Oscar Pistorius

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by bobo the clown » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:11 pm

I don't think he will be found Not guilty.

But he'll be bailed while an appeal is arranged & he'll be free for another year yet.
Not advocating mass-murder as an entirely positive experience, of course, but it had its moments.
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by BWFC_Insane » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:29 pm

LeverEnd wrote:Unbelieveable. Is this type of trial just for people with lots of money for a defence team? I think BWFCI could be right, he'll get off.
IMO he will just buy his way out of it effectively, OJ style.
He will get off murder. But not manslaughter or whatever the equivalent is there.

No way the judge will buy that he didn't realise shooting through a door would kill someone or he wasn't responsible for his actions. Also self defence appears to be a non starter.

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by LeverEnd » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:53 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
LeverEnd wrote:Unbelieveable. Is this type of trial just for people with lots of money for a defence team? I think BWFCI could be right, he'll get off.
IMO he will just buy his way out of it effectively, OJ style.
He will get off murder. But not manslaughter or whatever the equivalent is there.

No way the judge will buy that he didn't realise shooting through a door would kill someone or he wasn't responsible for his actions. Also self defence appears to be a non starter.
I have lost interest in the details tbh, I just felt from the evidence presented early that he was guilty of a 'heat of the moment' murder and would be convicted accordingly. I certainly hope he doesn't get off scot-free. Like you say, shooting blindly through a door into a small room containing a person goes way beyond self-defence to any sane person.
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Prufrock » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:58 pm

I dunno; it wouldn't fly here, but from anecdotal evidence I'm not sure that's the case in Sit Ifrica.
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Montreal Wanderer » Thu Jul 03, 2014 3:15 pm

Prufrock wrote:I dunno; it wouldn't fly here, but from anecdotal evidence I'm not sure that's the case in Sit Ifrica.
In Texas you can shoot anyone anywhere on your property after sunset - even German tourists coming to ask directions. SA may be closer to Texas than the UK in such matters.
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by bobo the clown » Thu Jul 03, 2014 3:43 pm

The decision to rescind the law which allowed the good folk of Chester to kill with bow & arrow any Welshman found inside the City Walls after dusk still rankles with me.

So short sighted.
Not advocating mass-murder as an entirely positive experience, of course, but it had its moments.
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by BWFC_Insane » Thu Jul 03, 2014 4:53 pm

Prufrock wrote:I dunno; it wouldn't fly here, but from anecdotal evidence I'm not sure that's the case in Sit Ifrica.
From the little I've heard from a South African legal expert on the radio, there is little chance his defence will fly there either......

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Hoboh » Sun Jul 06, 2014 7:44 am

Montreal Wanderer wrote:
Prufrock wrote:I dunno; it wouldn't fly here, but from anecdotal evidence I'm not sure that's the case in Sit Ifrica.
In Texas you can shoot anyone anywhere on your property after sunset - even German tourists coming to ask directions. SA may be closer to Texas than the UK in such matters.
Should be the law everywhere, I do like the bit about Germans :mrgreen:

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:35 pm

It is quite plain to me, that the judge Thokozile Masipa, by allowing that Nel was correct in his interpretation of the thirty day mental assessment period, has already concluded that he is guilty of something, and she is already lining her ducks up. I think she is going to plump for murder rather than culpable homicide, and I'm basing that on the time gaps between the prosecution and defence deadlines for written evidence, which is a measly four days. The last time she was so miserly with the gaps was in the Mashamba case, another murder trial, and another one where a man killed a woman by gunshot.
Indeed she is noted for her willingness to convict, and for her penchant to hand out maximum sentences, especially where the crime is of the specie of men committing violent crime against women.
She's no softie, and she has a reputation to uphold.
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:39 pm

Lost Leopard Spot wrote:It is quite plain to me, that the judge Thokozile Masipa, by allowing that Nel was correct in his interpretation of the thirty day mental assessment period, has already concluded that he is guilty of something, and she is already lining her ducks up. I think she is going to plump for murder rather than culpable homicide, and I'm basing that on the time gaps between the prosecution and defence deadlines for written evidence, which is a measly four days. The last time she was so miserly with the gaps was in the Mashamba case, another murder trial, and another one where a man killed a woman by gunshot.
Indeed she is noted for her willingness to convict, and for her penchant to hand out maximum sentences, especially where the crime is of the specie of men committing violent crime against women.
She's no softie, and she has a reputation to uphold.
Aren't deadlines for written submissions agreed with each team in chambers? I thought it was pretty much a "when can you do it for" situation before ruling?

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:49 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:It is quite plain to me, that the judge Thokozile Masipa, by allowing that Nel was correct in his interpretation of the thirty day mental assessment period, has already concluded that he is guilty of something, and she is already lining her ducks up. I think she is going to plump for murder rather than culpable homicide, and I'm basing that on the time gaps between the prosecution and defence deadlines for written evidence, which is a measly four days. The last time she was so miserly with the gaps was in the Mashamba case, another murder trial, and another one where a man killed a woman by gunshot.
Indeed she is noted for her willingness to convict, and for her penchant to hand out maximum sentences, especially where the crime is of the specie of men committing violent crime against women.
She's no softie, and she has a reputation to uphold.
Aren't deadlines for written submissions agreed with each team in chambers? I thought it was pretty much a "when can you do it for" situation before ruling?
Yep, (but) with the judge (ultimately) deciding, and usually the defence wants at least a week beyond the prosecution's submission. I've no idea what Roux thinks or said - maybe he's happy with four days - but I doubt that was his choice.
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Jul 09, 2014 1:55 pm

Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:It is quite plain to me, that the judge Thokozile Masipa, by allowing that Nel was correct in his interpretation of the thirty day mental assessment period, has already concluded that he is guilty of something, and she is already lining her ducks up. I think she is going to plump for murder rather than culpable homicide, and I'm basing that on the time gaps between the prosecution and defence deadlines for written evidence, which is a measly four days. The last time she was so miserly with the gaps was in the Mashamba case, another murder trial, and another one where a man killed a woman by gunshot.
Indeed she is noted for her willingness to convict, and for her penchant to hand out maximum sentences, especially where the crime is of the specie of men committing violent crime against women.
She's no softie, and she has a reputation to uphold.
Aren't deadlines for written submissions agreed with each team in chambers? I thought it was pretty much a "when can you do it for" situation before ruling?
Yep, (but) with the judge (ultimately) deciding, and usually the defence wants at least a week beyond the prosecution's submission. I've no idea what Roux thinks or said - maybe he's happy with four days - but I doubt that was his choice.
Interesting. Mind, he will appeal and spend another year or two a free man. Probably win the appeal as they've already laid out the grounds for one with the moaning about TV coverage putting off defence witnesses.....

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:08 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:It is quite plain to me, that the judge Thokozile Masipa, by allowing that Nel was correct in his interpretation of the thirty day mental assessment period, has already concluded that he is guilty of something, and she is already lining her ducks up. I think she is going to plump for murder rather than culpable homicide, and I'm basing that on the time gaps between the prosecution and defence deadlines for written evidence, which is a measly four days. The last time she was so miserly with the gaps was in the Mashamba case, another murder trial, and another one where a man killed a woman by gunshot.
Indeed she is noted for her willingness to convict, and for her penchant to hand out maximum sentences, especially where the crime is of the specie of men committing violent crime against women.
She's no softie, and she has a reputation to uphold.
Aren't deadlines for written submissions agreed with each team in chambers? I thought it was pretty much a "when can you do it for" situation before ruling?
Yep, (but) with the judge (ultimately) deciding, and usually the defence wants at least a week beyond the prosecution's submission. I've no idea what Roux thinks or said - maybe he's happy with four days - but I doubt that was his choice.
Interesting. Mind, he will appeal and spend another year or two a free man. Probably win the appeal as they've already laid out the grounds for one with the moaning about TV coverage putting off defence witnesses.....
I think your right. I also think that whilst on the appeal trail he may well go on the run (so to speak), slip over the border and bugger off to somewhere like... (I don't know, but somewhere).
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:14 pm

Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:It is quite plain to me, that the judge Thokozile Masipa, by allowing that Nel was correct in his interpretation of the thirty day mental assessment period, has already concluded that he is guilty of something, and she is already lining her ducks up. I think she is going to plump for murder rather than culpable homicide, and I'm basing that on the time gaps between the prosecution and defence deadlines for written evidence, which is a measly four days. The last time she was so miserly with the gaps was in the Mashamba case, another murder trial, and another one where a man killed a woman by gunshot.
Indeed she is noted for her willingness to convict, and for her penchant to hand out maximum sentences, especially where the crime is of the specie of men committing violent crime against women.
She's no softie, and she has a reputation to uphold.
Aren't deadlines for written submissions agreed with each team in chambers? I thought it was pretty much a "when can you do it for" situation before ruling?
Yep, (but) with the judge (ultimately) deciding, and usually the defence wants at least a week beyond the prosecution's submission. I've no idea what Roux thinks or said - maybe he's happy with four days - but I doubt that was his choice.
Interesting. Mind, he will appeal and spend another year or two a free man. Probably win the appeal as they've already laid out the grounds for one with the moaning about TV coverage putting off defence witnesses.....
I think your right. I also think that whilst on the appeal trail he may well go on the run (so to speak), slip over the border and bugger off to somewhere like... (I don't know, but somewhere).
It might settle the debate at least of whether he can run.

There is some talk that if found guilty of possession of illegal ammuntion (which seems an open and shut case) that he would have to go to prison immediately (if sentenced as such) for that irrespective of appeal. Which would be nice.

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:20 pm

Ah. I'd forgotten about the other charges - he's banjaxed anyway, coz as you say, I really really really can't see him getting off those charges.
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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:30 pm

I think his bank balance is diminishing rapidly (he's either sold or trying to flog his house to pay his legal fees) and this will affect his ability to continue bank rolling the top legal teams and be able to scarper abroad.

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:32 pm

Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:I think his bank balance is diminishing rapidly (he's either sold or trying to flog his house to pay his legal fees) and this will affect his ability to continue bank rolling the top legal teams and be able to scarper abroad.
His family are supposedly loaded.

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:59 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:I think his bank balance is diminishing rapidly (he's either sold or trying to flog his house to pay his legal fees) and this will affect his ability to continue bank rolling the top legal teams and be able to scarper abroad.
His family are supposedly loaded.
They'd better be if they're in for a years long appeals process.

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by jaffka » Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:12 pm

Might be loaded now, this process will bleed them dry.

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Re: Oscar Pistorius

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:32 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
His family are supposedly locked & loaded.
Sorry... couldn't resist.
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