Dem Bones, Dem Bones, Dem Bare Bones....

[TonyDomingos]

What we need is someone to start a January 2024 transfer window thread so we can start to speculate who the newbies might be who'll be on the physio's table by February.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

I'm not sure how much money is actually required to resolve the problem? If play at high intensity is a constant, then surely, the variables are the players and/or the training schedule to get them up to required intensity vs the risk of breaking them on the journey. If we can live with the risk we accept the breakages, if we can't, we might need to try and bed them in over a lengthier period.

I'm not sure what unlimited money/monitoring/people would actually do, to spot something like "Fred's going to tear a hamstring" - can sports science departments actually do that, or do they just look at the incidence rate, and adapt their process accordingly?

Feels to me that this is what Evatt is pretty much saying from the article...

I get yer point but yeah, more money buys more monitoring by more Tefal-heads. (And better pitches.)

Sam loved spending money on backroom boys. I'm reasonably confident Evatt will be similarly open to input, given the chance.

[Worthy4England]

Yeah, I get that bit, but they've talked about this problem maybe 12 months back (might be shorter time than that), so the "problem" is known. I mean we spotted it on here about three years ago. How many tefal heads does it take to conclude they might need to take "getting up to speed" a touch more cautiously? I know it's more nuanced than just "slow it down some" and different for each player...

[boltonboris]

Aye, I think we're relatively safe in betting that Sharon is poorer than Sheikh Mansour.

Well yes but I think we obviously lost all those staff and departments and in the rebuild didn’t replace them. Now is the time as they’ve said but guess all takes time to seed.

Certainly more likely than ‘we do some magical stuff that injures players within a month or two, and we just keep doing it’.

I've lost your point here. Are you saying we don't play with high intensity, and it's a cover story for our pennilessness?

Stats suggest we press harder than any other L1 team. Logic suggests we may well train quite hard. But yeah, I agree - we probably haven't (yet?) got the sports-science staff we need when we're putting people in the red zone.

I'm not sure how much money is actually required to resolve the problem? If play at high intensity is a constant, then surely, the variables are the players and/or the training schedule to get them up to required intensity vs the risk of breaking them on the journey. If we can live with the risk we accept the breakages, if we can't, we might need to try and bed them in over a lengthier period.

I'm not sure what unlimited money/monitoring/people would actually do, to spot something like "Fred's going to tear a hamstring" - can sports science departments actually do that, or do they just look at the incidence rate, and adapt their process accordingly?

Feels to me that this is what Evatt is pretty much saying from the article...

Biomechanics. They measure muscle mass, weight, height, lung capacity, sprint speeds and a multitude of other physical/body metrics and they can plan loads accordingly to ensure they're at their max capacity whilst minimising the risk of injury.

They're not that expensive, but they aren't generally 'football people' yet, so don't always get a foot in the door. One of my mates did it and freelanced with Big Sam's WHU side to pretty good success

[BWFC_Insane]

Aye, I think we're relatively safe in betting that Sharon is poorer than Sheikh Mansour.

Well yes but I think we obviously lost all those staff and departments and in the rebuild didn’t replace them. Now is the time as they’ve said but guess all takes time to seed.

Certainly more likely than ‘we do some magical stuff that injures players within a month or two, and we just keep doing it’.

I've lost your point here. Are you saying we don't play with high intensity, and it's a cover story for our pennilessness?

Stats suggest we press harder than any other L1 team. Logic suggests we may well train quite hard. But yeah, I agree - we probably haven't (yet?) got the sports-science staff we need when we're putting people in the red zone.

My point is that when we find some sports science and injury prevention expertise I’d suggest we won’t have these sorts of injuries as often as the training will not change drastically but small changes and individualised routines will be based on appropriate medical and biomechanical evidence.

I think it’s just a question of catching up here. Though it’s taking us a fair while.

[TANGODANCER]

Sports science staff? Fitness-wise, it might be worth having a look a the diets and training schedules of the likes of Phil Jagielka and Matt Le Tissier. There are actually quite a lot of players in the professional ranks still playing way beyond 35. Tommy Banks and co would have called an exorcist specialist in to a computer. Knees bend..begin..

[BWFC_Insane]

Sports science staff? Fitness-wise, it might be worth having a look a the diets and training schedules of the likes of Phil Jagielka and Matt Le Tissier. There are actually quite a lot of players in the professional ranks still playing way beyond 35. Tommy Banks and co would have called an exorcist specialist in to a computer. Knees bend..begin..

Or it might be best to look at what is actually happening how ironically Allardyce introduced much of this stuff and now why it’s all a mainstay in football.

It works. Ask Kevin Davies - he will tell you.

[The_Gun]

I actually listened to a podcast on this subject yesterday which delves into the nuances of getting and keeping players fit, and the different demands placed on training staff by managers.

https://podfollow.com/tifofootballpodca ... d8610/view

As is often the case, when you learn more about the subject, it reveals itself to be significantly more complex than is described by fans.

[Worthy4England]

^^ might have a listen when I get a mo. Cheers TG.

[Prufrock]

There are a hell of a lot more players still in the professional ranks beyond 35 now TD, that's not a coincidence!

Not just football either, Federer won a slam into his 40s, Nadal and Djokovic still the best well into their 30s, Tom Brady in the American football.

Even in F1 Raikonen and now Alonso still going into their 40s.

It's partly public health generally, but a lot of it is sports science.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Judging by recent events, I'd be wary of asking Le Tissier's views....

[BWFC_Insane]

Judging by recent events, I'd be wary of asking Le Tissier's views....

Was going to say….man’s an absolute crank.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Judging by recent events, I'd be wary of asking Le Tissier's views....

Was going to say….man’s an absolute crank.

There's a sorrowful thesis to be written there about dwindling fame, social media amplification, the addictive nature of networks and so on.

[Prufrock]

That, or what the hell Southampton's "sports science" department are up to given Ricky Lambert has gone fully off the deep end too.

[TANGODANCER]

There are a hell of a lot more players still in the professional ranks beyond 35 now TD, that's not a coincidence!

Not just football either, Federer won a slam into his 40s, Nadal and Djokovic still the best well into their 30s, Tom Brady in the American football.

Even in F1 Raikonen and now Alonso still going into their 40s.

It's partly public health generally, but a lot of it is sports science.

All points accepted Pru, but I was concentrating just on football where it must be said our own team have hardly been injury free.

[Prufrock]

It's fair to say we've got Andy Murray's sports scientists rather than Djokovic's

[BWFC_Insane]

It's fair to say we've got Andy Murray's sports scientists rather than Djokovic's

Or Ben Stokes’ rather than wor Jimmy’s…

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

CMG called up for first time - putting his Jan/Feb availability in doubt.

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/2 ... des-gomes/

[Mar]

CMG called up for first time - putting his Jan/Feb availability in doubt.

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/2 ... des-gomes/

This particularly sucks as he's missed a good deal of the campaign already. His call up would have little to do with his effectiveness at Bolton, despite that goal.

Nonetheless happy for the guy, just hoping it doesn't have that much of an impact on our prospects for the season

[boltonboris]

Fortunately, I think we'll be able to fill that hole with a loanee early in the window

But I'm still less than convinced that he can have an identifiable presence in our team. Nothing against him. He looks a tidy player, but we just don't have an A, or B lineup/plan that has his type in there