No Fangks, Furg Off: We're The One & Only... Away to a pack o'Wolves Sat 25/11/17

[Lost Leopard Spot]

We were never, ever going to win this. It doesn't matter how we played or what formation we lined up in, we were doomed to failure. It's an outlier, not significant. We should just forget about it... the games against Preston and Sunderland were worth moaning about, this one never was.

[TANGODANCER]

Robinson had a decent game apparently, Little did well enough and we have player of the year in central defence. Can't blame it all on the keeper (if he wasn't bombarded as much he might not have let five in) Madine was playing Waltzing Matilda on his own up front and....our midfield was getting ripped to pieces by nineties Italian style football? Was this not how it was? I'm asking, not having been there and seeing it, just stating how it sounded. I accept that money lies at the heart of it and hope that's what allowed classier players to destroy us. Just hoping we get over this pretty rapid, because surely not every team in this league play that well?

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

We were never, ever going to win this. It doesn't matter how we played or what formation we lined up in, we were doomed to failure. It's an outlier, not significant. We should just forget about it... the games against Preston and Sunderland were worth moaning about, this one never was.

This - except I’d add Reading and QPR to the “worth moaning about” list, with a weary nod to Fulham too as fitting that far more important pattern of lead-chucking.

Wolves will beat (and have beaten) much better teams than us. Even before this game they’d had 15 different scorers. They’ve scored more goals away than seven teams have managed home and away. We aren’t going to avoid relegation by putting up a brave fight and losing fixtures like this 2-0. We have to focus on getting points in the more winnable games - like the next two home ones.

[officer_dibble]

Parky f*cked this week up long before he flogged the same 11 players to death on Saturday. Indeed he could have saved himself a touchline ban / fine (maybe he should buy presents for kiddies hospice) with a much more relaxed afternoon having 4 points in the bag already. As it is we are back bottom. Well done Phil.

[irie Cee Bee]

Totally outclassed. Wont fault the Manager for picking the same side. Why put in new players to get slaughtered and have their confidence destroyed in a game we were destined to lose. Then he would say to persons clamoring for changes like the Chairman, I told you so. He however needs to bring in Buckley, Noone and La Fondre to freshen up things for the next game. That is a winnable game.

Anyway, Robinson was the only Bolton player against Wolves who looked like a Championship player. The rest worked hard but seemed a Division behind the talent that was on display. Again, without better new players in January, we will go back down. KA, that's YOUR job. Get them in. Do that and leave the fans, players and managers to do THEIR job. Phil needs a few better players who can keep the ball, move and pass it accurately in tight spaces.

[BWFC_Insane]

Performance was poor and unacceptable, but lets be honest they are a team who've spent a lot of money on quality and it shows.

I'm not sure any of those on the bench improve us...so I'd stick with this team and system for now. The team that started Wolves had been unbeaten in 7. Not sure there is any point in panicking and throwing players in that don't fit or trying to find a new system.

[bristol_Wanderer3]

Burke will start on Saturday, and I hope he keeps his place for the forseeable future. It is a little surprising to me, following the strength of Wheater and Beevers last season, but to me they are the weakest link in our current first choice side. At this level they seem vulnerable not only to pace which a lot of teams have, but also to movement in the box, and then in addition they aren't comfortable in possession. If we are to improve further at this level, then we need to be better with the ball, particularly when leading at home, and it is important that the defenders are comfortable passing the ball for that to happen. Their obvious strength namely aerial ability is somewhat nullified at this level because teams are better at defending set pieces, and they rely on pacy flat balls for their own set pieces which takes away some advantages of static big defenders. Wheevers seem good characters but I am starting to feel that overall their weaknesses are proving more significant than their strengths.

[TANGODANCER]

Wheevers seem good characters but I am starting to feel that overall their weaknesses are proving more significant than their strengths.

Which might be magnified by the fact they still hit hopefuls when under pressure. Central defenders shouldn't be in constant action. Good positioning and anticipation, think Bobby Moore, Franz Beckenbaur etc, eleiminate the need for panic dashing after opposition players. Goals aren't scored every five minutes and a lot of every game is spent in midfield. The big lads need to learn about killer passes just as much as the rest. We can play keep ball and defend well for a lot of the game, but end of day, 1-0 or 5-1, it's still goals that count and they don't come from losing second balls or ball-watching. Birds and aeroplanes are the ones up there, football is played mainly on the floor.

[BWFC_Insane]

Burke will start on Saturday, and I hope he keeps his place for the forseeable future. It is a little surprising to me, following the strength of Wheater and Beevers last season, but to me they are the weakest link in our current first choice side. At this level they seem vulnerable not only to pace which a lot of teams have, but also to movement in the box, and then in addition they aren't comfortable in possession. If we are to improve further at this level, then we need to be better with the ball, particularly when leading at home, and it is important that the defenders are comfortable passing the ball for that to happen. Their obvious strength namely aerial ability is somewhat nullified at this level because teams are better at defending set pieces, and they rely on pacy flat balls for their own set pieces which takes away some advantages of static big defenders. Wheevers seem good characters but I am starting to feel that overall their weaknesses are proving more significant than their strengths.

Not sure I agree with this. Against Norwich for example, the centre back pairing was immense. That clearance from Beevers....

I think defenders should defend first and foremost. Being good on the ball is a total luxury for us.

They do lack mobility but this shouldn't be that big of an issue given we aren't playing a high line.

I prefer their experience and know-how and general bravery to any other options we have there right now.

[boltonboris]

If their pace is exploited in our system, it's because the midfield aren't playing right

[BWFC_Insane]

If their pace is exploited in our system, it's because the midfield aren't playing right

This.

[bristol_Wanderer3]

If their pace is exploited in our system, it's because the midfield aren't playing right

This.

For whatever reason I think their lack of pace and movement is being exploited most weeks. Lets forget all the mostly shambolic games up to the October international break and focus on when we have had our best team available:

Sheffield Wed created numerous chances from balls into our box in the 2nd half. Rhodes came on at half time and had 3-4 clear cut chances from balls into the box. Joao had that clear chance from a cross that Alnwick saved, Wheater brought down a guy for what 80% of the time is a penalty.

Fulham's forwards got in behind our defence a few times only to finish badly. Sunderland's did also and scored twice from doing so. Norwich got clean through from one long pass in the a few minutes from the end that they should have scored from. Preston were terrible but still had three clear chances from set pieces, and Wolves speaks for itself.

It is only a small sample size but 12 goals conceded from the 7 Wheevers games since the start of October puts us on course for conceding 78 goals in a season. Only Rotherham conceded more last season, we finished bottom conceding 81 in 2015-16, only Blackpool conceded more in 2014-15, and it isn't like teams are scoring from their only chance, far from it. Our midfield isn't going to get much better and Parky sets us up to have 30-40% possession most games so teams are going to have the ball in our half, and most teams have smaller, faster attacking players. I really feel that defensively pace and movement are more important than height at this level. At least Burke, even if alongside one of Wheevers gives us more of that, whilst also having the height and aerial ability.

Also, I do feel having some ability on the ball is important in the Championship. How many teams have we seen this season with defenders that lump it 50 yards forward every time they get it? Most of them can pass it around like midfielders from what I have seen. There is something to be said for not taking chances in possession and not overplaying, but if we are to ever progress from a struggling Championship side, we need players at the back who have a range of passing and can carry the ball into midfield when given the opportunity imho.

Anyway, you can come back at me when Burke gives the ball away on Saturday for Barnsley's only goal in their 3-1 defeat

[TANGODANCER]

we need players at the back who have a range of passing and can carry the ball into midfield when given the opportunity imho.

What's Paul Scholes doing right now? A liability tackling, but sheer talent in every other respect...Oh for one of him...