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Re: News Headlines

Post by bobo the clown » Fri Jun 26, 2015 7:29 pm

Prufrock wrote:So your quote might better have read, "we need some countries to have dictatorships", then?

That's lucky for us :D!
Indeed.

To be more straightforward about it .... to avoid any confusion ... " Some places are not ready for nor equipped for democracy as we define it. Some places are better run by a dictatorship despite all the negative aspects therein".
Not advocating mass-murder as an entirely positive experience, of course, but it had its moments.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by a1 » Sat Jun 27, 2015 1:01 pm

just poison the cnuts en masse with lassa fever or some shit*

then use all them trident missiles before they go off

then buy more new ones and use them too

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Re: News Headlines

Post by malcd1 » Sat Jun 27, 2015 2:30 pm

Anyone still think Islam is the 'religion of peace'.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Bijou Bob » Sat Jun 27, 2015 2:38 pm

malcd1 wrote:Anyone still think Islam is the 'religion of peace'.
Yes. I do. At least as much as Christianity is the region of peace. Personally, I'm not going to demonise a whole and very disparate religion because of the actions of a few.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Montreal Wanderer » Sat Jun 27, 2015 2:50 pm

malcd1 wrote:Anyone still think Islam is the 'religion of peace'.
Is Christianity? From the Crusades through the C17th Wars of Religion up to Northern Ireland might tend to make one think otherwise.
Is Judaism? People from present day Gaza back to all those Amalekites, Hittites and Philistines who got smote by the Lord might disagree.

Generally speaking it is those who use religion, pervert it if you will, for political purposes who are the warmongers. TBH I don't know enough about the Qur'an and other sacred writings to judge if it is a religion of peace or not. However, I'm fairly certain it would not advocate the slaughter of anonymous innocents practiced by ISIS, Al-Qaeda et al.

All I know is that I do know some perfectly peaceful Muslims so I would not brand their religion as warlike per se. In the words of Lindop it is 'the singer not the song' that drives the agenda.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by TANGODANCER » Sat Jun 27, 2015 3:26 pm

Way back, it was the Romans and Jews between them who almost wiped out the Christians, who didn't want to fight anyone. Then Christianity became the religion of choice for the Romans who decided to wipe out the Jews. Then again, it was always about power with religion as an excuse to keep things going. All this time later Rome, via the Vatican, is still the seat of power for Chritianity and still preaching peace.Mecca is the same for Islam which, as a religion, does the same. A lot of people see religion as peaceful, as they should, and a lot of greedy and powerful wrong-do'ers use God and Allah as an excuse to be cock of the walk with religion really having little to do with it at all. .
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Harry Genshaw » Sat Jun 27, 2015 5:17 pm

What I find particularly odd is the bombing of the mosque in Kuwait. The chap on the beeb described it as Jihadis wanting sunnis and shias to wage war with each other. How does that help their goal of establishing a caliphate :conf: . What branch of Islam do isis favour?

All in all very depressing :(
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Montreal Wanderer » Sat Jun 27, 2015 5:19 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:What I find particularly odd is the bombing of the mosque in Kuwait. The chap on the beeb described it as Jihadis wanting sunnis and shias to wage war with each other. How does that help their goal of establishing a caliphate :conf: . What branch of Islam do isis favour?

All in all very depressing :(
I think ISIS is Sunni. Iran is Shiite.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by malcd1 » Sat Jun 27, 2015 8:03 pm

Montreal Wanderer wrote:
malcd1 wrote:Anyone still think Islam is the 'religion of peace'.
Is Christianity? From the Crusades through the C17th Wars of Religion up to Northern Ireland might tend to make one think otherwise.
Is Judaism? People from present day Gaza back to all those Amalekites, Hittites and Philistines who got smote by the Lord might disagree.

Generally speaking it is those who use religion, pervert it if you will, for political purposes who are the warmongers. TBH I don't know enough about the Qur'an and other sacred writings to judge if it is a religion of peace or not. However, I'm fairly certain it would not advocate the slaughter of anonymous innocents practiced by ISIS, Al-Qaeda et al.

All I know is that I do know some perfectly peaceful Muslims so I would not brand their religion as warlike per se. In the words of Lindop it is 'the singer not the song' that drives the agenda.
I'm not sure if IS are anti-Islam or the true Muslims. I haven't read the Qur'an and no intention of doing so. However, here are some quotes from the Holy Book. I cannot be certain if they have been taken out of context or even if they can be taken out of context.
Slay the unbelievers wherever you find them(2:191)
Make war on the infidels living in your neighboorhood (9:123)
When opportunity arises, kill the infidels wherever you catch them (9:5)
Kill the Jews and the Christians if they do not convert to Islam or refuse to pay Jizya tax (9:29)
Any religion other than Islam is not acceptable (3:85)
The Jews and the Christians are perverts; fight them (9:30)
Maim and crucify the infidels if they criticise Islam. (5:33)
The infidels are unclean; do not let them into a mosque (9:28)
Punish the unbelievers with garments of fire, hooked iron rods, boiling water; melt their skin and bellies (22:19)
Do not hanker for peace with the infidels; behead them when you catch them (47:4)
The unbelievers are stupid; urge the Muslims to fight them (8:65)
Muslims must not take the infidels as friends (3:28)
Terrorise and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an (8:12)
Muslims must muster all weapons to terrorise the infidels (8:60)
There are few truly peaceful religions. Take for instance the ethnic cleansing of the Albanian Muslims by the Orthodox Christians Serbs in Bosnia.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Montreal Wanderer » Sat Jun 27, 2015 8:42 pm

malcd1 wrote:
Montreal Wanderer wrote:
malcd1 wrote:Anyone still think Islam is the 'religion of peace'.
Is Christianity? From the Crusades through the C17th Wars of Religion up to Northern Ireland might tend to make one think otherwise.
Is Judaism? People from present day Gaza back to all those Amalekites, Hittites and Philistines who got smote by the Lord might disagree.

Generally speaking it is those who use religion, pervert it if you will, for political purposes who are the warmongers. TBH I don't know enough about the Qur'an and other sacred writings to judge if it is a religion of peace or not. However, I'm fairly certain it would not advocate the slaughter of anonymous innocents practiced by ISIS, Al-Qaeda et al.

All I know is that I do know some perfectly peaceful Muslims so I would not brand their religion as warlike per se. In the words of Lindop it is 'the singer not the song' that drives the agenda.
I'm not sure if IS are anti-Islam or the true Muslims. I haven't read the Qur'an and no intention of doing so. However, here are some quotes from the Holy Book. I cannot be certain if they have been taken out of context or even if they can be taken out of context.
Slay the unbelievers wherever you find them(2:191)
Make war on the infidels living in your neighboorhood (9:123)
When opportunity arises, kill the infidels wherever you catch them (9:5)
Kill the Jews and the Christians if they do not convert to Islam or refuse to pay Jizya tax (9:29)
Any religion other than Islam is not acceptable (3:85)
The Jews and the Christians are perverts; fight them (9:30)
Maim and crucify the infidels if they criticise Islam. (5:33)
The infidels are unclean; do not let them into a mosque (9:28)
Punish the unbelievers with garments of fire, hooked iron rods, boiling water; melt their skin and bellies (22:19)
Do not hanker for peace with the infidels; behead them when you catch them (47:4)
The unbelievers are stupid; urge the Muslims to fight them (8:65)
Muslims must not take the infidels as friends (3:28)
Terrorise and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an (8:12)
Muslims must muster all weapons to terrorise the infidels (8:60)
There are few truly peaceful religions. Take for instance the ethnic cleansing of the Albanian Muslims by the Orthodox Christians Serbs in Bosnia.

As you suggest, context is important. Take your first quote - the context is found in the preceding verse.
190. And fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not commit aggression; God does not love the aggressors.

191. And kill them wherever you overtake them, and expel them from where they had expelled you. Oppression is more serious than murder. But do not fight them at the Sacred Mosque, unless they fight you there. If they fight you, then kill them. Such is the retribution of the disbelievers.
:

9:123 reads:
123. O you who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who attack you, and let them find severity in you, and know that God is with the righteous.
9:5 states:
. When the Sacred Months have passed, kill the polytheists wherever you find them. And capture them, and besiege them, and lie in wait for them at every ambush. But if they repent, and perform the prayers, and pay the alms, then let them go their way. God is Most Forgiving, Most Merciful.
I'll stop there after the first three. I used ClearQuran which I hope is a competent translation.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Hoboh » Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:17 am

Freedom and tolerance are perversely the destroyers of freedom and tolerance.

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Re: News Headlines

Post by TANGODANCER » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:53 pm

Both the Bible and the Quran are quoted whenever it's convenient for those in power to twist a meaning or two to suit cases, then claim God said it. What else is new? When did the people make rules or decisions about anything? That's what the Caliphs and the Camerons are there for.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Hoboh » Sun Jun 28, 2015 6:47 pm

And we call Putin a mad despot?
He seems to have a better grasp of reality than most political apologists for Multi Culti!
"In Russia live Russians. Any minority, from anywhere, if it wants to live in Russia, to work and eat in Russia, should speak Russian, and should respect the Russian laws. If they prefer Sharia Law, and live the life of Muslims then we advise them to go to those places where that's the state law. Russia does not need Muslim minorities. Minorities need Russia, and we will not grant them special privileges, or try to change our laws to fit their desires, no matter how loud they yell 'discrimination'. We will not tolerate disrespect of our Russian culture. We had better learn from the suicides of America, England, Holland and France, if we are to survive as a nation. The Muslims are taking over those countries and they will not take over Russia. The Russian customs and traditions are not compatible with the lack of culture or the primitive ways of Sharia Law and Muslims. When this honourable legislative body thinks of creating new laws, it should have in mind the Russian national interest first, observing that the Muslim minorities are not Russians.

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Re: News Headlines

Post by jaffka » Sun Jun 28, 2015 7:18 pm

Hoboh wrote:And we call Putin a mad despot?
He seems to have a better grasp of reality than most political apologists for Multi Culti!
"In Russia live Russians. Any minority, from anywhere, if it wants to live in Russia, to work and eat in Russia, should speak Russian, and should respect the Russian laws. If they prefer Sharia Law, and live the life of Muslims then we advise them to go to those places where that's the state law. Russia does not need Muslim minorities. Minorities need Russia, and we will not grant them special privileges, or try to change our laws to fit their desires, no matter how loud they yell 'discrimination'. We will not tolerate disrespect of our Russian culture. We had better learn from the suicides of America, England, Holland and France, if we are to survive as a nation. The Muslims are taking over those countries and they will not take over Russia. The Russian customs and traditions are not compatible with the lack of culture or the primitive ways of Sharia Law and Muslims. When this honourable legislative body thinks of creating new laws, it should have in mind the Russian national interest first, observing that the Muslim minorities are not Russians.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Montreal Wanderer » Sun Jun 28, 2015 8:42 pm

Hoboh wrote:And we call Putin a mad despot?
He seems to have a better grasp of reality than most political apologists for Multi Culti!
"In Russia live Russians. Any minority, from anywhere, if it wants to live in Russia, to work and eat in Russia, should speak Russian, and should respect the Russian laws. If they prefer Sharia Law, and live the life of Muslims then we advise them to go to those places where that's the state law. Russia does not need Muslim minorities. Minorities need Russia, and we will not grant them special privileges, or try to change our laws to fit their desires, no matter how loud they yell 'discrimination'. We will not tolerate disrespect of our Russian culture. We had better learn from the suicides of America, England, Holland and France, if we are to survive as a nation. The Muslims are taking over those countries and they will not take over Russia. The Russian customs and traditions are not compatible with the lack of culture or the primitive ways of Sharia Law and Muslims. When this honourable legislative body thinks of creating new laws, it should have in mind the Russian national interest first, observing that the Muslim minorities are not Russians.
Well, he certainly sounds like an ethnic nationalist of the Attaturk type to me. What he doesn't seem to appreciate is 'our Muslims' (our being the suicidal countries he mentions plus Canada) are immigrants because 'our' countries are places people want to move to for a better life. One of the reasons life may be better is a certain level of multiculturalism and tolerance. His Muslims on the other hand have been there within the boundaries of Russia a long time, occupying the land for centuries. Few modern migrants would want to go to Russia if there were reasonable alternatives.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Hoboh » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:35 pm

Montreal Wanderer wrote:
Hoboh wrote:And we call Putin a mad despot?
He seems to have a better grasp of reality than most political apologists for Multi Culti!
"In Russia live Russians. Any minority, from anywhere, if it wants to live in Russia, to work and eat in Russia, should speak Russian, and should respect the Russian laws. If they prefer Sharia Law, and live the life of Muslims then we advise them to go to those places where that's the state law. Russia does not need Muslim minorities. Minorities need Russia, and we will not grant them special privileges, or try to change our laws to fit their desires, no matter how loud they yell 'discrimination'. We will not tolerate disrespect of our Russian culture. We had better learn from the suicides of America, England, Holland and France, if we are to survive as a nation. The Muslims are taking over those countries and they will not take over Russia. The Russian customs and traditions are not compatible with the lack of culture or the primitive ways of Sharia Law and Muslims. When this honourable legislative body thinks of creating new laws, it should have in mind the Russian national interest first, observing that the Muslim minorities are not Russians.
Well, he certainly sounds like an ethnic nationalist of the Attaturk type to me. What he doesn't seem to appreciate is 'our Muslims' (our being the suicidal countries he mentions plus Canada) are immigrants because 'our' countries are places people want to move to for a better life. One of the reasons life may be better is a certain level of multiculturalism and tolerance. His Muslims on the other hand have been there within the boundaries of Russia a long time, occupying the land for centuries. Few modern migrants would want to go to Russia if there were reasonable alternatives.
You see here Monty is were we differ, if our countries are so much better then why do they not assimilate into our society whilst bringing small pieces of their culture to enrich us?

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Re: News Headlines

Post by Montreal Wanderer » Mon Jun 29, 2015 3:00 am

Hoboh wrote:
Montreal Wanderer wrote:
Hoboh wrote:And we call Putin a mad despot?
He seems to have a better grasp of reality than most political apologists for Multi Culti!
"In Russia live Russians. Any minority, from anywhere, if it wants to live in Russia, to work and eat in Russia, should speak Russian, and should respect the Russian laws. If they prefer Sharia Law, and live the life of Muslims then we advise them to go to those places where that's the state law. Russia does not need Muslim minorities. Minorities need Russia, and we will not grant them special privileges, or try to change our laws to fit their desires, no matter how loud they yell 'discrimination'. We will not tolerate disrespect of our Russian culture. We had better learn from the suicides of America, England, Holland and France, if we are to survive as a nation. The Muslims are taking over those countries and they will not take over Russia. The Russian customs and traditions are not compatible with the lack of culture or the primitive ways of Sharia Law and Muslims. When this honourable legislative body thinks of creating new laws, it should have in mind the Russian national interest first, observing that the Muslim minorities are not Russians.
Well, he certainly sounds like an ethnic nationalist of the Attaturk type to me. What he doesn't seem to appreciate is 'our Muslims' (our being the suicidal countries he mentions plus Canada) are immigrants because 'our' countries are places people want to move to for a better life. One of the reasons life may be better is a certain level of multiculturalism and tolerance. His Muslims on the other hand have been there within the boundaries of Russia a long time, occupying the land for centuries. Few modern migrants would want to go to Russia if there were reasonable alternatives.
You see here Monty is were we differ, if our countries are so much better then why do they not assimilate into our society whilst bringing small pieces of their culture to enrich us?
I think your are confusing two issues here, hobes. One is the perception that first world Western countries are good places to emigrate to and that life there will be better. This is what I referred to above. The second is the question of why don't immigrants allow themselves to become assimilated which you posed. Quite a different matter. However, again I would suggest that desirable countries to emigrate to might be those that do not insist of Putin-like assimilation but rather encourage multi-culturalism.
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Re: News Headlines

Post by Prufrock » Mon Jun 29, 2015 8:20 am

Looks like Putin has caught another one:

http://intersectionproject.eu/article/r ... ican-media" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: News Headlines

Post by General Mannerheim » Mon Jun 29, 2015 2:15 pm

I cant stop reading about this Tunisia attack. sad thing is ive been saying this would happen for ages and was basically waiting for this news story to break.

first thing im doing when we go away is scoping out escape routes and hiding places! reckon just swimming out to sea might have been the best bet for some of the doomed in Tunisa? although many were elderly and immobile...

One thing tho, havent seen any children mentioned, where were all the kids? was it an adults only resort like? or are they holding back on the most sickening truths..?

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Re: News Headlines

Post by jaffka » Mon Jun 29, 2015 3:28 pm

It's quite frightening that there are some people in the world who hate us because of our nationality. It's even more worrying that some of those haters are already within our borders.

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