The middle East

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Hoboh
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The middle East

Post by Hoboh » Wed Aug 28, 2013 10:06 pm

Thought it might be better to post in here about Syria, Egypt etc than hijack the angry thread.

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Re: The middle East

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:42 am

Not as hot this summer in the Middle East. Still too hot mind :|

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Re: The middle East

Post by Hoboh » Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:36 am

I think it's heading towards a few degrees hotter shortly.

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Re: The middle East

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:52 am

I hope they behave. There is an airbase not far from my house. There are supposed to be some RAF Typhoons there. I don't fancy having some scuds flung this way :shock:

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Re: The middle East

Post by mummywhycantieatcrayons » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:25 am

http://www.theonion.com/articles/so-wha ... -be,33662/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I never make the effort to follow foreign conflicts in the detail that is required to have even a half-informed view, but this does seem to sum the problem up perfectly.
Last edited by mummywhycantieatcrayons on Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The middle East

Post by thebish » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:32 am

there are many who believe that the US has used chemical weapons on more than one occasion in Iraq...

and surely there are none of us who don't believe that the US has stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons not open for inspection by UN inspection teams...

it's clearly a red line over which a nation must not be allowed to step unpunished...

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/200 ... 5/usa.iraq
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Re: The middle East

Post by Hoboh » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:37 am

thebish wrote:there are many who believe that the US has used chemical weapons on more than one occasion in Iraq...

and surely there are none of us who don't believe that the US has stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons not open for inspection by UN inspection teams...

it's clearly a red line over which a nation must not be allowed to step unpunished...

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/200 ... 5/usa.iraq
Depleted uranium was the weapon of choice in Iraq if I remember correctly.

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Re: The middle East

Post by thebish » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:43 am

Hoboh wrote:
thebish wrote:there are many who believe that the US has used chemical weapons on more than one occasion in Iraq...

and surely there are none of us who don't believe that the US has stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons not open for inspection by UN inspection teams...

it's clearly a red line over which a nation must not be allowed to step unpunished...

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/200 ... 5/usa.iraq
Depleted uranium was the weapon of choice in Iraq if I remember correctly.
and - if these claims are to be believed - napalm and white phosphorus
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Re: The middle East

Post by Hoboh » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:49 am

thebish wrote:
Hoboh wrote:
thebish wrote:there are many who believe that the US has used chemical weapons on more than one occasion in Iraq...

and surely there are none of us who don't believe that the US has stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons not open for inspection by UN inspection teams...

it's clearly a red line over which a nation must not be allowed to step unpunished...

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/200 ... 5/usa.iraq
Depleted uranium was the weapon of choice in Iraq if I remember correctly.
and - if these claims are to be believed - napalm and white phosphorus
I know where your coming from bish it's the whole two faced aspect that really is chilling or put another way;

When is a chemical weapon not a chemical weapon?

When it's used by the West!

I have no doubt that Russia used plenty of murky weapons in Chechnya but we never nor are likely to find out about them.

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Re: The middle East

Post by William the White » Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:37 am

David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?

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Re: The middle East

Post by mummywhycantieatcrayons » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:16 pm

William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
Will - I am significantly less clued-up here than you - the fantasy of international law has never been my thing.

But is a UN resolution possible if Russia and China are allied to the bad guys?
Prufrock wrote: Like money hasn't always talked. You might not like it, or disagree, but it's the truth. It's a basic incentive, people always have, and always will want what's best for themselves and their families

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Re: The middle East

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:25 pm

William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
Question is, will he vote that way. Parliament is full of MPs that say one thing and do another.

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Re: The middle East

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:28 pm

mummywhycantieatcrayons wrote:
William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
Will - I am significantly less clued-up here than you - the fantasy of international law has never been my thing.

But is a UN resolution possible if Russia and China are allied to the bad guys?
Unlikely. Russia have a veto, meaning they can stop a resolution even if everyone else agrees to it. For Libya they abstained from the vote, which would be the best we could hope for in this case. Given their alliance with Syria it is unlikely they'll agree to anything, which may or may not be a good thing depending what Obama and his pals try to get through.

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Re: The middle East

Post by Bruce Rioja » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:28 pm

William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
This might be of interest to you then, William.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/106 ... an_crisis/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: The middle East

Post by thebish » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:37 pm

mummywhycantieatcrayons wrote:
William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
Will - I am significantly less clued-up here than you - the fantasy of international law has never been my thing.

But is a UN resolution possible if Russia and China are allied to the bad guys?
but clued-up enough to make a judgement as to who the "bad guys" are?
Some people are like Slinkies … not really good for anything, but you can’t help smiling when you see one tumble down the stairs.

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Re: The middle East

Post by BWFC_Insane » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:53 pm

Bruce Rioja wrote:
William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
This might be of interest to you then, William.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/106 ... an_crisis/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
He's away on a family holiday but still replying to work (assumption here) emails? I'm quite impressed by that.

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Re: The middle East

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:56 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Bruce Rioja wrote:
William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
This might be of interest to you then, William.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/106 ... an_crisis/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
He's away on a family holiday but still replying to work (assumption here) emails? I'm quite impressed by that.
No doubt on his iPhone/Blackberry. Fairly normal in the business world these days. Good on him, but I wouldn't say it was impressive.

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Re: The middle East

Post by mummywhycantieatcrayons » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:57 pm

thebish wrote:
mummywhycantieatcrayons wrote:
William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
Will - I am significantly less clued-up here than you - the fantasy of international law has never been my thing.

But is a UN resolution possible if Russia and China are allied to the bad guys?
but clued-up enough to make a judgement as to who the "bad guys" are?
No, but a UN resolution would presume the existence of some bad guys, wouldn't it - I'm just talking hypothetically.
Prufrock wrote: Like money hasn't always talked. You might not like it, or disagree, but it's the truth. It's a basic incentive, people always have, and always will want what's best for themselves and their families

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Re: The middle East

Post by thebish » Thu Aug 29, 2013 12:59 pm

mummywhycantieatcrayons wrote:
thebish wrote:
mummywhycantieatcrayons wrote:
William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
Will - I am significantly less clued-up here than you - the fantasy of international law has never been my thing.

But is a UN resolution possible if Russia and China are allied to the bad guys?
but clued-up enough to make a judgement as to who the "bad guys" are?
No, but a UN resolution would presume the existence of some bad guys, wouldn't it - I'm just talking hypothetically.
yes - there are bad guys - both sides... Russia and China are no more allied to the bad guys than the UK or the US are...
Some people are like Slinkies … not really good for anything, but you can’t help smiling when you see one tumble down the stairs.

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Re: The middle East

Post by mummywhycantieatcrayons » Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:03 pm

thebish wrote:
mummywhycantieatcrayons wrote:
thebish wrote:
mummywhycantieatcrayons wrote:
William the White wrote:David Crausby has replied to my email saying:

My instincts are to oppose any military intervention in Syria, and I absolutely believe the world should take no action without a United Nations resolution.

I'm glad he's taken this position - perhaps constituents of our other MPs could check out their position?
Will - I am significantly less clued-up here than you - the fantasy of international law has never been my thing.

But is a UN resolution possible if Russia and China are allied to the bad guys?
but clued-up enough to make a judgement as to who the "bad guys" are?
No, but a UN resolution would presume the existence of some bad guys, wouldn't it - I'm just talking hypothetically.
yes - there are bad guys - both sides... Russia and China are no more allied to the bad guys than the UK or the US are...
I don't have a clue!

I'm just saying, a resolution would presumably be aimed at someone.

I meant to write 'the bad guys as identified by a particular resolution'.

If Russia and China were allied to the bad guys as identified by a particular resolution, the likelihood would appear to be that a resolution would be impossible... so it seems difficult to insist on one under those circumstances.
Prufrock wrote: Like money hasn't always talked. You might not like it, or disagree, but it's the truth. It's a basic incentive, people always have, and always will want what's best for themselves and their families

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