today. So this is me saying to him publicly ‘man up’. I’ve had that conversation privately. This is a man’s game, three points are at stake and my team deserved to win today.”

Personally I see nothing wrong with Evatt’s comments. Crellin will know he’s got to cut those sorts of mistakes out. It’s not like IE has come out and said he’s f*****g s**t. He even starts by saying what a fantastic keeper he is.

Professional sport is cut throat, continued mistakes won’t be tolerated and I’m sure Crellin is more than aware of this. People can’t be mollycoddled all the time, sometimes they need to be told how it is.
Not sure how manning up is a fix for that. Concentrating harder perhaps. Working on your game perhaps.
Without getting into the "pc" bit.

Probably flattening all in front of him to make sure of his punch/catch (not sure he has the attributes to take Santos out). He does seem a bit scared on the physical front. When he signed, he knew he was signing up for the Men's Senior team. That's factual not sexist.
Flattening players doesn’t guarantee contact with the ball. For me he misjudged it in the wind. A mistake. A bad one. But he might still make mistakes when he’s 30. Our last keeper made great saves but was also pretty gaffe prone.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by irie Cee Bee » Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:28 pm

The youngster Crellin started off fine to me. He made several excellent saves in earlier games but the goals kept flying in due to poor defensive performances. Some criticized him for not saving them. He had to be superman as far as I was concerned to save some of them. The pressure mounted on the defense which he is a part of which seems to have knocked the stuffing out of his confidence. Hope the lad doesn't give up the game now that the man who took on the job of nurturing him, needing him to be a ball playing goalkeeper, and set up the team the way he did, has joined the others in criticizing him at a time when he needs support the most.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:37 pm

irie Cee Bee wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:28 pm
The youngster Crellin started off fine to me. He made several excellent saves in earlier games but the goals kept flying in due to poor defensive performances. Some criticized him for not saving them. He had to be superman as far as I was concerned to save some of them. The pressure mounted on the defense which he is a part of which seems to have knocked the stuffing out of his confidence. Hope the lad doesn't give up the game now that the man who took on the job of nurturing him, needing him to be a ball playing goalkeeper, and set up the team the way he did, has joined the others in criticizing him at a time when he needs support the most.
Yeah I’d agree. He started well but because people decided a young keeper was no good he took criticism that was undeserved. He’s looking shaky now, but why doesn’t Doyle get abuse for the chances he missed earlier in the season? He’s 30 so has no excuses for not doing what he’s brought in for.

Same with Crawford being god awful. Yet he’s given a pass.

Crellin makes an error and is told to man up. I find it harsh myself. And probably unhelpful.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by TonyDomingos » Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:22 pm

Poor Crellin: he escapes Joey Barton only to run into Evatt. :(
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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by GhostoftheBok » Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:46 am

That was much better than we all feared and shows just how tight this division is. The players had more belief than we've seen all season and that makes a huge difference.

Evatt shouldn't have chewed out Crellin in public. Having said that, Crellin has been at fault for too many goals and the one vs Cambridge was just ridiculous. What Evatt did smacks of desperation. He doesn't have another option, so he's trying to get a reaction from the kid by going public. The fact he's not done it to more experienced players, with more power amongst the players, probably says a lot about Evatt. It took some of the gloss off a good performance.

We need to beat Bradford tomorrow to keep building momentum. A poor performance would see us back to square one. We're in that weird position where the next game is always the most important game of the season. We have got to get a win on the board and get the lads believing in this project again. We saw some really good moments and the usual defensive Achilles' heel.

We've had managers before who have not understood why they were failing. Evatt has described the problems and looked to rectify them on the pitch, so that's in his favour. I still think he will sort things out and that we will be a force in this division next season. There will be ups and downs this season, but this is the pivotal period. If we beat Bradford then I expect to see us solidly in mid table going into the new year. If we lose I think we'll still be bobbling around the relegation zone at that stage.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by officer_dibble » Mon Oct 26, 2020 11:15 am

Agreed ghost. Feels like a big game Tuesday we need to get that home win before November. Still be ups and downs but a win tomorrow and we can kick on in my opinion. A defeat and you chuck the good performance last time out the window.

Let’s see what happens with Crellin. He starts tomorrow no question - Jussi was the same at his age. It’s just frustrating that we have him on loan and all this learning on the job is being done for Fleetwoods benefit. I’d much preferred an older more experienced keeper - but even the decent ones of those get hovered up by premier league teams to hang around and count towards the home grown quota. Look at Lonergan!

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by Bruce Rioja » Mon Oct 26, 2020 12:08 pm

What's Ben Alnwick up to these days?
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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by officer_dibble » Mon Oct 26, 2020 1:03 pm

Still a free agent. Something very strange went off there, not sure what.

I also saw Joe Bunney signed for Matlock Town last week. Bet he regrets going for a drive at 4 in the morning.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by Harry Genshaw » Mon Oct 26, 2020 1:57 pm

Alnwick was struggling with his mental health wasn't he?

I see Mark Howard chucked one in at the weekend too. It happens. Crellin will be questioning himself when the first early crosses come in but as he gets more experience, so long as he cuts out the frequency of mistakes, he'll be ok.

At least he's no crowd pressue to worry about. Matthew's got a bit of stick last year when he elected to punch one or two, that were easier to catch.
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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:53 pm

OK, on Crellin, as we've heard opinions from everybody else with a pulse and a modem:

He's not been as good as I expected but not as bad as many feared, or indeed have claimed. In that howling wind on Saturday, a rubbish cross dropping from a hundred foot in the air will have been badly affected by it, and as I said at the time I don't think Crellin's concentration was helped by having six and a half foot of Santos backing onto him (although TBF to Rico he was doing his job by blocking the forward).

The reaction from some Bolton fans to Evatt's quotes shows that some people can't abide a manager who says nowt and can't abide a manager who says owt. Plenty of those complaining about Evatt's loose lip will also have whinged about Parkinson and Freedman, among others, being careful to the point of catatonia. I don't agree with everything Evatt says but he has the right to say most of them. I'm not sure I agree with him calling out Crellin in public but he started the quote with "He's a fantastic young goalie with lots of attributes and assets" which is hardly the best way to start destroying someone's confidence.

I do think Evatt was unwise to use the phrase "man up" but, again, that was somewhat hauled out of context. He clearly didn't mean "stop being a big girl" or "stop being a sissy and crying about mental health" – each of which would be abhorrent – he meant "step up to the men's game." As I say, the phrasing was unwise and I'm not entirely sure he should be listing errors in public but I don't think it was half as bad in intent as some have said.

Crellin will be alright. The shame is that it has somewhat overshadowed our best performance of the season, one in which we kept the league's best attack down to zero accurate second-half attempts, scored two legitimate goals against an obdurate defence, and registered more than twice their xG (presumably excluding Brocky's boneheadedly disallowed goal). More generally, we had our most promising patterns of play so far under Evatt.

Here's an example: CODE: SELECT ALL and here's another: CODE: SELECT ALL and Brocky's non-goal: CODE: SELECT ALL Play like this, we'll be reet.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by Worthy4England » Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:10 pm

^^ Did that useless, idle, uninterested fcker have 3 of the 14 touches including the assist for Sarce's goal, and I thought I saw him intrinsically involved in Brocky's goal, both occasions starting in his own half...

/remove pin /lob grenade...wait for FA Cup draw with Ian Evatt on it.

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by officer_dibble » Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:17 pm

Aye alright! He grew into the game 🤣

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Re: Cam v Croal a Punting Challenge: League 2, Cambridge v Bolton (A) Saturday October 24 14:00

Post by Bruce Rioja » Mon Oct 26, 2020 10:11 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:53 pm

The reaction from some Bolton fans to Evatt's quotes shows that some people can't abide a manager who says nowt and can't abide a manager who says owt.
Someone who sits between those two positions, leaning towards either only after having first taken stock of both the situation and the motivational requirements of the personnel involved; that fellow will do for me :)
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