Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Harry Genshaw » Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:58 pm

I've been resigned to a tough season from day 1 but I'm afraid the apathy overtook me too yesterday.

Next Saturday Mrs G and I had our day planned to squeeze the match in before a gig and overnight in Manchester. On the miserable walk home yesterday we both agreed to sack the game off and spend longer in town.

I couldn't bring myself to leave early but can well understand those that did
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Sun Dec 17, 2017 3:27 pm

TANGODANCER wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:31 pm
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 10:28 am
Only four pages of comments, three of which are TD’s valiant commentary, might suggest that we fans are as indifferent as the players and management.
I'm actually wondering if it's really worth bothering with relaying commentary any more. Used to be fun, but hardly anyone seems to be on line lately and it would be far easier to just sit back and listen with a cuppa.
No. No, no no no no.
For us what can only make the odd match, and don't live in the area covered by radio commentary, Radio Tango is an absolute godsend!
If you give up relaying the pertinent facts I might gave to hunt you down and kill you.
I know it's depressing, but think of Trotter support this season as being like an heroin addict. You know it is ultimately pointless and life diminishing but the occasional high is worth the scrounging around to get your hit... or something like that. And you're the Man who supplies. :wink:
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:03 pm

officer_dibble wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:43 am
We are a decent centre half, centre midfield and centre forward short. Which is too much in this league.
Aye. This. We lack the quality through the spine. We are competitive with poor sides in this league but to stay up we basically have to win every game against the bottom 6 because our lack of quality in key areas against the top half is ruthlessly exposed.

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by jonnybwfc » Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:54 pm

Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 3:27 pm
TANGODANCER wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:31 pm
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 10:28 am
Only four pages of comments, three of which are TD’s valiant commentary, might suggest that we fans are as indifferent as the players and management.
I'm actually wondering if it's really worth bothering with relaying commentary any more. Used to be fun, but hardly anyone seems to be on line lately and it would be far easier to just sit back and listen with a cuppa.
No. No, no no no no.
For us what can only make the odd match, and don't live in the area covered by radio commentary, Radio Tango is an absolute godsend!
If you give up relaying the pertinent facts I might gave to hunt you down and kill you.
I know it's depressing, but think of Trotter support this season as being like an heroin addict. You know it is ultimately pointless and life diminishing but the occasional high is worth the scrounging around to get your hit... or something like that. And you're the Man who supplies. :wink:
Agreed.

I'm often travelling, and tune-in for the Radio Tango updates at game-time.

I don't post anything in reply (although I don't post much in general), largely because I can't comment, as I'm not seeing the match.

Have tried to comment when at the match, but phone reception at the Macron makes it tricky ... although easier now with the thinning crowds.
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by bristol_Wanderer3 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:28 am

Belated view from the West Stand Upper:

Bollocks!!

We lost a game we couldn't afford to lose. The one thing you don't want to do in a crucial relegation clash is to give a side who are good defensively away from home, but have little attack, an easy goal. That is exactly what we did. Lloyd Dyer's shot from 25 yards bounced twice before sneaking in past a static Alnwick. Seemed a bad goalkeeping mistake. From then on we had most of the pressure though at times they kept the ball well, but we couldn't score. We weren't terrible, and certainly didn't deserve some of the ultra negative reactions from the crowd, but we struggled to create clear chances, and were unlucky when we did, with Wheater (I think) hitting the bar, and Ameobi going close.

So there we are. Some points:
  • Burton were pretty good in defence and midfield but looked very limited in attack.
  • We have clearly tried to work on being more patient in building our attacks. We are trying to string more passes together before playing it forward. Whilst this is precisely what we need to do more of imho we probably actually needed our hard running route one approach yesterday.
  • Whilst our fans seem to hate the hoof to Madine, they seem to hate the slower build up too judging by the impatience yesterday.
  • We didn't have the quality to break down a packed and resolute defence, but the performance wasn't much worse than in previous games.
  • We need to cut out defensive individual mistakes. It is happening way too often.
  • Ameobi was way better than any of our other players and looks a class above
  • Robinson has been excellent at times, but yesterday had a mare. He is a young player and I think given Taylor was on the bench yesterday it is time to take him out of the firing line for a while and get Taylor back in
  • I am in living in a parallel universe where Madine believes he can score 35 yard free kicks

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Dr Hotdog » Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:26 am

There can't be too many goals scored from a strike outside the box that bounce twice before beating a professional goalkeeper and nestling in the net, can there? With no Deflections?

Just watched the 2 minute highlight package through our Official YouTube Account and it even managed to sneak in another classic Mark 'Tackle With The Wrong Foot' Beevers moment. Can this not be coached out of him? Seriously? It's like trying to control a bouncing ball with your studs. Fecking fecking fecking school kid shite.

I guess we missed Little down the right flank because from what I've heard about Derby amounts to him having zero attacking instinct whatsoever.

That post earlier about Plan A not working against the team bottom of the league. That Is IT. The Rubican has been crossed. This is the moment. It Is Time To Try Something Different. Give The Opposition The Unexpected And See What Happens. At least he can say he tried.

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by BWFC_Insane » Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:55 am

Dr Hotdog wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:26 am
There can't be too many goals scored from a strike outside the box that bounce twice before beating a professional goalkeeper and nestling in the net, can there? With no Deflections?

Just watched the 2 minute highlight package through our Official YouTube Account and it even managed to sneak in another classic Mark 'Tackle With The Wrong Foot' Beevers moment. Can this not be coached out of him? Seriously? It's like trying to control a bouncing ball with your studs. Fecking fecking fecking school kid shite.

I guess we missed Little down the right flank because from what I've heard about Derby amounts to him having zero attacking instinct whatsoever.

That post earlier about Plan A not working against the team bottom of the league. That Is IT. The Rubican has been crossed. This is the moment. It Is Time To Try Something Different. Give The Opposition The Unexpected And See What Happens. At least he can say he tried.
Not sure its as simple as try "a new plan". We tried passing through Burton and that didn't work. We went long, that didn't work. We tried having Buckley and Ameobi run at them out wide and centrally.

I think sometimes you just have to concede you lack the quality and week on week all you can do is work hard every game and hope things break for you.

Burton will be doing exactly the same. They won thanks to a keeper error.

On another day we could have done the reverse.

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:55 am
Not sure its as simple as try "a new plan". We tried passing through Burton and that didn't work. We went long, that didn't work. We tried having Buckley and Ameobi run at them out wide and centrally.

I think sometimes you just have to concede you lack the quality and week on week all you can do is work hard every game and hope things break for you.

Burton will be doing exactly the same. They won thanks to a keeper error.

On another day we could have done the reverse.
So we tried a few things against Burton and none of them worked. Just glance back on that. If you're conceding we lack the quality to beat Burton at home, you're conceding relegation. I mean, I'm far from a billy big-balls wad-counter, but this is Burton. Not only are they struggling, they have been for 18 months: since promotion in summer 2016 their away record has been LDDDLDLLLDLLWLWLDDDWLWDLLLDDDLWDLW. Four away wins in 33 till they played us suckers.

And this is not an underperforming team of sleeping giants, as some might say Sunderland are. I'll be completely honest, I'd only heard of three of their starting XI, one of them used to play for us, the other two are nearer 40 years old than 30 (but one of them scored, the other kept a clean sheet). The others were largely collated from lower-league teams. Only one of the XI cost a fee, and that was three years ago; this is a club that, when they broke their transfer record last summer (for someone who was benched on Saturday), were breaking a previous record of £20,000.

Stephen Bywater, 36, GK, free (Kerala Blasters)
John Brayford, 29, RB, free (Sheffield United)
Ben Turner, 29, CB, free (Cardiff)
Jake Buxton, 32, CB, free (Wigan)
Tom Flanagan, 25, LB, free (MK Dons)
Luke Murphy, 28, CM, loan (Leeds)
Tom Naylor, 26, CM, free (Derby)
Lucas Akins, 28, RW (Stevenage) - small fee three years ago
Will Miller, 21, AM, free (Spurs)
Lloyd Dyer, 35, LW, free (Burnley)
Marvin Sordell, 26, FW, swap (Coventry)

Now, I understand the idea that we can't go toe-to-toe with Wolves or whoever. I even understand people being scared of underachievers like Sunderland and Birmingham waking up. And this is not a rant against Burton, to whom I wish all the best except when it affects my team. But really, if we can't beat Burton, who can we beat? And conversely, if they can beat us with the above collection of never-will-bes, doesn't that reflect awfully on our players and manager?

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:23 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:55 am
Not sure its as simple as try "a new plan". We tried passing through Burton and that didn't work. We went long, that didn't work. We tried having Buckley and Ameobi run at them out wide and centrally.

I think sometimes you just have to concede you lack the quality and week on week all you can do is work hard every game and hope things break for you.

Burton will be doing exactly the same. They won thanks to a keeper error.

On another day we could have done the reverse.
So we tried a few things against Burton and none of them worked. Just glance back on that. If you're conceding we lack the quality to beat Burton at home, you're conceding relegation. I mean, I'm far from a billy big-balls wad-counter, but this is Burton. Not only are they struggling, they have been for 18 months: since promotion in summer 2016 their away record has been LDDDLDLLLDLLWLWLDDDWLWDLLLDDDLWDLW. Four away wins in 33 till they played us suckers.

And this is not an underperforming team of sleeping giants, as some might say Sunderland are. I'll be completely honest, I'd only heard of three of their starting XI, one of them used to play for us, the other two are nearer 40 years old than 30 (but one of them scored, the other kept a clean sheet). The others were largely collated from lower-league teams. Only one of the XI cost a fee, and that was three years ago; this is a club that, when they broke their transfer record last summer (for someone who was benched on Saturday), were breaking a previous record of £20,000.

Stephen Bywater, 36, GK, free (Kerala Blasters)
John Brayford, 29, RB, free (Sheffield United)
Ben Turner, 29, CB, free (Cardiff)
Jake Buxton, 32, CB, free (Wigan)
Tom Flanagan, 25, LB, free (MK Dons)
Luke Murphy, 28, CM, loan (Leeds)
Tom Naylor, 26, CM, free (Derby)
Lucas Akins, 28, RW (Stevenage) - small fee three years ago
Will Miller, 21, AM, free (Spurs)
Lloyd Dyer, 35, LW, free (Burnley)
Marvin Sordell, 26, FW, swap (Coventry)

Now, I understand the idea that we can't go toe-to-toe with Wolves or whoever. I even understand people being scared of underachievers like Sunderland and Birmingham waking up. And this is not a rant against Burton, to whom I wish all the best except when it affects my team. But really, if we can't beat Burton, who can we beat? And conversely, if they can beat us with the above collection of never-will-bes, doesn't that reflect awfully on our players and manager?
^ In a nutshell, Yes, it does.
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Bruce Rioja » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:26 pm

As a son of Burton, I used to enjoy taking my Godsons to watch them every Boxing Day in their game with Tamworth, in much the same way that I enjoy watching Chorley a time or two every season. How did it come to this?
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by BWFC_Insane » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:42 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:55 am
Not sure its as simple as try "a new plan". We tried passing through Burton and that didn't work. We went long, that didn't work. We tried having Buckley and Ameobi run at them out wide and centrally.

I think sometimes you just have to concede you lack the quality and week on week all you can do is work hard every game and hope things break for you.

Burton will be doing exactly the same. They won thanks to a keeper error.

On another day we could have done the reverse.
So we tried a few things against Burton and none of them worked. Just glance back on that. If you're conceding we lack the quality to beat Burton at home, you're conceding relegation. I mean, I'm far from a billy big-balls wad-counter, but this is Burton. Not only are they struggling, they have been for 18 months: since promotion in summer 2016 their away record has been LDDDLDLLLDLLWLWLDDDWLWDLLLDDDLWDLW. Four away wins in 33 till they played us suckers.

And this is not an underperforming team of sleeping giants, as some might say Sunderland are. I'll be completely honest, I'd only heard of three of their starting XI, one of them used to play for us, the other two are nearer 40 years old than 30 (but one of them scored, the other kept a clean sheet). The others were largely collated from lower-league teams. Only one of the XI cost a fee, and that was three years ago; this is a club that, when they broke their transfer record last summer (for someone who was benched on Saturday), were breaking a previous record of £20,000.

Stephen Bywater, 36, GK, free (Kerala Blasters)
John Brayford, 29, RB, free (Sheffield United)
Ben Turner, 29, CB, free (Cardiff)
Jake Buxton, 32, CB, free (Wigan)
Tom Flanagan, 25, LB, free (MK Dons)
Luke Murphy, 28, CM, loan (Leeds)
Tom Naylor, 26, CM, free (Derby)
Lucas Akins, 28, RW (Stevenage) - small fee three years ago
Will Miller, 21, AM, free (Spurs)
Lloyd Dyer, 35, LW, free (Burnley)
Marvin Sordell, 26, FW, swap (Coventry)

Now, I understand the idea that we can't go toe-to-toe with Wolves or whoever. I even understand people being scared of underachievers like Sunderland and Birmingham waking up. And this is not a rant against Burton, to whom I wish all the best except when it affects my team. But really, if we can't beat Burton, who can we beat? And conversely, if they can beat us with the above collection of never-will-bes, doesn't that reflect awfully on our players and manager?
We're financially as our chairman said last season, probably on an equal footing with Burton.

My point is that we'll win some games, but not enough. We're not good enough, as I've said for a while. We will finish very close to Burton. But that probably won't be enough to save us.

Of course Burton at home is a must win. Absolutely. But they stayed in this league last season and clearly showed the ability to get the odd result. So it was never a given. On paper I'm not sure I'd see their side of freebies as substantially different to ours. There is some distant premiership experience in theirs and plenty championship experience. It was basically 11 freebies and misfits up against another 11 freebies and misfits.

Of course losing was unacceptable. But we're not very good. And the idea that we'd be much better if we simply "tried something else" is fanciful.

We're probably over a season about as good as Burton.

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:50 pm

Bruce Rioja wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:26 pm
... How did it come to this?

(A quick reminder Bruce)

Big Sam walks away in April 2007
in October we appoint Smegson
in January 2010 we appoint Owen Coyle and utilise wiff waff as a training regime
In October 2012 (a season too late) we replace Mr Coyle with one Dougie 'Feckin' Freedman
We get sold for a pound to a snake oil salesman and somebody who hasn't got two pounds to rub together...
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by BWFC_Insane » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:59 pm

Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:50 pm
Bruce Rioja wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:26 pm
... How did it come to this?

(A quick reminder Bruce)

Big Sam walks away in April 2007
in October we appoint Smegson
in January 2010 we appoint Owen Coyle and utilise wiff waff as a training regime
In October 2012 (a season too late) we replace Mr Coyle with one Dougie 'Feckin' Freedman
We get sold for a pound to a snake oil salesman and somebody who hasn't got two pounds to rub together...
And where were we when Big Sam came in? On verge of financial ruin at the bottom of the championship.

And just a little over a decade before that? Bottom tier of English football.

We've had ups and downs. That is what supporting Bolton Wanderers and clubs like us is all about.

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Burnden Paddock » Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:11 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:58 pm
I've been resigned to a tough season from day 1 but I'm afraid the apathy overtook me too yesterday.

Next Saturday Mrs G and I had our day planned to squeeze the match in before a gig and overnight in Manchester. On the miserable walk home yesterday we both agreed to sack the game off and spend longer in town.

I couldn't bring myself to leave early but can well understand those that did
I was gutted to note that we're at home next Saturday and also on NYD. Seriously considering staying at home for both after Saturday's non-performance!

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:16 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:59 pm
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:50 pm
Bruce Rioja wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:26 pm
... How did it come to this?

(A quick reminder Bruce)

Big Sam walks away in April 2007
in October we appoint Smegson
in January 2010 we appoint Owen Coyle and utilise wiff waff as a training regime
In October 2012 (a season too late) we replace Mr Coyle with one Dougie 'Feckin' Freedman
We get sold for a pound to a snake oil salesman and somebody who hasn't got two pounds to rub together...
And where were we when Big Sam came in? On verge of financial ruin at the bottom of the championship.

And just a little over a decade before that? Bottom tier of English football.

We've had ups and downs. That is what supporting Bolton Wanderers and clubs like us is all about.
I'm not quite up to wandering through life with a rictus grin on my face. I reserve the right to moan about the downs, and I seriously doubt that most people feel that watching shite like we saw on Saturday "is what supporting Bolton Wanderers and clubs like us is all about". If I want to see football of that level I can go and watch Matlock ffs.
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by BWFC_Insane » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:23 pm

Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:16 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:59 pm
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:50 pm
Bruce Rioja wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:26 pm
... How did it come to this?

(A quick reminder Bruce)

Big Sam walks away in April 2007
in October we appoint Smegson
in January 2010 we appoint Owen Coyle and utilise wiff waff as a training regime
In October 2012 (a season too late) we replace Mr Coyle with one Dougie 'Feckin' Freedman
We get sold for a pound to a snake oil salesman and somebody who hasn't got two pounds to rub together...
And where were we when Big Sam came in? On verge of financial ruin at the bottom of the championship.

And just a little over a decade before that? Bottom tier of English football.

We've had ups and downs. That is what supporting Bolton Wanderers and clubs like us is all about.
I'm not quite up to wandering through life with a rictus grin on my face. I reserve the right to moan about the downs, and I seriously doubt that most people feel that watching shite like we saw on Saturday "is what supporting Bolton Wanderers and clubs like us is all about". If I want to see football of that level I can go and watch Matlock ffs.
You cannot always be successful. Its just the way it goes. I'm not saying enjoy it, but perspective is important.

I enjoyed last season a lot. It was our first success for a long time.

This season always promised to be long and relatively miserable. Its probably worse than I thought but not by a lot.

The real point we threw it away was when we sacrificed premiership status because fans wanted us to play "entertaining football" and we ended up with Coyle the clown. Since then I've found it harder to get so worked up about it. There is no magic fix, short of spending millions of someone elses money we just have to hope we are lucky and bring through an amazing crop of youngsters through the academy. Until that happens, we're going to be shite.

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by twilight » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:34 pm

You get a thumbs up from me with your post earlier DSB, it does reflect awfully on the players and manager with that abject display, and I thought they were abysmal/terrible/no energy/didn't want to be there display....and to be honest if they can't be bothered then neither can I!!

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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by Armchair Wanderer » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:43 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 am
Now, I understand the idea that we can't go toe-to-toe with Wolves or whoever. I even understand people being scared of underachievers like Sunderland and Birmingham waking up. And this is not a rant against Burton, to whom I wish all the best except when it affects my team. But really, if we can't beat Burton, who can we beat? And conversely, if they can beat us with the above collection of never-will-bes, doesn't that reflect awfully on our players and manager?
We need a comparison of the transfer fees and/or wages of both starting XI to answer that :D. Tbf, Burton have had an extra season in the league.

After the embargo if BWFC are towards the bottom of the table wage-wise then we know the reason they are where they are (using moneyball logic).

It's seemed (to me) for a while that everything needed a shake up. Most people have been insisting it's not the manager's fault so that just leaves January to fix things.

In the past they've managed to get some golden bullets (Dawson etc) so maybe they can this time. Someone like Dawson would be great because he fixes defence and attack simultaneously.
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by BWFC_Insane » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:18 pm

Armchair Wanderer wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:43 pm
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 am
Now, I understand the idea that we can't go toe-to-toe with Wolves or whoever. I even understand people being scared of underachievers like Sunderland and Birmingham waking up. And this is not a rant against Burton, to whom I wish all the best except when it affects my team. But really, if we can't beat Burton, who can we beat? And conversely, if they can beat us with the above collection of never-will-bes, doesn't that reflect awfully on our players and manager?
We need a comparison of the transfer fees and/or wages of both starting XI to answer that :D. Tbf, Burton have had an extra season in the league.

After the embargo if BWFC are towards the bottom of the table wage-wise then we know the reason they are where they are (using moneyball logic).

It's seemed (to me) for a while that everything needed a shake up. Most people have been insisting it's not the manager's fault so that just leaves January to fix things.

In the past they've managed to get some golden bullets (Dawson etc) so maybe they can this time. Someone like Dawson would be great because he fixes defence and attack simultaneously.
Reality check needed.

Being out of embargo doesn't mean we've got any money to spend.

And we got players like Dawson when we were competitive with the rest of the championship for in demand loan players.

The top loans like Dawson was won't be coming here, because we don't have the money.

We're in the same pool as Burton. For a logic check use the qualifying question "Could Burton sign player X?" If the answer is "probably not" then you have an answer as to whether are likely to be able to.

bristol_Wanderer3
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Re: Bolton v Burton, who'll show their true pedigree and who'll end up bitter? H Sat 16/Dec

Post by bristol_Wanderer3 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:23 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:55 am
Not sure its as simple as try "a new plan". We tried passing through Burton and that didn't work. We went long, that didn't work. We tried having Buckley and Ameobi run at them out wide and centrally.

I think sometimes you just have to concede you lack the quality and week on week all you can do is work hard every game and hope things break for you.

Burton will be doing exactly the same. They won thanks to a keeper error.

On another day we could have done the reverse.
So we tried a few things against Burton and none of them worked. Just glance back on that. If you're conceding we lack the quality to beat Burton at home, you're conceding relegation. I mean, I'm far from a billy big-balls wad-counter, but this is Burton. Not only are they struggling, they have been for 18 months: since promotion in summer 2016 their away record has been LDDDLDLLLDLLWLWLDDDWLWDLLLDDDLWDLW. Four away wins in 33 till they played us suckers.

And this is not an underperforming team of sleeping giants, as some might say Sunderland are. I'll be completely honest, I'd only heard of three of their starting XI, one of them used to play for us, the other two are nearer 40 years old than 30 (but one of them scored, the other kept a clean sheet). The others were largely collated from lower-league teams. Only one of the XI cost a fee, and that was three years ago; this is a club that, when they broke their transfer record last summer (for someone who was benched on Saturday), were breaking a previous record of £20,000.

Stephen Bywater, 36, GK, free (Kerala Blasters)
John Brayford, 29, RB, free (Sheffield United)
Ben Turner, 29, CB, free (Cardiff)
Jake Buxton, 32, CB, free (Wigan)
Tom Flanagan, 25, LB, free (MK Dons)
Luke Murphy, 28, CM, loan (Leeds)
Tom Naylor, 26, CM, free (Derby)
Lucas Akins, 28, RW (Stevenage) - small fee three years ago
Will Miller, 21, AM, free (Spurs)
Lloyd Dyer, 35, LW, free (Burnley)
Marvin Sordell, 26, FW, swap (Coventry)

Now, I understand the idea that we can't go toe-to-toe with Wolves or whoever. I even understand people being scared of underachievers like Sunderland and Birmingham waking up. And this is not a rant against Burton, to whom I wish all the best except when it affects my team. But really, if we can't beat Burton, who can we beat? And conversely, if they can beat us with the above collection of never-will-bes, doesn't that reflect awfully on our players and manager?
Not sure about this DSB. They bought Jackson Irvine last year for £350,000, sold him for £2m to Hull the summer just gone, bought Liam Boyce this summer for £500,000, who unluckily for them got a serious injury at the start of the season, and bought Jamie Allen from Rochdale for a rumoured £800,000. They have spent more on fees than we have.

I don't think we can look it as if we can't beat Burton we can't beat anyone. Burton know they are a small club struggling against much bigger teams in this league and make themselves very difficult to break down away from home. This result was very likely if we didn't get the first goal. Way better teams than us have failed to score against them at home this season and more will too. They defend really well, but they would've really struggled to score if Alnwick hadn't made his error. We will have much easier games against teams with more quality, IF, we cut out the ridiculous individual defensive mistakes.

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