Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Gooner Girl » Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:01 pm

Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 10:22 pm
Gooner Girl wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:25 pm
Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:21 pm
Gooner Girl wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:05 pm
Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:53 pm

Not at all. It's more wind and rain than cold here. Out of the times I've felt really cold in the last couple of decades, 2 of the standouts were the away end at Fulham. The fact that we're consistently dire there may have a psychological effect :)
I’ve seen you win there! Admittedly it was back in 2007 but a cracking good game!
I saw us win there too. It was the cup and I just wanted either team to score so I wouldn't have to endure extra time. Unfortunately we waited for extra time to score. To add insult to injury the beer ran out at half time as I got to the front of the queue. The tube was screwed up that night which meant I missed pre match pints and I didn't get home until well after midnight. Shit nigh despite winning :evil:
Were we at the same match? Al Habsi had a stormer in goal? That was an extra time winner in the league cup. You can’t have had too many of them at Fulham!
Probably the same evening. Wasn't many in the ground. GtE was there and my Bolton supporting Spanish mate was in tow
Aye. Bish too. Got a vague feeling we may have been introduced. But it was about 13 years ago! :shock:

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Gooner Girl » Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:05 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:50 pm
Gooner Girl wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:36 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:21 pm
Gooner Girl wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:18 pm


I don’t even think you can blame the ‘club’. It’s made up of many parts and I’m pretty sure the fans, players, manager and staff at the clubs had nothing to do with this. It has greedy owners written on it all the way through.
I don’t blame the fans hence you posted about enjoying Fulham away. The club have shafted you. And yes it’s the owners making these decisions. But anyone who chooses to be employed by them and represent Arsenal for me take some blame. They could all have walked out en masse this morning. They really need to show some spine here.

I’ve been to Fulham at least 4 times now? Always to watch you lot. Unless you have an Arsenal season ticket (and I’m silver membership, the next level down) then you don’t have much chance of attending away games.

I gather there was a talk/question and answer at training today for the Arsenal players on the new super league and why Arsenal had chosen to be in it. Perhaps clubs have heard overwhelmingly negative feedback from players today about it but maybe this is being done privately and players aren’t going to break rank and slag off their employers publicly just yet?

As I say, I’m pissed off but not unduly worried yet because I don’t think it will go ahead.

Who do you think will stop it? These clubs don’t care about their fans. They don’t care about football or the competition. The clubs are the owners and are simply fuelled by greed. Pure and simple greed. I don’t see how it’s stopped though I do think all clubs should have been chucked out of all domestic and European competitions this morning. Only a tough stance might resolve this in the long run.
I actually think there will be a big backlash from the players and managers. I think they have more power to stop it then the fans do (sadly) and if UEFA and the FA stand firm on their threats that should be enough.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Burnden Paddock » Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:17 pm

Gooner Girl wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:05 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:50 pm
Gooner Girl wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:36 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:21 pm
Gooner Girl wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2021 8:18 pm


I don’t even think you can blame the ‘club’. It’s made up of many parts and I’m pretty sure the fans, players, manager and staff at the clubs had nothing to do with this. It has greedy owners written on it all the way through.
I don’t blame the fans hence you posted about enjoying Fulham away. The club have shafted you. And yes it’s the owners making these decisions. But anyone who chooses to be employed by them and represent Arsenal for me take some blame. They could all have walked out en masse this morning. They really need to show some spine here.

I’ve been to Fulham at least 4 times now? Always to watch you lot. Unless you have an Arsenal season ticket (and I’m silver membership, the next level down) then you don’t have much chance of attending away games.

I gather there was a talk/question and answer at training today for the Arsenal players on the new super league and why Arsenal had chosen to be in it. Perhaps clubs have heard overwhelmingly negative feedback from players today about it but maybe this is being done privately and players aren’t going to break rank and slag off their employers publicly just yet?

As I say, I’m pissed off but not unduly worried yet because I don’t think it will go ahead.

Who do you think will stop it? These clubs don’t care about their fans. They don’t care about football or the competition. The clubs are the owners and are simply fuelled by greed. Pure and simple greed. I don’t see how it’s stopped though I do think all clubs should have been chucked out of all domestic and European competitions this morning. Only a tough stance might resolve this in the long run.
I actually think there will be a big backlash from the players and managers. I think they have more power to stop it then the fans do (sadly) and if UEFA and the FA stand firm on their threats that should be enough.

Good to see Klopp and Milner make a start this evening. If it does come off, then I expect we may see a few managerial changes between now and then.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:03 am

Milner made a stand. However, Klopp was mealy mouthed and more concerned with being angry at Gary Neville (who has only spoken the truth) and defending his own position. Klopp has been outspoken about the problems of a super league in the past but for me last night he wanted to play the victim. Everyone knows it’s the owners but if you choose to carry on taking their money and representing their business you have to take the flak associated with that. Especially when you seem unable to criticise your paymasters directly. That doesn’t look good. I think he will have lost a lot of support following his weak and inconsistent stance last night.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Gooner Girl » Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:37 am

Bit harsh on Klopp there, he will have been told if he’s nothing positive to say, to say nothing no doubt, and he’s broken ranks enough to say he still doesn’t like the idea. I think abuse of the Liverpool players by Leeds fans a bit unfair, the players and managers likely found out about this not a lot before the fans, if at all. It’s the boards and owners that the anger needs to be directed at right now.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:50 am

Gooner Girl wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:37 am
Bit harsh on Klopp there, he will have been told if he’s nothing positive to say, to say nothing no doubt, and he’s broken ranks enough to say he still doesn’t like the idea. I think abuse of the Liverpool players by Leeds fans a bit unfair, the players and managers likely found out about this not a lot before the fans, if at all. It’s the boards and owners that the anger needs to be directed at right now.
You can’t disassociate owners from clubs completely. When Bolton’s last owner behaved appallingly it was the club who was punished and not him. And I didn’t see football screaming about how unfair it was on ‘the club and it’s fans’. In fact quite the opposite. I find it a bit falling how Klopp’s main issue was not taking it out on Liverpool. I mean I get he didn’t instigate this but what does he expect? If he really really feels strongly there he could resign on principle.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:11 am

I doubt any bugger would resign until they have more details. Other Prem League teams meet today. I'm hoping, but not expecting some spine to be shown by the Prem, UEFA and some of the governing bodies. They should start with the League Cup final, but they probably won't. Parky didn't immediately walk out when players weren't getting paid, he tried to arbitrate first...

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:19 am

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:11 am
I doubt any bugger would resign until they have more details. Other Prem League teams meet today. I'm hoping, but not expecting some spine to be shown by the Prem, UEFA and some of the governing bodies. They should start with the League Cup final, but they probably won't. Parky didn't immediately walk out when players weren't getting paid, he tried to arbitrate first...
Parky stayed out of loyalty to the players. Which I admire. Would have been easy for him to walk as he wasn’t being paid at times either.

I think the situations are somewhat different. Not that I necessarily expect Klopp to have resigned I merely don’t agree with him that owners can be totally disassociated from clubs. He stood there representing them. That’s his choice. And nobody was giving him flak. But it’s of course right that Liverpool football club is given flak.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Gooner Girl » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:21 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:19 am
Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:11 am
I doubt any bugger would resign until they have more details. Other Prem League teams meet today. I'm hoping, but not expecting some spine to be shown by the Prem, UEFA and some of the governing bodies. They should start with the League Cup final, but they probably won't. Parky didn't immediately walk out when players weren't getting paid, he tried to arbitrate first...
Parky stayed out of loyalty to the players. Which I admire. Would have been easy for him to walk as he wasn’t being paid at times either.

I think the situations are somewhat different. Not that I necessarily expect Klopp to have resigned I merely don’t agree with him that owners can be totally disassociated from clubs. He stood there representing them. That’s his choice. And nobody was giving him flak. But it’s of course right that Liverpool football club is given flak.
Would you find it fair if you were hauled up in work and given stick for something your boss had done without you knowing that you didn’t approve of?

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:54 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:19 am
Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:11 am
I doubt any bugger would resign until they have more details. Other Prem League teams meet today. I'm hoping, but not expecting some spine to be shown by the Prem, UEFA and some of the governing bodies. They should start with the League Cup final, but they probably won't. Parky didn't immediately walk out when players weren't getting paid, he tried to arbitrate first...
Parky stayed out of loyalty to the players. Which I admire. Would have been easy for him to walk as he wasn’t being paid at times either.

I think the situations are somewhat different. Not that I necessarily expect Klopp to have resigned I merely don’t agree with him that owners can be totally disassociated from clubs. He stood there representing them. That’s his choice. And nobody was giving him flak. But it’s of course right that Liverpool football club is given flak.
It's never easy to resign on the spot (have you ever done it? with no forward plan?). What's become fairly clear to me is the managers and players seemed to hear about it the same time as we did so they need thinking time too. I don't think you can at all disassociate the owner from the Club. The fact that these Clubs can compete at the top is largely down to owners (and boards) steering them in a particular course over the years. Klopp (as Tuchel) did the job he's paid to do (by the company run by the other people who made a decision) - manage a football team - he's not paid to make decisions on whether there's a Super League or not. In time, I'm sure he'll come to his own conclusions.

He did what I'd do for my team at work (and you'd hope any manager would do) - try and airgap them from something that's occurred outside their sphere of control or influence, whilst working out which way is up.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:01 am

Gooner Girl wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:21 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:19 am
Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:11 am
I doubt any bugger would resign until they have more details. Other Prem League teams meet today. I'm hoping, but not expecting some spine to be shown by the Prem, UEFA and some of the governing bodies. They should start with the League Cup final, but they probably won't. Parky didn't immediately walk out when players weren't getting paid, he tried to arbitrate first...
Parky stayed out of loyalty to the players. Which I admire. Would have been easy for him to walk as he wasn’t being paid at times either.

I think the situations are somewhat different. Not that I necessarily expect Klopp to have resigned I merely don’t agree with him that owners can be totally disassociated from clubs. He stood there representing them. That’s his choice. And nobody was giving him flak. But it’s of course right that Liverpool football club is given flak.
Would you find it fair if you were hauled up in work and given stick for something your boss had done without you knowing that you didn’t approve of?
That happens every single day in every workplace. The difference here is nobody is saying that its Klopp's fault. Merely that the clubs and owners can't be separated. You can't say Liverpool are great but their owners are awful whilst Liverpool as a club continue to take the money offered by their owners. And the action open to Klopp is to resign - if he chooses to. If he doesn't then he has to accept the club as a whole is branded right now. Everyone knows its the actions of owners BUT clubs are owners and owners are clubs in the legal and business sense. I didn't hear anyone a fuss made at clubs where owners leave them in administration - we have to take the punishment for years even after the owner has left. Even though the players, manager, fans and the like had nothing to do with it. Are you saying big clubs should be so privileged that their owners and their actions are disassociated from the club and consequences (except for their ongoing funding of the club) yet smaller clubs are right to be punished for what their owners did to them?

What's happening is the fans of these clubs and fans up and down the country are being shafted by the owners of 6 football clubs. But these 6 clubs have not just done this - this has been building for decades and is a result of greed at the top of the game. Its not a brand new thing and the clubs as a whole have not exactly turned down the cash injections or foreign investments. The culture around British football is to blame as much as anything. The only reason these clubs need more money is because they do the very thing people scoff at Bolton, Blackburn, Wigan, Stoke for doing - they spend a LOT of money to try and stay in the gravy boat of the top 4. And when they slip up they tend to spend more to get back in. And what they want is that money guaranteed - and in their control. But they've not exactly been supportive when smaller clubs have struggled for the same reasons. So I do find I have absolutely no sympathy for anyone apart from the fans in these scenarios. Players and their agents and their increasing wage demands, managers spending hundreds of millions then saying they need more, owners wanting to protect their investments and reduce competition - they've all contributed to this.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:07 am

Oh. Don't be mistaken. I think the Clubs should be punished. Punitively as possible. But Klopp or Tuchel can't take that decision either. It's time for governing bodies to stand up and be counted.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:14 am

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:07 am
Oh. Don't be mistaken. I think the Clubs should be punished. Punitively as possible. But Klopp or Tuchel can't take that decision either. It's time for governing bodies to stand up and be counted.
I think we're more or less on the same page. I just found Klopp's comments a bit rich. Trying to play the victim (perhaps he's learned from his fans?) rather than just saying 'I don't agree with it but I have a job to do'. Milner was better - a categoric - this is a terrible idea statement. Guess Milner hasn't got much to lose.

But they should be punished for me - I really hope UEFA carries through its threats and accelerates them - players shouldn't be allowed to compete in internationals from these clubs unless the clubs rescind their decision - that should be immediate. Clubs should be removed from all leagues and cups with immediate effect. I do think this action is the only way to stop this and prevent these 6 running roughshod over the rest. From there see what they want to do.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Gooner Girl » Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:33 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:01 am
Gooner Girl wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:21 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:19 am
Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:11 am
I doubt any bugger would resign until they have more details. Other Prem League teams meet today. I'm hoping, but not expecting some spine to be shown by the Prem, UEFA and some of the governing bodies. They should start with the League Cup final, but they probably won't. Parky didn't immediately walk out when players weren't getting paid, he tried to arbitrate first...
Parky stayed out of loyalty to the players. Which I admire. Would have been easy for him to walk as he wasn’t being paid at times either.

I think the situations are somewhat different. Not that I necessarily expect Klopp to have resigned I merely don’t agree with him that owners can be totally disassociated from clubs. He stood there representing them. That’s his choice. And nobody was giving him flak. But it’s of course right that Liverpool football club is given flak.
Would you find it fair if you were hauled up in work and given stick for something your boss had done without you knowing that you didn’t approve of?
That happens every single day in every workplace. The difference here is nobody is saying that its Klopp's fault. Merely that the clubs and owners can't be separated. You can't say Liverpool are great but their owners are awful whilst Liverpool as a club continue to take the money offered by their owners. And the action open to Klopp is to resign - if he chooses to. If he doesn't then he has to accept the club as a whole is branded right now. Everyone knows its the actions of owners BUT clubs are owners and owners are clubs in the legal and business sense. I didn't hear anyone a fuss made at clubs where owners leave them in administration - we have to take the punishment for years even after the owner has left. Even though the players, manager, fans and the like had nothing to do with it. Are you saying big clubs should be so privileged that their owners and their actions are disassociated from the club and consequences (except for their ongoing funding of the club) yet smaller clubs are right to be punished for what their owners did to them?

What's happening is the fans of these clubs and fans up and down the country are being shafted by the owners of 6 football clubs. But these 6 clubs have not just done this - this has been building for decades and is a result of greed at the top of the game. Its not a brand new thing and the clubs as a whole have not exactly turned down the cash injections or foreign investments. The culture around British football is to blame as much as anything. The only reason these clubs need more money is because they do the very thing people scoff at Bolton, Blackburn, Wigan, Stoke for doing - they spend a LOT of money to try and stay in the gravy boat of the top 4. And when they slip up they tend to spend more to get back in. And what they want is that money guaranteed - and in their control. But they've not exactly been supportive when smaller clubs have struggled for the same reasons. So I do find I have absolutely no sympathy for anyone apart from the fans in these scenarios. Players and their agents and their increasing wage demands, managers spending hundreds of millions then saying they need more, owners wanting to protect their investments and reduce competition - they've all contributed to this.

I’m not saying anything of the sort. I think you were just a bit harsh on Klopp who was clearly a bit on the back foot and may yet be more vocal/resign over this. It’s no big jump to presume that talks are going on behind the scenes with players/managers from all clubs wishing to put out some kind of statement as a united front. Just because noones ‘walked’ yet doesn’t mean they all approve or no action will be taken. That’s all I was saying.

I don’t agree with this, I think it’s a terrible idea and if FA, UEFA etc chose to sanction my club then that’s fine by me. They deserve it for being so greedy (though pot/kettle re UEFA frankly) I’ll still follow them whatever division they might end up in. You still followed your club even when they had a knob head owner/chairman?

What’s more of an interesting question, and one which I’ve not figured out yet the answer too is if say Bolton were the club doing this how would your support fare, any of you? Would you abandon them as a fan completely? Would you want to watch their games in the super league?

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:36 am

Interesting pivot on the conversation. I stopped attending games with Anderson in charge of our Club. (Different than "stopped supporting") :-) I just refused point blank to put any of my hard earned in any direction he was a part of.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Gooner Girl » Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:57 am

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:36 am
Interesting pivot on the conversation. I stopped attending games with Anderson in charge of our Club. (Different than "stopped supporting") :-) I just refused point blank to put any of my hard earned in any direction he was a part of.
Still think we are in the wrong thread to be discussing this but good for you! That shows principles. I’m not sure how strong mine are and I’m certain my children will be desperate to watch whatever they can after so long without being able to go. They won’t care what league it’s in, and in fact I read somewhere that support for the super league is more likely to come from younger fans. Jack, age 10 wouldn’t care or really understand about the logistics and morals of it all, he’d just be awed at Arsenal playing Barcelona! Not saying that’s right but I don’t suspect he’d be the only young fan thinking the same. Doesn’t mean I’d take him though.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:15 pm

Gooner Girl wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:57 am
Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:36 am
Interesting pivot on the conversation. I stopped attending games with Anderson in charge of our Club. (Different than "stopped supporting") :-) I just refused point blank to put any of my hard earned in any direction he was a part of.
Still think we are in the wrong thread to be discussing this but good for you! That shows principles. I’m not sure how strong mine are and I’m certain my children will be desperate to watch whatever they can after so long without being able to go. They won’t care what league it’s in, and in fact I read somewhere that support for the super league is more likely to come from younger fans. Jack, age 10 wouldn’t care or really understand about the logistics and morals of it all, he’d just be awed at Arsenal playing Barcelona! Not saying that’s right but I don’t suspect he’d be the only young fan thinking the same. Doesn’t mean I’d take him though.
Welcome to parenting! :-) That's part of why we're here, to try and help steer our children on moral choices they don't understand. I'm sure there'll be plenty of fans of all Clubs involved, justifying to themselves as to why it's ok to attend, their pick to be honest and that's part of what the greedy bastards are relying on, they don't have to justify themselves to me. Personally, were Bolton in the same position, I wouldn't go, because I'd want us to be there on at least a partial illusion of merit (even that merit is dubious given that most of the current CL teams buy their way to success). I'd still count myself as a supporter and look out for our results, but the greedy gits wouldn't get any more money off me.

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Harry Genshaw » Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:22 pm

Not wishing to encourage you lot to continue to post on the wrong thread :D but that's an interesting question GG. When Anderson was here, I continued to support the club but largely through the players, who were blameless and were trying their best.

If Bolton had elected to play in this super league (it's no dafter a suggestion than Spurs to be fair) then yes, I'd stop going. It would be likely I couldn't afford a ticket anyway which might help young Jack make up his mind. I'd reckon Arsenal will charge in excess of £100 for a game v Barcelona for example.

They don't need anyone to attend anyway. It's not your lad that they're targeting. It's some South Korean or Chinese Internet fan who'll pay for the TV stream, buy the kit and 'support' Arsenal while they're winning.
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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Gooner Girl » Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:32 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:22 pm
Not wishing to encourage you lot to continue to post on the wrong thread :D but that's an interesting question GG. When Anderson was here, I continued to support the club but largely through the players, who were blameless and were trying their best.

If Bolton had elected to play in this super league (it's no dafter a suggestion than Spurs to be fair) then yes, I'd stop going. It would be likely I couldn't afford a ticket anyway which might help young Jack make up his mind. I'd reckon Arsenal will charge in excess of £100 for a game v Barcelona for example.

They don't need anyone to attend anyway. It's not your lad that they're targeting. It's some South Korean or Chinese Internet fan who'll pay for the TV stream, buy the kit and 'support' Arsenal while they're winning.
We can’t beat Fulham at home!! Don’t think any glory fans will be attracted to watching us get smashed by European giants (and Spurs) every week, but I take your point and I think that’s the saddest thing about it all. Football has become such a global ‘product’ now, not helped by foreign owners, and I can’t see many ways at all in which this is a good thing for the sport. I started following properly in the 90’s and it’s changed insanely from even then, never mind what you older guys used to watch back in the 70’s and 80’s.

If Bolton got booted out the domestic league and only had the ESL would you still not go? It’s easy for me to say, ahh we will just watch us in the prem and boycott european matches, but if they kick us out and that’s all there is, that’s harder to swallow.

Anyway, I still don’t think it will happen anyway so trying not to stress about it for now!

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Re: Dulux. New Spurs sponsors

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:16 pm

Depends how it occurred. If it was entirely of our own making (as is the case with the current 12 Clubs if they were kicked out) then I wouldn't go. Football isn't THAT important to me. There's other things to do in life. It's bad enough as it is, with the financial disparity between teams - there's a strong argument for me for a wage cap (which isn't allowed, I know), but the Big 4/6/8 depending on the day of the week and where some of them are in the League, won't allow that to occur, because they have no intention of football being based on merit where they might not be the most meritorious. Of course it doesn't always work, but all you have to do is listen to DMB's bleating about City's spending. They didn't mind when they outspent every bugger. Football will eat itself, eventually.

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