A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

In here you'll find all the moaning, groaning and excitement that comes with following a live game.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:37 pm

Peter Thompson wrote:
Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:57 pm
Nicko58 wrote:
Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:27 pm
Peter Thompson wrote:
Sat Aug 19, 2017 7:07 pm
Our midfield get a nose bleed going over the half way line....same with the mythical wing backs (who still play as fullbacks in an ultra defensive back 5)....so they are either really unfit and can't get forward because they are fcuked OR Parkinson tells them to play this way - in a similar way to Big Sam's I'll fine you if you shoot from outside the box - Parkinson must fine players for going over the half way line.

As was being discussed in previous threads a few weeks ago, the movement, pace & intent from our midfield & wingbacks going forward is non existent - we simply have no options (apart from the Madine hoof) going forwards.....at times we actually look like its a 8-2 formation because the gap between the 2 strikers and the rest of the team is so large....again this is Parkinson non attacking / haven't got a clue how to attack tactics

It's neither. Derby County were just very good at closing us down and preventing us from moving forward.

Perhaps the main problem that we have is that we still have no one, bar Morais on the outside, who is capable of beating a man. And if we have no one who can beat a man, we're going to struggle to drag the opposing players out of position, and in turn we're going to struggle to create the space from which we can generate goalscoring chances. Josh Cullen is a tidy player, and if we had someone similar to, say, Mark Davies, he'd work very well with him but today he rarely played the ball forward, not because he was instructed not to, but because there was never any option in front of him. That's why we're so relaint on lumping it forward to Madine, who put in a decent showing, or forcing it out wide to Morais in the hope that he can get it in the box. We have two real threats, and it's those two. We generally got away with that in the third tier but we're going to get found out by a lot of teams at this level.

If I were Parky, as soon as Ameobi is back fit I'd set us up in a 4-2-3-1, with probably Ameobi, Buckley and Morais behind Madine. At least that way we'd have a chance of creating something substantial.
Where as we didn't even attempt to close them down and just watched and let them walk straight through us.
We attempted to close them down. That was the problem. If we'd sat deep behind the ball we might have done better. We closed them down and they exploited the gaps. Sometimes you just have to accept the opposition are better. They were.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by TANGODANCER » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:48 pm

^^ Well, P.T.you'd better get used to being an unhappy chappy. What did you really expect; that an embargoed team with a threadbare squad of loanees, kids, a couple of veterans, no money and their best players out of action for weeks were going to take the Championship by storm? Gee, you really are in for a bad time. P.P and his staff and methods just got us promoted in case it slipped your memory, but the opposition up here is miles away from what we played last year. We're in for a survival scrap which anybody claiming they didn't know before the season started is a joke in itself. Two/three teams from down here will be playing in the Prem next year, and two Prem teams will be coming down here. Same thing will happen here, it's no secret. That's the reality and, until we get out of embargoland and get some money, it's what we are seeing in the mirror darkly. Open the wardrobe door and we won't be in magical Narnia but wonderful Wigan and and fantasy Fleetwood again. We're at the bottom of a big hill right now, so climbing is the name of the game. Best get used to it..
The wisest and the best of men, nay, the wisest and best of their actions, may be rendered ridiculous by a person whose first object in life is a joke...Darcy. Pride and Prejudice.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Tombwfc » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:54 pm

Burton stayed up last year, and won on Friday night with goals from Marvin Sordell and a 68-year-old Lloyd Dyer.

Yes it is difficult and yes there is a sizeable gulf in class, but we have to be better than we were today. That starting 11 playing that formation won't win a game all season.

Does anyone benefit from this 5-3-2? Two non-wing backs blowing out their arse trying to get up and down, three confused centre halves, three midfielders passing it backwards and two strikers who need to score 100% of chances that come their way for us to get draws.

I don't know what the embargo situation is, but any vaguely creative footballer who'll allow us to play 4-2-3-1 should be a priority.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Hamptonoid » Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:14 am

I'm a liverpool fan who was at the game today with the in laws...

The formation really didn't help you today. CB's didn't seem comfortable with it, and none of them prepared to make the extra man up by pushing on. At times you had the three marking nugent, who isn't really that mobile.

Le Fondre was your best player by a mile, and you looked better at the end when you went more direct. Thought Madine did ok, overall, but he was pretty isolated for most of the game.

And why did no one want to pass to the LWB in the first half? ! ?

Would be great to see you guys back in the premier league, best of luck for the rest of the season.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by malcd1 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:26 am

Thank you for taking the time to visit us. It is always good to get an impartial view of our games.
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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by LeverEnd » Sun Aug 20, 2017 1:21 am

Tombwfc wrote:
Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:54 pm
Burton stayed up last year, and won on Friday night with goals from Marvin Sordell and a 68-year-old Lloyd Dyer.

Yes it is difficult and yes there is a sizeable gulf in class, but we have to be better than we were today. That starting 11 playing that formation won't win a game all season.

Does anyone benefit from this 5-3-2? Two non-wing backs blowing out their arse trying to get up and down, three confused centre halves, three midfielders passing it backwards and two strikers who need to score 100% of chances that come their way for us to get draws.

I don't know what the embargo situation is, but any vaguely creative footballer who'll allow us to play 4-2-3-1 should be a priority.
I've not seen a game yet this season but isn't Cullen supposed to be that player? Is he incapable of is he being handicapped by the tactics.
Oh, but surely just for one day, we could fight and we could win
And if only for a little while, we could insist on the impossible...

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Aug 20, 2017 6:10 am

LeverEnd wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 1:21 am
Tombwfc wrote:
Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:54 pm
Burton stayed up last year, and won on Friday night with goals from Marvin Sordell and a 68-year-old Lloyd Dyer.

Yes it is difficult and yes there is a sizeable gulf in class, but we have to be better than we were today. That starting 11 playing that formation won't win a game all season.

Does anyone benefit from this 5-3-2? Two non-wing backs blowing out their arse trying to get up and down, three confused centre halves, three midfielders passing it backwards and two strikers who need to score 100% of chances that come their way for us to get draws.

I don't know what the embargo situation is, but any vaguely creative footballer who'll allow us to play 4-2-3-1 should be a priority.
I've not seen a game yet this season but isn't Cullen supposed to be that player? Is he incapable of is he being handicapped by the tactics.
Cullen is tidy. But isn't an attacking midfield player. Mostly last season he played in front of Bradfords back four, scoring one goal iirc. We need someone who can bag some from midfield.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by officer_dibble » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:40 am

It is early days but I am dissapointed at how rigid he has been with 352. League cup game tuesday isnt it. He should use that for a 4231.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by bedwetter2 » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:50 am

Disappointing but not entirely unexpected. We will get better.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Harry Genshaw » Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:43 am

We've got to be tighter and more aggressive when not in possession and quicker and bolder when we are. Parky will get it right
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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Tombwfc » Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:49 am

LeverEnd wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 1:21 am
Tombwfc wrote:
Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:54 pm
Burton stayed up last year, and won on Friday night with goals from Marvin Sordell and a 68-year-old Lloyd Dyer.

Yes it is difficult and yes there is a sizeable gulf in class, but we have to be better than we were today. That starting 11 playing that formation won't win a game all season.

Does anyone benefit from this 5-3-2? Two non-wing backs blowing out their arse trying to get up and down, three confused centre halves, three midfielders passing it backwards and two strikers who need to score 100% of chances that come their way for us to get draws.

I don't know what the embargo situation is, but any vaguely creative footballer who'll allow us to play 4-2-3-1 should be a priority.
I've not seen a game yet this season but isn't Cullen supposed to be that player? Is he incapable of is he being handicapped by the tactics.
It's just not his game. I thought he was pretty bad against Leeds, but was more settled yesterday. He covers a lot of ground, gets the ball and gives it sideways. He's a cheaper, younger Jay Spearing rather than a Clough or Mark Davies.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Peter Thompson » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:08 am

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 9:43 am
We've got to be tighter and more aggressive when not in possession and quicker and bolder when we are. Parky will get it right
Are you sure ?....even last year in League 1 we only really played well attacking wise in 5 or 6 games, several League 1 teams passed us off the park at the Macron even though we ground out results i.e. Bristol Rovers, Fleetwood

He has one tactic and one tactic only, long ball to Madine - which is why we struggled so much with Madine out of the team towards the end of the season, and had to patch him up like El Cid to get us over the line.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Harry Genshaw » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:33 am

He's a pragmatic manager for sure, as was Allardyce, but what he achieved last season was remarkable given the circumstances. Don't give up on him yet PT
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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:36 am

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:33 am
He's a pragmatic manager for sure, as was Allardyce, but what he achieved last season was remarkable given the circumstances. Don't give up on him yet PT
He will moan at Parky and any other manager Bolton appoint. He complained bitterly during the Allardyce days. He's a modern day fan who knows better than every single manager. And the manager we've got is always the worst in the world till the next one is appointed...

People are going to have to get used to the fact that the majority of teams in this division have better players than us. And if those teams perform, on the day we will get beat. This is the most disadvantaged we've ever been in a season. Comparatively our maximum wage allowance isn't even competitive at the top of league one.

We need to add two or three quality players. If we could we'd be alright. But Ken and Deans continual court appaearances and inability to sort the finances out, mean we are more hamstrung than we've ever been.

The only hope we have of beating the odds is Parky. The only qualities where we can outshine other teams is spirit and organisation. That may not be enough, but Parky has shown an ability to bring a spirit and organisation into the group. Without that we've nothing whatsoever.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Peter Thompson » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:46 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:36 am
Harry Genshaw wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:33 am
He's a pragmatic manager for sure, as was Allardyce, but what he achieved last season was remarkable given the circumstances. Don't give up on him yet PT
He will moan at Parky and any other manager Bolton appoint. He complained bitterly during the Allardyce days. He's a modern day fan who knows better than every single manager. And the manager we've got is always the worst in the world till the next one is appointed...

People are going to have to get used to the fact that the majority of teams in this division have better players than us. And if those teams perform, on the day we will get beat. This is the most disadvantaged we've ever been in a season. Comparatively our maximum wage allowance isn't even competitive at the top of league one.

We need to add two or three quality players. If we could we'd be alright. But Ken and Deans continual court appaearances and inability to sort the finances out, mean we are more hamstrung than we've ever been.

The only hope we have of beating the odds is Parky. The only qualities where we can outshine other teams is spirit and organisation. That may not be enough, but Parky has shown an ability to bring a spirit and organisation into the group. Without that we've nothing whatsoever.
What an absolute muppet you are - 'modern day' aye alright, I've been watching the whites since 75 / 76 and watched then home & away throughout the 80's & 90's (inc the old Burnden div 3 and 4 days)

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:26 pm

Peter Thompson wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:46 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:36 am
Harry Genshaw wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:33 am
He's a pragmatic manager for sure, as was Allardyce, but what he achieved last season was remarkable given the circumstances. Don't give up on him yet PT
He will moan at Parky and any other manager Bolton appoint. He complained bitterly during the Allardyce days. He's a modern day fan who knows better than every single manager. And the manager we've got is always the worst in the world till the next one is appointed...

People are going to have to get used to the fact that the majority of teams in this division have better players than us. And if those teams perform, on the day we will get beat. This is the most disadvantaged we've ever been in a season. Comparatively our maximum wage allowance isn't even competitive at the top of league one.

We need to add two or three quality players. If we could we'd be alright. But Ken and Deans continual court appaearances and inability to sort the finances out, mean we are more hamstrung than we've ever been.

The only hope we have of beating the odds is Parky. The only qualities where we can outshine other teams is spirit and organisation. That may not be enough, but Parky has shown an ability to bring a spirit and organisation into the group. Without that we've nothing whatsoever.
What an absolute muppet you are - 'modern day' aye alright, I've been watching the whites since 75 / 76 and watched then home & away throughout the 80's & 90's (inc the old Burnden div 3 and 4 days)

And during our greatest period in modern history, you moaned, bitterly. You are never happy with any manager, and always think you know better. Always.

The only manager we've had since Allardyce who has brought anything approaching success you currently constantly moan about. You'd always know better irrespective. We've had some shocking managers. Parky isn't one of them. Not his fault that he has to work with his hands tied behind his back. And yes, Parky isn't perfect. But if he was, he'd not be managing a club in embargo in the championship,

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Athertonian » Sun Aug 20, 2017 1:54 pm

Watched with an open mind but we were simply not good enough. I don't think I need to highlight the problems because there are so many. The main noticeable miss was a Midfield general, someone like Spearing.

Which brings me to my only gripe and that was with a group of supporters shouting light abuse at Parkinson. I have had this seat since the Stadium opened and many new faces appear each season and all have a say how the team should be set up. These people moaned about Allardyce, some stopped going when Megson took over and slaughtered other managers who came and failed.

I enjoyed last season and always said that team was better than the one which came down. We looked stronger at the back and more menacing going forward. Unfortunately we have suffered with the injury jinx and weakened the team more that we can actually cope. I'm sure Parky has his reasons for his team selections and set up,

Once we have a full squad to select from I believe we'll settle down and pick up points but, again we need a midfield general which I sincerely hope Spearing returns. A long way to go yet.

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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Prufrock » Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:05 pm

Obviously easier to be level headed from a distance when I'm not sitting through it but Leeds and Derby both look like they'll be there or thereabouts in the top 6 shakeout. Home form is usually what keeps you up, and they're two tough opening games. Gulf in cash and quality.
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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Harry Genshaw » Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:07 pm

Personally, I don't think Spearing ever lived up to his billing as midfield general. He was combative for sure but for me he rarely grabbed a game by the scruff of its neck and ran the show.

If we're stuck with the embargo beyond the transfer window Parky could do a lot worse than giving Earing a go
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Re: A visit from the Pride without Prejudice....

Post by Little Green Man » Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:16 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:07 pm
If we're stuck with the embargo beyond the transfer window Parky could do a lot worse than giving Earing a go

Like Spearing - but a bit shorter.

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