Administration and recovery

[Gary the Enfield]

https://talksport.com/football/efl/5748 ... -mess-pfa/

^^ Interview with Gordon Taylor, that has been referred to on social media today. Can't see it posted on here, apologies if it has been...

He's not sounding at all confident.

He's a Bolton fan iirc

[BWFC_Insane]

Anyone who seriously thinks we can even have a stab at staying up this season is either a ridiculous optimist or not really following what is going on.

We could quite soon have no senior players on the books 2 weeks out from the season starting. And IF FV take over less than 2 weeks to assemble a squad from scratch get it fit and ready for the season with -12 points and likely one of the lowest wage budgets in the league.

We're going to find out what life is like in league 2 quite quickly. But that is ok if we still have a football club to watch.

[Prufrock]

Gordon Taylor’s wound me right up. It’s the demands of his fckin members (and their agents) that are partly responsible for the whole mess football outside the prem is in! All he gives a shit about is losing 1/92 of his organisations income next season. How about pitching up with a solution dickhead! Or keep ya trap shut!

BWFCST at it again as well. Pestering the admin team when they have nothing of value (high net worth individuals anyone?) to add. I know the model worked for others but our guys don’t have a pot to piss in, and just specialise in rubbing everyone up the wrong way. Stick to yer meetings fuelled by werthers, dinosaurs!

Gordon Taylor saying "they're not football people" was the bit that irritated me. They aren't. But what does it matter? In a year if they're clueless and pissing around and haven't appointed a suitable football expert then sure. But now what matters is their business acumen.

Same.

I think the people in this town have had enough of 'football people'.

[BWFC_Insane]

Gordon Taylor’s wound me right up. It’s the demands of his fckin members (and their agents) that are partly responsible for the whole mess football outside the prem is in! All he gives a shit about is losing 1/92 of his organisations income next season. How about pitching up with a solution dickhead! Or keep ya trap shut!

BWFCST at it again as well. Pestering the admin team when they have nothing of value (high net worth individuals anyone?) to add. I know the model worked for others but our guys don’t have a pot to piss in, and just specialise in rubbing everyone up the wrong way. Stick to yer meetings fuelled by werthers, dinosaurs!

Gordon Taylor saying "they're not football people" was the bit that irritated me. They aren't. But what does it matter? In a year if they're clueless and pissing around and haven't appointed a suitable football expert then sure. But now what matters is their business acumen.

Same.

I think the people in this town have had enough of 'football people'.

ED and PG weren't "football people".

How about City's owners? Or Liverpool's?

Utter nonsense. "I'll go to FIFA". I wish you fecking would Gordon - you'd fit in well there.

[bristol_Wanderer3]

The latest summary of the situation from the BEN....

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/1 ... g-quickly/

The potential involvement of Al Hasawi is interesting. Normally he would provoke retching close to the level of Bassini, but whatever the level of incompetence he became known for during his stewardship of Forest, there was never any doubt as to the depth of his pockets, unlike Bassini.

I struggle not to see the link between KA, KA appointed admins, joker delaying and confusing the whole process, and liquidation of BWFC, but any hail mary option when in this predicament is worth noting.

[Prufrock]

Gordon Taylor’s wound me right up. It’s the demands of his fckin members (and their agents) that are partly responsible for the whole mess football outside the prem is in! All he gives a shit about is losing 1/92 of his organisations income next season. How about pitching up with a solution dickhead! Or keep ya trap shut!

BWFCST at it again as well. Pestering the admin team when they have nothing of value (high net worth individuals anyone?) to add. I know the model worked for others but our guys don’t have a pot to piss in, and just specialise in rubbing everyone up the wrong way. Stick to yer meetings fuelled by werthers, dinosaurs!

Gordon Taylor saying "they're not football people" was the bit that irritated me. They aren't. But what does it matter? In a year if they're clueless and pissing around and haven't appointed a suitable football expert then sure. But now what matters is their business acumen.

Same.

I think the people in this town have had enough of 'football people'.

ED and PG weren't "football people".

How about City's owners? Or Liverpool's?

Utter nonsense. "I'll go to FIFA". I wish you fecking would Gordon - you'd fit in well there.

And as importantly, the Andersons and Mr Holdsworth most certainly were football people.

I'll take money people, who know not to get payday loans and aren't spivving it all off in consultancy fees, ta v much.

[Prufrock]

The latest summary of the situation from the BEN....

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/1 ... g-quickly/

The potential involvement of Al Hasawi is interesting. Normally he would provoke retching close to the level of Bassini, but whatever the level of incompetence he became known for during his stewardship of Forest, there was never any doubt as to the depth of his pockets, unlike Bassini.

I struggle not to see the link between KA, KA appointed admins, joker delaying and confusing the whole process, and liquidation of BWFC, but any hail mary option when in this predicament is worth noting.

Understand where you're coming from. I don't want any money bags benefactor anywhere near the club (unless they're a Bolton fan, and let's be honest, they person doesn't exist). Not enough spots in the Prem and when they inevitably get bored you're screwed.

I'd like a Stanley-esque fan with business sense. Run it all within our means.

That means our ceiling is almost certainly top of League 1/bottom of Champ (and that not for some time) but the Championship isn't sustainable. We aren't going to be the last club in this situation.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Nodding along with most of this, especially the idea of our own Andy Holt. One point:

For me at the moment the best case probable scenario is us getting a takeover done eventually and having a bloody hard battle staying up. We can forget about building any sort of team. What that does for future finances god only knows, and we may be back in the same position in another 12 months.

If we're in for the lower-division long haul (or Pompey-style bounceback) then hopefully that presents a much clearer path to the first team for our esteemed Academy.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

The potential involvement of Al Hasawi is interesting. Normally he would provoke retching close to the level of Bassini, but whatever the level of incompetence he became known for during his stewardship of Forest, there was never any doubt as to the depth of his pockets, unlike Bassini.

I struggle not to see the link between KA, KA appointed admins, joker delaying and confusing the whole process, and liquidation of BWFC, but any hail mary option when in this predicament is worth noting.

Usual caveats about Nixon, who rather humiliated himself with his pro-Bassini manopause, but he's making the case for Fawaz:

Is there realistically anyone waiting in the wings if / when FV stop wasting everyone's time? Or is it liquidation time?
The Fawaz chap.
Was Fawaz one of the unsuccessful bidders during admin ?? Or did he not try ?
Was fighting a legal case at time of bids. Had looked to buy club before that. Been over. Looked round. Couldn’t get a figure off the previous owner. Moved on.
Bur surely once it went into Administration it was up to him to make a bid if he was still interested, in the sure knowledge that it would be less than any fee had it been put forward by Anderson ?
Was having a legal battle with Forest at time. Been sniffing round it again for three weeks ...
Not a multi-tasker then. I suppose all we can do now is wait and see
Is this really the time to be choosy?
How long are FV going to get to finish the deal ?
Down to the administrators how long they get to do deals with the people who are owed money ... going on way too long.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

(For Bruce: Nixon tweets "A quick look at the sales prospectus shows the club owes the hotel about 800k". Then Iles tweets "Creditor list on the Bolton Whites Hotel administrator report states hotel owes club just over £1.2million".)

Nixon.jpg (41.96 KiB) Viewed 2096 times

Iles.jpg (28.21 KiB) Viewed 2096 times

[Lost Leopard Spot]

You're beginning to see the public reveal behind the circularity I've mentioned...

There is no mythical pot of money in a bank account equating to £25million. There is merely a downpayment on the plans with credit notes all over the place. Some of those credit notes lead back to money that is owed, but is also part of funds guaranteed. Some of those guarantees disappear when the money owed to A is also money A owes to B.

[Worthy4England]

(For Bruce: Nixon tweets "A quick look at the sales prospectus shows the club owes the hotel about 800k". Then Iles tweets "Creditor list on the Bolton Whites Hotel administrator report states hotel owes club just over £1.2million".)

Nixon.jpg
Iles.jpg

What a wicked web we weave...

[BWFC_Insane]

Nixon's surprise about the club owing the hotel money - yet that has been widely discussed for weeks. The surprise is that the hotel owes the club more.....

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Nixon's surprise about the club owing the hotel money - yet that has been widely discussed for weeks. The surprise is that the hotel owes the club more.....

So ask yourself this question: why would FV (who according to you) have a proven vast stash of dosh, insist on buying the hotel as part of the deal for buying the club, when the hotel owes more money to the club than the club owes to the hotel? Surely according to you they will be merely reducing the amount of money they have to spend by insisting on that!

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Have I mentioned this circularity before? I can't remember.

[Worthy4England]

Nixon's surprise about the club owing the hotel money - yet that has been widely discussed for weeks. The surprise is that the hotel owes the club more.....

Quite - that'd be a Club not paying players. There's probably a timing thing here though - Club lends hotel, hotel then becomes unable to pay back Club at a future date from the loan.

I don't think the fact that there's been some related company transactions going on is particularly noteworthy.

[LeverEnd]

Have I mentioned this circularity before? I can't remember.

You should screenshot it, then post with the comment 'Aye' and a winking emoji!

[BWFC_Insane]

I have never ever once claimed FV have a huge stash of cash. What I've said is clear - they have proven existence of cash to pay of creditors to an amount deemed satisfactory by the administrators. That cash is required up front (or where deals made over a period of time). Nobody else who bid for the club could prove that to administrators satisfaction whereas FV could.

That does not mean that a) creditors are all happy with that amount or b) that they have "enough" cash left to run the club. But enough will depend on their plan...and so.....

The reason FV cannot proceed without the hotel actually has nothing to do with the administrator. It is down to football regulations requiring FV to show a business plan detailing how they will cover losses over the next two years based on financial projection and past club financial performance. This business plan that FV submitted was approved by the EFL - BUT that business plan clearly involved FV owning the hotel. Nobody knows whether that was to run the hotel and generate income - convert it into another business that generates income, sell it and capitalise the club, or lease out the hotel's operation to one of the interested chains...or something else. Whatever it was that FV proposed was approved by the EFL and would be required as part of the change of control process. However, given the hotel is still in a process where no preferred bidder has been identified the situation is that said business plan cannot be signed off by the EFL. So the EFL cannot sign off on CoC.

That is explained in the administrator statement from Wednesday evening.

There seems to be an expectation that we will get an owner who has the funds to underwrite a 5/6/7M loss every season on an ongoing basis. I would suggest were such a person or group anywhere near the process they'd have their feet under the table already. Given FV are proposing a commercial plan (approved by EFL) it would not exactly be a stretch to suggest that all bids did in fact involve something similar or the hotel. I happen to know the details of one such "plan" from a rival bidder that I am not prepared to share on here. But certainly it involved being able to purchase the hotel. And had that plan been successful (and in my view thank god it was not) - but had it been we'd still have been in this position - probably worse because Michael James would be owed a lot of money across the two businesses as a secured creditor and therefore said plan would almost certainly leave the club in a far worse position financially once said deal completed.

[Schmarrnbeppi]

Hi,

I'm a Sunderland fan alerted to this thread via the readytogo message board. Just wanted to sign up and offer support for your situation. My first away game was at Bolton in the late 90s and I had a great time, not just the football but in the town and in the pubs (despite not being old enough to drink). Its a ridiculous state of affairs that it has got to the stage where you are now and I sincerely hope it sorts itself out for you. We would hate to see Bolton disappear. You are a proper club and would be missed. Anyway, not much to add as i don't know fully what the current status is but good luck for the season ahead and for resolving whatever the owners/new owners are managing to cock up so massively.

P.s. Jay Jay Okocha was class.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Have I mentioned this circularity before? I can't remember.

You should screenshot it, then post with the comment 'Aye' and a winking emoji!

Aye.