Someone set fire to Winter Hill

[BWFC_Insane]

Without joining on to 17 quotes or an argument , a point worth considering is the fact that there is an awful lot of moorland in our country. Beyond the mindless minority who set fire to things because their tiny brains see it as fun, just how often do we have major moorland fires? ( not counting farm fires which happen but in relation to fires in general) As I see it, it's a fair old while since we had a summer of this intensity and, in my almost 79 years, I don't remember anything of this ever magnitude ever happening before- and certain ly not in this area- that needed specialised equipment to deal with it. I will stand correction as I haven't researched it.

We don't have many of this scale. But we have had others in the past twenty years like this, for example some major ones in the peak district. I have a vague recollection that one closed Manchester airport due to smoke 10 years ago or thereabouts?

We average in this country 53,000 grassland fires a year. Of course most of those are small scale as weather conditions don't encourage their spread. But it isn't that unlikely that one of those 50 odd thousand fires occurs during a hot spell. Hence why a few years back it was recognised as a national risk by government.

Having a son in California who has three times been evacuated from his home by bush fires just in his area, the ratio here seems a little less. Just saying.

Oh it is. We're still proportionally less prepared for it, though even if factoring in the lower risk of occurrence.

Probably in the South East they'd be better prepared.

Our FRS have done an absolutely amazing job to contain it. Unbelievable. Still having folk doing 17 hour shifts and relying on public handouts does not mean there isn't a problem. Forget wildfires, any sort of major incident and we're massive stretched. It simply cannot go on.

[malcd1]

Morons of the highest order. How would they like it if someone burned their house down for a laugh?

Also shameful that in 2018 Britain our fire service have to rely on handouts, and resort to begging for specialised vehicles on twitter.

What is shameful is the rubbish you talk sometimes. If the Bolton (or even North west) fire brigade had 50 all-terrain vehicles at their disposal on the off-chance of a major incident like this you would be saying what a waste of money. They would be gathering dust until they fell to bits. The fire brigade cannot have an infinity amount of vehicles lying around for every incident that may just happen.

Go and talk to the firemen (when they're not fighting this thing) and ask them if they are even barely adequately resourced.....

Have you spoken to them? Do you know how much they've been decimated in the last decade. Perhaps you should investigate before calling someone's more informed view "rubbish".

Yes I know a few firefighters from my line of work and the fact you call them 'firemen' shows your knowledge is from watching repeats of Fireman Sam. I'm not saying they are haven't had their budget cut or would prefer more firefighters but you said it was shameful that the fire brigade have to rely on handouts and begging for specialist vehicles meaning they should have loads of these all terrain vehicles at their disposal. What I am saying is you are talking bollocks. Even if their budget was doubled they still wouldn't have these specialist vehicles. The brigade wouldn't waste their money on transportation that would get equipment or water up to the top of Winter Hill over the moors that might only be used once every blue moon.

Why don't you do some research yourself and see what is on the market to get water and equipment up soft, uneven ground to almost inaccessible locations. Some of the best vehicles for that are things like tractors, which is why the fire brigade have been asking for help to get fire fighting water up there.

FFS. I'm not suggesting that Lancs or GM FRS own those vehicles. I'm suggesting that there needs to be a route to access them in case of situations like this.

I bet any money you like that should such a fire threaten areas around London those vehicles along with half the British army would be immediately deployed. And you'd not have fire services asking for the public to bring them socks!

A damning indictment of austerity and our utterly reprehensible government.

You said it was shameful that the Fire and Rescue Service had to resort to begging for specialised vehicles on twitter intimating that these vehicles were not at their immediate disposal because of underfunding. You have now said it is related to "austerity and our utterly reprehensible government". You are still talking utter bollocks.

Your true aim behind this is your hatred for the current government and having a pop at them. I am no Conservative supporter but the lack of specialist tracked access vehicles has feck all to do with funding.

The last statement from the Lancashire Fire and Rescue Service (LFRS) said that they had not asked asked for the Army to assist on Winter Hill but had not ruled it out if they needed help. So again you are wrong on this. The Army are not in charge of this situation and have no authority. If the LFRS have not asked for help then they will not be assisting. Again feck all to do with austerity.

You are a Socialist and a Labour supporter. I get that but get you facts right and stop talking out of your arse.

The fact that there is no route to access vehicles needed to manage a wildfire, something that is on both fire risk registers, and national incident risk registers, beyond begging for them on twitter isn't because we aren't adequately funding the public sector? Would our government have turned a blind eye to such a fire in the South East? No chance.

Perhaps its just because nobody gives a shit about the North burning.

Either way, fire services begging the public for socks, food and equipment is a clear and obvious measure showing a severe and dangerous lack of funding and support.

As for LLS and his insult. It entirely reflects the sort of angry, aggressive, unpleasant, misery you are. Please do not respond to any of my further posts as it is a waste of both our times. I have no interest in discussing anything with such an unpleasant character.

If you had come onto this thread and said due to cuts in funding we don't have enough firefighters in the north west to fight this fire on our own, you would be correct. I wouldn't have commented or might even have agreed with you. You decided though to spread you political bias on this forum on the wrong issues and on things you know nothing about.

I think we will leave it there.

[malcd1]

Morons of the highest order. How would they like it if someone burned their house down for a laugh?

Also shameful that in 2018 Britain our fire service have to rely on handouts, and resort to begging for specialised vehicles on twitter.

What is shameful is the rubbish you talk sometimes. If the Bolton (or even North west) fire brigade had 50 all-terrain vehicles at their disposal on the off-chance of a major incident like this you would be saying what a waste of money. They would be gathering dust until they fell to bits. The fire brigade cannot have an infinity amount of vehicles lying around for every incident that may just happen.

Go and talk to the firemen (when they're not fighting this thing) and ask them if they are even barely adequately resourced.....

Have you spoken to them? Do you know how much they've been decimated in the last decade. Perhaps you should investigate before calling someone's more informed view "rubbish".

Yes I know a few firefighters from my line of work and the fact you call them 'firemen' shows your knowledge is from watching repeats of Fireman Sam. I'm not saying they are haven't had their budget cut or would prefer more firefighters but you said it was shameful that the fire brigade have to rely on handouts and begging for specialist vehicles meaning they should have loads of these all terrain vehicles at their disposal. What I am saying is you are talking bollocks. Even if their budget was doubled they still wouldn't have these specialist vehicles. The brigade wouldn't waste their money on transportation that would get equipment or water up to the top of Winter Hill over the moors that might only be used once every blue moon.

Why don't you do some research yourself and see what is on the market to get water and equipment up soft, uneven ground to almost inaccessible locations. Some of the best vehicles for that are things like tractors, which is why the fire brigade have been asking for help to get fire fighting water up there.

FFS. I'm not suggesting that Lancs or GM FRS own those vehicles. I'm suggesting that there needs to be a route to access them in case of situations like this.

I bet any money you like that should such a fire threaten areas around London those vehicles along with half the British army would be immediately deployed. And you'd not have fire services asking for the public to bring them socks!

A damning indictment of austerity and our utterly reprehensible government.

You said it was shameful that the Fire and Rescue Service had to resort to begging for specialised vehicles on twitter intimating that these vehicles were not at their immediate disposal because of underfunding. You have now said it is related to "austerity and our utterly reprehensible government". You are still talking utter bollocks.

Your true aim behind this is your hatred for the current government and having a pop at them. I am no Conservative supporter but the lack of specialist tracked access vehicles has feck all to do with funding.

The last statement from the Lancashire Fire and Rescue Service (LFRS) said that they had not asked asked for the Army to assist on Winter Hill but had not ruled it out if they needed help. So again you are wrong on this. The Army are not in charge of this situation and have no authority. If the LFRS have not asked for help then they will not be assisting. Again feck all to do with austerity.

You are a Socialist and a Labour supporter. I get that but get you facts right and stop talking out of your arse.

The fact that there is no route to access vehicles needed to manage a wildfire, something that is on both fire risk registers, and national incident risk registers, beyond begging for them on twitter isn't because we aren't adequately funding the public sector? Would our government have turned a blind eye to such a fire in the South East? No chance.

Perhaps its just because nobody gives a shit about the North burning.

Either way, fire services begging the public for socks, food and equipment is a clear and obvious measure showing a severe and dangerous lack of funding and support.

As for LLS and his insult. It entirely reflects the sort of angry, aggressive, unpleasant, misery you are. Please do not respond to any of my further posts as it is a waste of both our times. I have no interest in discussing anything with such an unpleasant character.

If you had come onto this thread and said due to cuts in funding we don't have enough firefighters in the north west to fight this fire on our own, you would be correct. I wouldn't have commented or might even have agreed with you. You decided though to spread your political bias on this forum on the wrong issues and on things you know nothing about.

I think we will leave it there.

[Dujon]

Ruddy heck.
Why oh why do some posters quote quote on quote on quote ... ? You're wearing out my expensive monitor you morons (Well I had to throw in some sort of insult in order to join this rather strange 'discussion' did I not'?).

[Montreal Wanderer]

Ruddy heck.
Why oh why do some posters quote quote on quote on quote ... ? You're wearing out my expensive monitor you morons (Well I had to throw in some sort of insult in order to join this rather strange 'discussion' did I not'?).

And a fair suck of the sav to you, cobber.

[malcd1]

Ruddy heck.
Why oh why do some posters quote quote on quote on quote ... ? You're wearing out my expensive monitor you morons (Well I had to throw in some sort of insult in order to join this rather strange 'discussion' did I not'?).

And a fair suck of the sav to you, cobber.

My apologises.

[malcd1]

Ruddy heck.
Why oh why do some posters quote quote on quote on quote ... ? You're wearing out my expensive monitor you morons (Well I had to throw in some sort of insult in order to join this rather strange 'discussion' did I not'?).

And a fair suck of the sav to you, cobber.

My apologises.

Crap. I've done it again.

[TANGODANCER]

Still hard to get my head around the fact that some mindless oafs can cause all this chaos and damage willingly and get away with it. What happened to law and order? Offenders have no fear of the law any more. Community service and fines that never get paid are laughable as punishments to clowns who know our almost non-existent police forces are facing mission impossible trying to catch them. The whole bag of snakes needs a massive shake up.

[Dujon]

Don't worry about it Malc, it was only a gentle poke and not directed individually to you.

TANGO, arsonists are not confined to NW England. We've got (far too many) of them here, as I am sure your son in CA would confirm in his state. As far as I'm concerned those people are mentally deranged and should, when caught (and a lot of them here are), become inmates of some sort of asylum. Perhaps, being an ex-member of what is now called the Rural Fire Service (RFS), I might be somewhat biased.

I cannot comment on what action your law enforcement and Fire and Rescue organisations take under these conditions, but here investigations are prompt and efficient and are taken very seriously if there's a hint of firebug involvement. The RFS and our F&RS cooperate with forensic teams and liaise with the police and other services such as ambulance and hospitals. Of course not all fires can be laid at the feet of arsonists, many are natural (e.g. lightning) or mechanical (e.g. trains and, in the case of grass fires, farming equipment) or sheer carelessness (e.g. campfires not extinguished and some idiot tossing his fag out of a car window).

Sorry, that's a bit of a rant, but deliberate ignition in a fire prone area really makes me angry. As you know I run a couple of weather websites. On one I have a statement: Dobbing in an arsonist is not dobbing in a mate.