5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Nicko58 » Sat Apr 01, 2017 8:27 pm

TKIZ! wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 8:15 pm
Harry Genshaw wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 7:54 pm
We certainly missed Madine but missed Taylor too. A midfield of Spearing, Pratley, Vela and Morais should be too much for a struggling league 1 side, even carrying a passenger like Moxey.
They're good enough footballers to have played through Chesterfield if the long ball option isn't available but Morais aside, I thought they let us down badly today. Pratley was much better in the 2nd half tbf
Agree with this. Alf is not that type of player and Long has pace to burn so why did/do we insist on playing long ball when those two are on the pitch?

Sub choices were also slightly wonky today. I'd have put Henry on earlier and thought about playing Karacan in the Moxey role from the start

I don't think that Karacan is capable of playing at left-back, left wing-back, or left midfield so I'm not sure about that. The starting line-up was the best one that Parky could have picked in my opinion, and though I might also have brought Henry on bit earlier, with our league position being what it is we didn't particularly need to risk losing by being too adventurous too early.
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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Apr 01, 2017 8:58 pm

Of course if we had better midfield players we'd not miss Madine. Just like if we'd had better players in the premiership wed not have needed Davies battering act at times.

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by WTW » Sat Apr 01, 2017 9:03 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 7:20 pm
Worthy4England wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 7:16 pm
WTW wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 7:10 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 6:41 pm
Today clearly, clearly demonstrated how important Madine is to us. Half the side without him.
True - but if we haven't got that target, don't play that way... The first half was dire, the second poor...
This, indeed. Their defence coped pretty well in the air but didn't like us running at them. So all first half and a fair amount of the second we punted it at Alf and Long, head height. If they won one, cleanly, between them I'd be fairly surprised.
How else do we play with that midfield? Even when we got going a bit it was crosses going into the box that neither Clayton nor ALF were really suited to.

Madine, is critical to us. Just like Davies was for years in the premiership. Just accept it.

PPG when Madine hasn't started is 0.57. It's blindingly obvious. Anyway, sounds like he's back Tuesday.
Can I just point out - I agreed with you. So why be so truculent?

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by TANGODANCER » Sat Apr 01, 2017 9:15 pm

Code: Select all

Can I just point out - I agreed with you. So why be so truculent?
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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Armchair Wanderer » Sat Apr 01, 2017 10:16 pm

I was wrong about the defeat and the rain but I think I anticipated a performance like that, unfortunately.

Fullback is my favourite position. I suppose if you're trying to be defensive at home against Chesterfield you'd have to play Moxey and Dervite at either side, but it was fairly obvious second half that Chesterfield had no intention of trying to win. It's good that it wasn't a loss but it's slightly disappointing that there wasn't a bit more positivity.

The team has never been afraid to hoof up to nobody... I remember Jussi/Bogdan doing that a lot in the P'ship. On paper the midfield looks pretty strong but I must blink every time Spearing does anything, but that might just be the type of player he is. The overall BBC stats are fairly embarrassing considering it was at home against a team that may well go down.

That's it for me this season apart from possibly the last game, assuming it's not a must-win. :lol:
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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Armchair Wanderer » Sat Apr 01, 2017 10:23 pm

Also, have Chesterfield sold all their players from the away game? Looked like a completely different team!
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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Sun Apr 02, 2017 6:27 am

Contented in Bangkok. A win would have been lovely, especially on Bring A Lapsed Supporter Day, but we're net profit for the round of fixtures: not only have (most of) the chasers failed to gain ground, but also with every passing game now we're a considerable chunk nearer the finishing line. Fleetwood appear to have exploded like Scunny did, Bradford are very in and out - wouldn't surprise me if Southend enter the playoffs not only as the (tallest-dwarf) form team but also as one of the higher placings. Fleetwood are now mathematically nearer to falling out the arse-end of the play-offs than catching us.

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Sun Apr 02, 2017 6:54 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 8:58 pm
Of course if we had better midfield players we'd not miss Madine. Just like if we'd had better players in the premiership wed not have needed Davies battering act at times.
Yeah, Okocha, Djorkaeff, Campo et al were too shit. Just imagine if we'd had Davies and Madine :roll:

Pratley, Spearing, Vela and Morais are capable of moving the ball around at this level. If all we did was lump it at midgets then we can only conclude one of the following:

a) Parky told them to
b) They panicked
c) They ignored Parky's instructions
d) They had a bad day at the office

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Worthy4England » Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:33 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 8:58 pm
Of course if we had better midfield players we'd not miss Madine. Just like if we'd had better players in the premiership wed not have needed Davies battering act at times.
I guess it was just so blindingly obvious, first half. Punt up the middle, generally lost. Play down left channel 50/50 win but little end product. Play down right channel 75/25 win, some crosses in to box.

So what did we do? Punt up the middle. Easy to be critical of MF. And they weren't good, first half but to me, a lot of the punts were coming from behind the midfield.

We did noticeably try and change it second half and got a lot closer. Their defence were terrified when we tried to run at them or pass through it. Prats ran with it more, Spearing more often looked for a out to Morais, but we were still a big idiot short in the middle which meant our bigger defenders were generally well marshalled. When Clayton came on, we should've probably looked for the tallest splinter collector we had and chucked them on instead.

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by officer_dibble » Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:58 am

Clayton came on cos he is suposedly a better footballer, to try and pull their centre halves out of position. I cant recall him having more than 5 touches. We'd of been better chucking Wilkinson on - could he not play cos he had been loaned to them?

Cant see Clayton being offered a deal myself. Not repaid his medical bills has he?

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Apr 02, 2017 9:08 am

Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 6:54 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sat Apr 01, 2017 8:58 pm
Of course if we had better midfield players we'd not miss Madine. Just like if we'd had better players in the premiership wed not have needed Davies battering act at times.
Yeah, Okocha, Djorkaeff, Campo et al were too shit. Just imagine if we'd had Davies and Madine :roll:

Pratley, Spearing, Vela and Morais are capable of moving the ball around at this level. If all we did was lump it at midgets then we can only conclude one of the following:

a) Parky told them to
b) They panicked
c) They ignored Parky's instructions
d) They had a bad day at the office

Morais is playing right wing back.

Vela, Spearing and Pratley barely have a constructive forward pass in them. All are good at what they do but none of them have the creativity to open up a side doing what Chesterfield did. When we got on top it was because we pressed high and won the ball back. And our only move was to pass out to Morais and get him to cross the ball. But it is very hard to do that all game, especially when several players like Spearing and Pratley are having off days.

Morais is our only creative player and he is having to play wing back to allow us to play 3 at the back.

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Worthy4England » Sun Apr 02, 2017 10:01 am

Sorta agree. Not sure Morais did much of the "back" bit. Not a criticism particularly but I'd have had him down as right MF/right wing yesterday. You're right, in that we need another out ball than Spearing to Morais. Although he got a cross in way more often than not yesterday. Knowing about it and stopping it happening aren't the same thing. Barcelona don't stop passing to Messi because people know he's good.

On the other side, Pratley tried to pull us out left in the second half, more successfully than first half, but that was generally a solo effort with no bugger giving him an outside run, so he'd have to come back inside...

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Apr 02, 2017 10:30 am

Worthy4England wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 10:01 am
Sorta agree. Not sure Morais did much of the "back" bit. Not a criticism particularly but I'd have had him down as right MF/right wing yesterday. You're right, in that we need another out ball than Spearing to Morais. Although he got a cross in way more often than not yesterday. Knowing about it and stopping it happening aren't the same thing. Barcelona don't stop passing to Messi because people know he's good.

On the other side, Pratley tried to pull us out left in the second half, more successfully than first half, but that was generally a solo effort with no bugger giving him an outside run, so he'd have to come back inside...
Yep I agree with that. The other problem is that the ball didn't stick at all up front yesterday which negates Vela and Pratley's running to a large extent. Can't win second balls that easily when there are none to win.

I don't particularly like this system for home games. Neither Moxey or Taylor are really good enough as wing backs at home though Taylor hugely preferable. It leaves us lopsided.

I don't mind if our only outlet is Morais but the problem is that first half he didn't get enough of the ball high enough up the pitch.

Mind above all that I think the game was built up to much and we were always asking for a reality check. Got away with it of course.

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Worthy4England » Sun Apr 02, 2017 11:00 am

Yeah, Taylor's been doing a pretty good job. Moxey couldn't spell the word "ball" yesterday (and I'm often not as critical of him as some folks). But that and punting cut us down to one realistic outlet.

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Prufrock » Sun Apr 02, 2017 11:06 am

Don't think 3 at the back suits us when the onus is on us to get at the oppo and attack.
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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Nicko58 » Sun Apr 02, 2017 11:59 am

Prufrock wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 11:06 am
Don't think 3 at the back suits us when the onus is on us to get at the oppo and attack.

It certainly is a bit of a quandary. We could try bringing Wabara in at RB and going back to the old 4-2-3-1, but then where does Le Fondre fit in? Alternatively, we could opt for a 4-4-2 but then we'd probably have to drop Vela. And playing with a diamond to try and keep Vela behind the front two would mean that we restrict the effectiveness of Morais, who is our only proper creative outlet, or just lose him altogether.

Maybe we'll just have rely on getting the four wins that we need by playing 3-5-2 away from home. :D
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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by Armchair Wanderer » Sun Apr 02, 2017 3:06 pm

Looked like 4-4-2 to me but Dervite just wasn't bombing on that much and Moxey didn't do much on the other side. It looked to me like the manager wanted to pay Dervite and Moxey at fullback despite what that did to the balance of the team. Who in their right mind would play 5 at the back at home against Chesterfield??

I think you can have a static-ish fullback on the same side as Morais as long as the fullback on the other side is bombing on.
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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by popeyedoyle » Sun Apr 02, 2017 3:11 pm

I think if Madine doesn't play then we should be playing Derik in one of the defensive midfield slots because he at least looks to play the ball into feet for the front men.

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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by TonyDomingos » Sun Apr 02, 2017 7:14 pm

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Zero goals. :D
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Re: 5,4,3,2,1... Chesterfield (H) 1/4/2017

Post by TANGODANCER » Sun Apr 02, 2017 7:56 pm

TonyDomingos wrote:
Sun Apr 02, 2017 7:14 pm
Little Green Man wrote:
Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:10 pm
Five pounds a ticket, four packed stands, three valuable points, two hungry teams, one worthy winner?
Zero goals. :D
And Alan Partridge got a pair free...... :wink:
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