creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

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Worthy4England
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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Worthy4England » Mon Sep 07, 2020 11:19 am

There's been quite a few very good ODI batsmen. He may of course be the best you've ever seen. Not counting T20 as it's fairly new, so historically someone like Viv Richards didn't play in that format, nor Jacques Kallis for example - it's barely cricket, although necessary for cricket's survival. Kohli, Dhoni, Bevan, Trott, Root and others all averaging over 50.

What he does have in ODI is a huge strike rate - best on record - which can work very well in our favour when the cause looks lost or we need to make a reasonable total a very good one, quickly. 119 is mighty impressive. When you look at Kohli/Dhoni etc. they're down in late 80's/early 90's - which is still pretty good given the total number of runs they scored in the format and to average over 50 is exceptional.

On the T20 batsmen rankings, he's down at 40th - which suggests there are some pretty good batsmen out there.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by BWFC_Insane » Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:23 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Mon Sep 07, 2020 11:19 am
There's been quite a few very good ODI batsmen. He may of course be the best you've ever seen. Not counting T20 as it's fairly new, so historically someone like Viv Richards didn't play in that format, nor Jacques Kallis for example - it's barely cricket, although necessary for cricket's survival. Kohli, Dhoni, Bevan, Trott, Root and others all averaging over 50.

What he does have in ODI is a huge strike rate - best on record - which can work very well in our favour when the cause looks lost or we need to make a reasonable total a very good one, quickly. 119 is mighty impressive. When you look at Kohli/Dhoni etc. they're down in late 80's/early 90's - which is still pretty good given the total number of runs they scored in the format and to average over 50 is exceptional.

On the T20 batsmen rankings, he's down at 40th - which suggests there are some pretty good batsmen out there.
Since he started opening the batting in T20 he averages 47 - not that I particularly take averages into account too much in that format - but previously he was coming in down the order as a 'finisher' so his overall average will of course be lower....(I think Stokes averages 17 or thereabouts in T20internationals).

But whilst I'd place less emphasis on statistics I do think one thing is very telling - for example, in ODI's Ben Stokes and Buttler have almost identical averages - yet Buttler has a far higher strike rate. Root has an average of 51 with a SR of only 87. And this is the thing - once you get someone with an average of 40 and a strike rate of 120 you're looking at a specimen just never seen before. No other player in the history of the game combines an average of 40 and an SR over 110. And that's over a lot of matches.A good average doesn't win you games in ODI cricket necessarily - see how many times people feel Root for example has actually lowered England's score by scoring at a slower rate......not saying you don't want a balance in your side - I'm pointing out that unlike virtually anyone else on the list in Buttler England have someone who is a world class striker of the ball alongside being a world class accumulator and has the ability to know when to do one or the other and can switch between them at will. That is borne out in stats but only to an extent.

Beyond the stats just watching him bat the talent he has in the shorter forms of the game is pretty much unmatched - I've never seen a player who can do what he does - he's virtually impossible to bowl to and unlike many who have high strike rates he's not dependent on the boundaries all the time....

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by nicholaldo » Sun Sep 13, 2020 9:42 pm

Lovely stuff.

Great captaincy, great bowling. Archer and Woakes will get the plaudits, but what a contribution from Sam Curran.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Prufrock » Sun Sep 13, 2020 11:59 pm

Archer in particular was phenomenal. We can't expect it all the time but he's electric when he's playing like that.

T'other Curran brother deserves credit too. Huge partnership with Rashid gave us a chance and he bowled well. Didn't get a wicket but 10 overs at less than 3 was really important in stopping them get into cruise control. Could do with working on his fielding though.

This Australia team is very... English :lol:
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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by BWFC_Insane » Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:54 am

I thought we just had the perfect bowling attack for that pitch. On a pitch without movement and even bounce, Sam Curran especially is there for whacking. But on that pitch yesterday he and his brother were always going to be hard to put away. Which gave us the luxury of bowling out Archer and Woakes to grab the wickets in the middle. I mean we didn't bat well, we were probably 30 runs short of a good total - and only got there thanks to a very very serious tail wag - the top order were poor. But pre world cup even on this wicket I doubt England would have defended 230 odd very often....

Tom Curran is excellent and a good Plunkett replacement (especially if he can add Liam's knack of taking wickets in the middle overs which he does need to work on a bit tbh). Obviously with this team you're going to need to shift bowlers about a bit because sometimes you'll need two spinners or a bit more variety than Sam Curran offers and I think a couple of bowling slots are definitely open to competition - you've got others not featuring who could do a job for sure. But beyond possible two bowling slots - you bring Stokes back in for who? Probably Root for me. And then you've got Malan who seems really unlucky to miss out after his T20's - Banton is highly rated but I'm not totally convinced yet - but perhaps worth a try. Not sure Billings is really this level but he's certainly no terrible.

Huge amount of competition there for places in the batting lineup especially - so much so that I do think Root (as good as he is) might end up missing out in the future in ODIs.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Worthy4England » Sat Feb 06, 2021 11:04 am

Good knocks from Stokes and Sibley, great knock from root. I'm always a bit nervous in India whether 500+ is great or just good, either way, gives us something to work with.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by BWFC_Insane » Mon Feb 08, 2021 12:39 pm

Root being criticised for batting on too long which I think is harsh. Yes it’s an ageing wicket but it’s slow. India are used to this. And our two spinners have taken wickets but generally they’ve bowled like dirt. It worries me listening to channel 4 team say Patel the spin bowling coach tells them not to worry about where they pitch it but to just worry how it comes out of the hand. To me both Leach and Bess need to worry a hell of a lot more where it pitches as their lines and lengths are for international bowlers probably as bad as I’ve seen. All over the show. When they do get it in the right place they are both threats. Which makes it more frustrating.

Leach was going at 9 an over after a fair few overs first innings. 9. In a test where we had 570 on the board. Come on.

Root could have declared early but the quicker were tired and if India get going you can’t rely on the spinners to shut the scoring down. Which is why I think he wanted to take time out. The pitch is a bit tricky but by no means unplayable. You can argue that time was important because if India could get 350 they probably could get 400.

Not overly optimistic tomorrow as I think we’ve probably got the wrong bowlers for this pitch day 5. Archer is good in short spells but not sure on a pitch this slow that he is massively effective beyond that and tomorrow is a slog. Broad would have been a good shout. Especially with the uneven bounce. Having said that we’ve played well. Done what we can. Without a proper spinner we will struggle against that Indian batting lineup. They are so good all the way down.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Worthy4England » Mon Feb 08, 2021 6:27 pm

Well I guess you'd prefer to leave 6/7 wickets on last day, but no major complaints from me. Wouldn't really want to leave them 320/350 on here. As for Leach and Bess, Leach bowled pretty poorly first innings, Bess bowled pretty well from the stats, not actually watched any to be honest so difficult to judge.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:42 am

Great win. Not seen "THAT over" from Jimmy yet, but they're comparing it to Flintoff's v Ponting...

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Feb 09, 2021 12:00 pm

Yep, Leach found his line and length, Jimmy found reverse and England won a test in the most impressive manner you can imagine. Things are coming together with this side. Its not perfect but there is some strength in depth, apart from the openers and spin bowling departments. But to beat India in India even for just one test is a huge achievement. India will come back and given our spin department we're reliant on winning tosses I suspect. But still. Anderson truly is the GOAT and seems to be getting better and better.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:57 pm

Anything that pi$$es off McGrath is a good thing.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:40 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:57 pm
Anything that pi$$es off McGrath is a good thing.
What? Must have missed something. Is he chuntering?

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:16 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:40 pm
Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:57 pm
Anything that pi$$es off McGrath is a good thing.
What? Must have missed something. Is he chuntering?
Oh he will be, even if only in his head, at the talk of Jimmy the GOAT. :-)

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by BWFC_Insane » Fri Feb 12, 2021 2:17 pm

Test 2 starts tomorrow. Archer injured. Bess dropped. Anderson rested. Buttler goes home.

I get the whole thing about the bubble and the mental strain and trying to make sure players contribute and whatever. But I do think that we're caught a bit between stools right now. Jimmy bowled superbly - and to break that momentum when by his own admission he's fitter than he's ever been and more 'up for it' than he's ever been seems a bit crazy.....we're playing a top side here. For me Archer being out was perfect chance to bring Broad in and team him up with Jimmy again. Yes the day/nighter potentially suits Jimmy but who knows what that wicket will do? Whereas its likely this pitch would let him find the reverse swing again. You can I guess argue it gives Olly Stone experience if he plays but if its Woakes....then I'm a bit confused. And Stone for me has a lot to prove that he can cut it at this level, but at least there'd be sense in that.

Now Bess got good figures in terms of wickets - I don't think he bowled well and I don't think he's really a top line spinner. He's still only 23. Yet leaving him out isn't described as rest/rotation but 'dropped'. Which a) seems unnecessary given the general squad rotation and b) seems a little harsh given Moeen is in who hasn't bowled for a long time....frankly the policy seems very confused to me. Why isn't Bess just being given a rest and chance to recuperate after three tests and a lot of bowling? Its good lad is getting experience along the way but resting him would not seem unreasonable. If that's how it was described.

I'm all for blooding talent but to send our best two bowlers (possibly and probably two of the top 5 bowlers in the world right now) to Sri Lanka and India to spend half their time sitting on their hands and never playing together....to me that's not really thought through at all. I doubt Jimmy needs or wants a rest. We're 1-0 up away in India. Now is the time to play them both. Archer, Wood - they've built some experience and will and can continue to do so because nobody proposes Broad and Anderson play every test, together or otherwise nor that we won't need 3 or even 4 seamers sometimes. But right now this pre-determined resting is bollocks. Nothing about playing in India is remotely equivalent to next Ashes in Australia where Archer, Wood, Stone, Woakes you assume will probably all be called upon and Jimmy and Broad even at their absolute best are more limited on hard bouncy pitches compared to the real quicks. But India the pitches aren't likely to offer pace and the few overs of movement with the new ball and then reverse suit Jimmy more (not saying they suit him compared to English conditions at all) than some of the others. We're confusing ourselves with selection. Pick the best side for the game whilst keeping an eye on balance for the future and development.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by KeyserSoze » Sat Feb 13, 2021 9:01 am

Ben Foakes' dad reffed the Reading playoff final.

Well who'da thunk it, etc.
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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Bruce Rioja » Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:34 am

Thought this was slipping away earlier but if we can skittle the tail in the morning we should at least be 'alright-ish' :?

PS. Kholi - you absolute tosser :lol:
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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:51 am

Bruce Rioja wrote:
Sat Feb 13, 2021 11:34 am
Thought this was slipping away earlier but if we can skittle the tail in the morning we should at least be 'alright-ish' :?

PS. Kholi - you absolute tosser :lol:
Looks like a day 4 or 5 pitch already though. Interested to see England bat but 300 looks a huge total on a pitch like this. Typical situation in India where if you lose the toss you are screwed.

England been a bit unlucky from bits I saw. 3rd umpire useless.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by TANGODANCER » Sat Feb 13, 2021 12:49 pm

As said, if we can skittle the tail enders for few runs we may come good. 300 -6 looks a bit dangerous right now.
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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Worthy4England » Sat Feb 13, 2021 1:47 pm

Feels like we need to shunt Pant for not many more early in the morning. He's capable of taking game away from us. Easier to pressurise when you're the team with the runs..Not sure concentration in pressurised situation is out forte.

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Re: creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

Post by Bruce Rioja » Sun Feb 14, 2021 11:13 am

Anyone got the weather forecast for Chennai? 😥
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