atheist blunder - doh!

[thebish]

the new atheist bus campaign featuring two children - happy and smiling (presumably) because they are safe from the horrid "labelling" faith people and have "chosen for themselves"...

the kids were picked from stock photos - and are (actually) the children of a committed evangelical christian family....

[BWFC_Insane]

the new atheist bus campaign featuring two children - happy and smiling (presumably) because they are safe from the horrid "labelling" faith people and have "chosen for themselves"...

the kids were picked from stock photos - and are (actually) the children of a committed evangelical christian family....

And? What does it matter? Who cares.

Its the message thats important.

[thebish]

the new atheist bus campaign featuring two children - happy and smiling (presumably) because they are safe from the horrid "labelling" faith people and have "chosen for themselves"...

the kids were picked from stock photos - and are (actually) the children of a committed evangelical christian family....

And? What does it matter? Who cares.

Its the message thats important.

the blunder just made me smile is all - obviously not you!

but - seriously - the underlying message of the advertising images is that "unlabelled" children - ie - not brought up within a faith - are happy and smiley (with the hinted-at corollary that otherwise they are not) - and to pick your example as kids in an evangelical christian family - all happy and smiling - seemed amusing to me.

[William the White]

It's a bollock dropped.

Children brought up in seriously christian/muslim/buddhidt/Zoroastrian and atheist families will have a happy childhood if they are brought up well, with love and attention.

But they aren't 'christian' 'atheist' or whatever children - until they've exercised choice.

And that's the truthful message clumsily offered...

[Puskas]

It's a bollock dropped.

Children brought up in seriously christian/muslim/buddhidt/Zoroastrian and atheist families will have a happy childhood if they are brought up well, with love and attention.

But they aren't 'christian' 'atheist' or whatever children - until they've exercised choice.

And that's the truthful message clumsily offered...

Indeed - the underlying message is surely that children are too young to understand. Adopt whatever half-arsed superstitious nonsense you like, but don't pretend your children believe it, too.

Or should we also claim that the children of Marxists are also Marxists? And so on.

[thebish]

It's a bollock dropped.

Children brought up in seriously christian/muslim/buddhidt/Zoroastrian and atheist families will have a happy childhood if they are brought up well, with love and attention.

But they aren't 'christian' 'atheist' or whatever children - until they've exercised choice.

And that's the truthful message clumsily offered...

Indeed - the underlying message is surely that children are too young to understand. Adopt whatever half-arsed superstitious nonsense you like, but don't pretend your children believe it, too.

Or should we also claim that the children of Marxists are also Marxists? And so on.

agree completely.

anyway - either way you cook it - it's a bit of a cock-up!

[TANGODANCER]

But they're already labelled, as Atheists. Where's the choice?

If Faith people had done this there'd be an outrage campaign. What's really the difference? If you're from a Catholic family, or any other faith, you grow up in that faith. The choosing comes when you're old enough to know what it is you're choosing surely? After the age of sixteen most kids please themselves anyway, usually by doing the exact opposite of what they're told is right. All a bit pointless to me. What are these people so afraid of?

[BWFC_Insane]

I don't see why.

Its like when you have posters of Kelly Brook advertising Sky Plus, or Jamie Oliver advertising Sainsburys, but then find out that (hypothetically I've no idea) Brook doesn't use Sky and Oliver shops in Waitrose.

I don't see why it matters. Is anyone going to see the ad and think "I best check whether those really are athiest children or not"?

Perhaps its more the message that offends some? I don't know.

IMO all organised religion should be banned full stop. Let people do and believe in whatever they want. Why there is the need for institutions to do this is beyond me.

[Puskas]

But they're already labelled, as Atheists. Where's the choice?

If Faith people had done this there'd be an outrage campaign. What's really the difference? If you're from a Catholic family, or any other faith, you grow up in that faith. The choosing comes when you're old enough to know what it is you're choosing surely? After the age of sixteen most kids please themselves anyway, usually by doing the exact opposite of what they're told is right. All a bit pointless to me. What are these people so afraid of?

No one's afraid of anything. No one wants to label children as atheists, either - they don't understand it.

The point is that if you come from a family that adheres to superstition X, you get sent to schools that propogate superstitition X and everyone treats you as though you also believe it. This can't be good surely - if superstition X is so good, why not let children look into it themselves and decide trhemselves? What are these people so afraid of?

If a superstitious group had done a "don't label me" campaign, it would have been supported by rationalists....

[Lord Kangana]

Bish, bish, bish, this isn't about knowledge, but about faith. I have full faith that the marketing people were out on the lash by 0911 hrs on the day they came up with this tosh.

What next "Ooh look everbody, Hans Christian Anderson was only writing fiction" adverts?

(People like this, only theres a better one somewhere that I can't find about pointless slogans:)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJSlRyQfho4

[Prufrock]

Eh? You've lost me here. I think them being from an evangelical familly makes the point even more strongly. Coz the kids aren't evangelical anything. Good campaign good poster. TD no-one is saying the kids are atheist, they aren't anything.

[TANGODANCER]

Eh? You've lost me here. I think them being from an evangelical familly makes the point even more strongly. Coz the kids aren't evangelical anything. Good campaign good poster. TD no-one is saying the kids are atheist, they aren't anything.

But didn't Bish state it was a new Atheist bus campaign in the OP? Surely kids encouraged to grow up believing there is no God are Atheists, or did I get it wrong? If that isn't the case, why is the advert or the campaign needed at all?

[Lord Kangana]

Free world an all that Tango. Why did I used to get accosted by Lay preachers on the tube all the time. As it happens, I used to humour them. Passes the time of day frying the brains of the "Jesus Army" with logic.

[bobo the clown]

IMO all organised religion should be banned full stop. Let people do and believe in whatever they want. Why there is the need for institutions to do this is beyond me.

Banned ... bit extreme don't you think ? I'm no fan of organised religion, but banning it ??

Indeed, to ban collective groupings in the name of liberal thinking is self-contradictory.

How about banning Trade Unions on that basis ? ... Ooops, or does only work just so long as it's collectivism which you disagree with, I assume !!

History shows that the more you oppress the more people resist.

[TANGODANCER]

Free world an all that Tango. Why did I used to get accosted by Lay preachers on the tube all the time. As it happens, I used to humour them. Passes the time of day frying the brains of the "Jesus Army" with logic.

A free world wouldn't say anything at all LK. Neither Bish nor myself are promoting anything here. The poster, on the other hand, is saying quite clearly that pre-education isn't necessary. In that case, why are they saying it? As I stated previously, the kids will grow up in whatever environ their families come from. If they can't, where's your free world? Surely the campaign is decrying that?

[Prufrock]

Eh? You've lost me here. I think them being from an evangelical familly makes the point even more strongly. Coz the kids aren't evangelical anything. Good campaign good poster. TD no-one is saying the kids are atheist, they aren't anything.

But didn't Bish state it was a new Atheist bus campaign in the OP? Surely kids encouraged to grow up believing there is no God are Atheists, or did I get it wrong? If that isn't the case, why is the advert or the campaign needed at all?

The campaign is by the BHA, the British Humanist Association, which is an Atheist organisation, but the campaign is not encouraging kids to grow up believing there is no god. The campaign is encouraging people, all people not to indoctrinate kids and allow them to make up their own minds. Yet again people get up in arms as if it is some sort of competition between Religion and Atheism, with a scoreboard and both teams have to beat the other one into submission. Read what it says, 'Don't label me. Let me grow up and choose for myself.' Who disagrees with that? The fact it turns out these kids are from an evangelical background and this label is being used for point scoring makes the point quite starkly in my opinion. There are a list of labels behind the kids, one of which is 'Agnostic child'. This campaign isn't saying anything other than kids should be left alone to make their own decision. Anyone disagree?

[Lord Kangana]

So are you suggesting I take up a class action against the "Jesus Saves" posters for false advertising, or are we just all gonna accept that in life people have different opinions on different subjects, and let it go?

[as]

Bill Maher had the right idea.

We need to kick the religious types into touch, before they blow the rest of us up, due to their ridiculous notions that there is a 'god'.

[bobo the clown]

This campaign isn't saying anything other than kids should be left alone to make their own decision. Anyone disagree?

Well, yes ... actually. If you are responsible for bringing kids up but then leave them to their own devices they'lll be dead in weeks and you'll be jailed. I know that isn't what you intended, but that's the principle you suggest if you take to its illogical conclusion.

So parents have a great number of obligations. In excercising these they cannot but influence their thinking. That's a fact. It's fair that they are allowed to develop and to learn to think independently.

[Prufrock]

This campaign isn't saying anything other than kids should be left alone to make their own decision. Anyone disagree?

Well, yes ... actually. If you are responsible for bringing kids up but then leave them to their own devices they'lll be dead in weeks and you'll be jailed. I know that isn't what you intended, but that's the principle you suggest if you take to its illogical conclusion.

So parents have a great number of obligations. In excercising these they cannot but influence their thinking. That's a fact. It's fair that they are allowed to develop and to learn to think independently.

I don't think anyone is suggesting religious types should deliberately hide that from their kids, it just says they shouldn't indoctrinate their kids and tell them from an early age they are a. b. or c.

To rephrase my point to get past your bizarre deliberate misunderstanding of it; this campaign isn't saying anyhting other than kids should be left alone to make their own decision regarding faith, religion or lacktherof. Anyone disagree?