A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:17 pm

bristol_Wanderer3 wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:11 pm
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:08 pm
bristol_Wanderer3 wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:02 pm
So does anyone know anything about Tyler Walker? Why has he not been around the squad all this time? He is easily our 2nd best striker, if not our best...
I think that might be a bit of Andranik Syndrome - Walker's importance growing in his absence. In the bits he got he hardly had us salivating. I mean, neither did anyone else, but personally it's well down my list of reasons to be furious. For a start, there's his also-loaned club-mate.
But Tyler Walker has scored 4 Championship goals this season in the first half of the season. In the context of our squad he is as close to proven as it gets. And he has pace, and he looked ok at QPR. ALF and Wilbraham were the only strikers in the squad today. Walker and Clough should at least be in the 18.
Clough definitely. Walker, well, he may have scored in a better team but when he played for us I can't recall a single post on here demanding his further inclusion. I mean, he's probably better than Wilbraham, but we know Parky will ALWAYS want a Big Man Up Top when, as is all too frequently the case, we need goals because we've had bugger-all else in the way of ideas.

The really really really frustrating thing is that we've seen this month how to play, because it worked at Barnsley - roughly as good as Burton. No need for a big man up top. Attacking full-backs. Pass on the floor. Creativity across the 3 of 4231. Maybe Walker could have worked in that but it's a guess, a risk. We saw at Barnsley what could work. When I saw that team today I genuinely hoped I was wrong but I suspected it wouldn't and the sheer gutless witless nonsensical surrender of it means a part of me has died - the part that believes in Parky. I don't think we'll fire him now and I'm not sure it would help much but my sympathy has gone.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by DJBlu » Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:20 pm

The biggest positive out of the whole BFWC debacle is the U23s.

The talent is in the wings, with another manager they may get the promotion they deserve to the first team.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Lost Leopard Spot » Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:25 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:07 pm
Lost Leopard Spot wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:57 pm
Prufrock wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 4:48 pm
Clinging to that Villa goal.

Alnwick is one of the not-good-enough useless shithouses that are why we're down there.

Pathetic from Parky today, but think he's a major reason we've even got a chance.
I really really really really fail to understand why people believe this. Not the pathetic bit, that I understand.

If the wanker took on Clough just to show up Anderson, he's been found out for being a very big wanker indeed. If it was his decision to take on Clough then he's a wanker that would win most wankers' award for Wanker of The Year.
It's surely not that hard to understand even if you don't agree. No money, no fees, under embargo until Jan, top scorer sold from under him.

Fecking grabbing bell-end in charge is where the blame lies for me. Far from a Nadine apologist but selling your topscorer on deadline day and not replacing him is catastrophically stupid. He can get bent.

Don't think PP wanted Clough, Chungy fell through last minute and I think he took what he could get.

He's far from perfect, though. That team today was shambolic, our away record is genuinely embarrasing, and whilst I don't think he particularly wanted Clough, as you say, if he doesn't think Zach is in our best 18 players he is, to put it kindly, wrong as f*ck.

I suppose at least he has no option other than to go for it next week? Not sure we're good enough to get the win no matter what the rest do.
All very reasoned, and I don't particularly disagree. But I happen to be Very Dispirited & Annoyed, which I'm sure you'll agree doesn't leave me exceptionally rational.
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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by elhadj » Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:47 pm

The season is almost over , if we stay up sack this clueless and bring some one with championship experience , if we go down bring Kevin Nolan and promote Connor hall and Jeff king and Jake turner to first team at least they will play with heart and do everything thing to prove they deserve a chance , I don't know why this f****g clueless doesn't give hall a chance with our scoring record he deseve a chance .

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:53 pm

When I saw that team sheet I knew we'd lose by 2+ to nil. Sometimes you have to go balls out and this was one of those times. Unfortunately Parky isn't that sort of manager and I suspect a fair number of fans will never forgive him for essentially giving up today.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by truewhite15 » Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:56 pm

Atrocious. The manner of our demise over the last month is what smarts. I'm with DSB - sympathy for Parkinson has vanished. There have been three games since the international break, victories in any of which would have seen us pretty much safe - Birmingham, Barnsley and Burton. In all three Parkinson has set out a side designed to avoid defeat, rather than win.

The continued ostracizing of Clough is infuriating and bewildering. In the games he's played since his return, he's been the only one who looks forward when he gets the ball. The continued inclusion of Beevers is baffling, considering his lack of form. The dropping of Robinson and Little is likewise befuddling, considering that both were important in our upturn in form.

It's no longer good enough to set out to not lose. Only a win against Forest is sufficient. We can't use Clough. Drop Beevers, drop Henry, drop Pratley. Go 4-4-2. Wheater and Burke/Dervite at centre back. Little and Robbo at full back. Morais and Ameobi wide. Vela and Karacan/Derik in the middle. ALF and, sod it, Connor Hall up top.

This won't happen, of course. Expect 4-5-1, Beevers, Henry, Buckley, Pratley, Taylor, more of the same, and our inevitable relegation.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by elhadj » Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:01 pm

He is a coward and don't have the courage to attack and put the pressure on them , no he prefers to wait and play defensive minded team which will cost us to go down league one again and this time will be harder than last time , unless some investor come and buy Bolton and try to build a strong team and give some young player a chance , I want Kevin Nolan , at least he will learn the player what is Bolton mean and play for the badge and fight it for this club .

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Athertonian » Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:03 pm

elhadj wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:47 pm
The season is almost over , if we stay up sack this clueless and bring some one with championship experience , if we go down bring Kevin Nolan and promote Connor hall and Jeff king and Jake turner to first team at least they will play with heart and do everything thing to prove they deserve a chance , I don't know why this f****g clueless doesn't give hall a chance with our scoring record he deseve a chance .
Spot on pal.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Tombwfc » Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:09 pm

I like Parky as a person and it's arguably not his fault that he has a squad with zero strikers he likes.

He can leave having done a good job on the whole, but leave he definitely should, particularly if we go down.

Next season we'll again have a bigger budget than all bar one team and a group of players who'll still have experience of having success at that level.

There also seems to be a bit of a gap between the divisions - two of last years relegated teams have put up over 180 points between them.

It's the perfect situation to bring in Kevin Nolan, or anyone who might actually bring some excitement back to a club that desperately needs it.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by TANGODANCER » Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:22 pm

I only heard the radio, but what I did hear was that if their strikers hadn't missed at least three easy chances it could have been 5 for them and not a serious shot/header on goal from us in reply. Against "Burton Albion" that is. How well for the future of Boloton Wanderers does that bode? In truth, we need a miracle next week as Forest aren't going to do us any favours and could well kick us while we're on the floor. I'll be praying for the miracle regardless, because hope springs eternal, but where has the psyche gone? Parky supposedly fielded a defensive set up and we lost without a fight. If Barnsley and Burton win it won't matter anyway and that will be the back-breaker straw, we'll be down.

There are a few things unfathomable besides the obvious ones, like why did Wheater, Vela and Clough not play and is Karajan injured? What happened to the set piece excellence of last season that produced 15 goals from the Wheater/Beevers pairing. Our overall record is totally abysmal to say the very least.
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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by nelson66 » Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:24 pm

Time to promote the entire under 23 squad including the manager.....
I've been a Parkinson supporter through thick and thin ..... but like many others .... the camels back has been broken

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Harry Genshaw » Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:37 pm

^ I'm with that.

Promote Lee & get rid of every player out of contract .

We might as well have Amos as our first team keeper next year since we're still paying for him
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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Jim_McDonuts » Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:28 pm

Denial - the last 6 weeks (what the hell happened during that international break?)
Anger - today (but been brewing)
Bargaining - U23's (I too have been mentally reckoning 'let's play all of 'em [+ manager] - I mean f#ck it eh, what we got to lose')
Depression (pfffffff f f s )
Acceptance (really not there yet - I mean, way way off yet tbf)

Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory - jeez.

BWFC is a bad Jones though - I'll still be there next week, most likely spitting and howling with rage (why oh why I honestly don't know). Perhaps the wife'll take pity and rohyponal (sp?) me - waking up locked in a black box with white noise for company (yeah, I guess I'm still in stage 'D':)

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by bristol_Wanderer3 » Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:36 pm

Jim_McDonuts wrote:
Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:28 pm
the last 6 weeks (what the hell happened during that international break?)
This is the question. It is almost worthy of its own thread.

The last three games prior to the international break produced three decent performances in which we got five points. All three games, Reading (a), Sheffield Wed (a), Villa (h) we were not the worst team by all accounts. Each game we played 4-2-3-1 with ALF up front.

Just looking back the team selections and formations in the games since:

Leeds(a) - 4-2-3-1. Henry and Pratley injuted. Kirchoff and Derik in midfield. Spirited performance where we had chances to equalize after going 2-0 down but according to reports Leeds had the better of the chances and deserved to win. No shame there Leeds have good players.

Birmingham(h) 4-2-3-1. I was at this game. Lackluster dispay, where we played at a slow tempo and played it long to ALF way too much against a huge side. We didn't create a chance the whole game.

Derby (a) 3-5-2, which became 4-2-3-1 after half time. Sounds like we were terrible and deserved the 3-0 drubbing.

Millwall(h) 4-2-3-1. Again from being at this game, we tried hard, did ok until they scored just after the half hour mark, but were second best after that. Millwall were competent all over the pitch and that was easily enough to be the better team against us.

Barnsley (a) 3-5-2, again switching to 4-2-3-1 after a poor first half. We actually were the better team in the 2nd half by all accounts and were only prevented from winning by a 93rd minute equalizer. The likes of DSB point to how we attacked with attacking full backs and looked good doing so.

Wolves (h) 4-2-3-1. Again from being at this game, we did well for 15 minutes, then they scored and we were terrible and they, despite playing in 3rd gear, easily deserved the 4-0 scoreline. They are a top team of course, but we wilted badly.

Burton (a) 4-2-3-1. Did ok it seems for 20-25 mins, then they scored and it was awful by all accounts.

So the themes I am getting are:

1.) Lots of changes to team selection and formation. We changed the starting formation in five successive games. The 3-5-2 has proved terrible each time we have tried it since the international break. And, to be honest it has been terrible all season with the exception of the Bristol City and Fulham home games, where we played a more attacking version of it.

2.) We aren't creating many chances, perhaps with the exception of 2nd half Barnsley.

3.) Our heads are going down when we concede.

4.) We are conceding a lot more goals than we were at any point of the season since September. And we seem to be conceding a lot of goals from set pieces, and early in games. We have been losing at half time in each game since the international break.

If I had to pick out a reason from what I have seen, I would say physical and mental tiredness. We seem to have noticeably less energy out on the pitch, and heads drop when we go behind, as though there is no belief that we can get back into the game. Yet a lot of the players such as Flanagan, Taylor, Noone, Buckley, ALF should be relatively fresh. Are we missing Vela's pressing? I keep wondering if there is something affecting morale behind the scenes? It is very strange whatever it is....

Can anyone shed any more light?

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by DJBlu » Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:13 pm

The team that beat Aston Villa 1 - 0 at home was the same but for Noone and Dervite today. All that was missing today was snow to slow the other team down to our pace.

Selling Gary Madine has sent this club down as we have a manager in place who is too stubborn/inept? to change the way he manages the game.

I've fast run out of patience to care enough anymore.

I don't think I'll be bothered with this if Phil Parkinson is here next season as we will just be in for another load of shite.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Sun Apr 29, 2018 1:49 am

Jim McDonuts – I can tell I'm in "bargaining" because I'm planning to go to Luton and Wycombe next season. Ooh, new grounds!

As is often the case, Bristol's post is a good thorough look at the situation and does well to highlight the problems. But in many ways it comes down to the classic two problems of relegated teams: not scoring enough, and conceding too many.

Arguably the first is because we sold Madine (who, let's not forget, was nobody's idea of a Championship striker two years ago until Parkinson somehow made him hot property). Undeniably the second is down to the coaching and selection – along with the law of averages considering the somewhat fortunate run we had: from Christmas to mid-March we picked up 20 points by scoring 10 goals (five 1-0 wins, four 1-1 draws and a 0-0, plus one goal in five defeats.

The table is always a meritocracy. If you don't finish above the dots, you didn't deserve to finish above the dots, and don't give me any ballad about big crowds or club history or financial trouble or lovely football or plucky performances or any of that shit. We could hardly have asked for an easier run-in, we could hardly have asked for our relegation rivals to be more shit, and we could hardly ask for the final fixtures to be more in our favour – Every. Single. One. of our rivals playing a promotion-seeking side requiring points. Trouble is, none of that means owt if we can't win. Today, we got beat by a team that's been shit all season, and what's more we did it in a cowardly, defensive, unproductive, zero-shots-on-target, timid, shitbag way. That leads me to conclude that we won't beat Forest next week so it doesn't matter if Barnsley face Barcelona, Burton travel to Bayern Munich and Birmingham are sent over barbed wire into machine-gun fire. We'll be very lucky to survive on 43 points. If we don't win, we don't survive, and we can't complain.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by irie Cee Bee » Sun Apr 29, 2018 3:01 am

Lets not fool ourselves. Recently we have looked like a very poor team. Even Ameobi seems to have lost the ability to control a football with his feet and everyone else is afraid to hold unto the ball for another second to pick a good pass, preferring to get rid of it quickly... anywhere.

Something has gone very wrong in the camp. Was it KAs "motivational" contract threats? The players have stopped playing.

Lets start afresh in League 1. New Manager, and no renewal of contracts. Lets blood our young players, that is all assuming we will still have a club to support.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Athertonian » Sun Apr 29, 2018 10:12 am

We have a mix of expressions. Selling Madine? what if Madine was still here? Money problems transfer embargo winding up orders et al.

Parky has had a lot to deal with but, we were five points above the relegation zone without Madine? and doing ok without him. His team selections have really been so confusing in recent weeks than at any other time.

Football hasn't been good to watch which will have a massive impact on season ticket sales next term. The fact we have only scored thirteen goals this year tells the whole story.

Will Parky be the best man for the job next term or, will a fresh manager with fresh ideas be a better option? I'm not convinced by either. I have said all along should the club be relegated again I fear for the future of the club. Should the worst happen and we are relegated It will take a mighty effort by the club to regain a place in the Championship.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by Peter Thompson » Sun Apr 29, 2018 10:31 am

We need a manager who's primary aim in 'every' game is not to set up for a 0-0 - we need a manager who does not just believe in long / hoof ball regardless of who we have up front, we need a manager who actually wants to play through midfield with movement & pace, a manager who thinks about how we can pose problems for opposition teams, not just how to nullify them.

Parkinson is a likable person, who is obviously hurting like the fans are - but he's a dinosaur as a manager, he's a dinosaur in how he likes / prefers to play football. We will never progress as a football team with Parkinson as manager because he will not be able to change his footballing philosophy of defensive long ball football....if all of a sudden Ken finds some spare cash down the back of his sofa (yes I know that's highly doubtful) - who do you think Parkinson would spend that money on, a creative midfielder or a 6ft 5" striker....I think most know the answer to that.

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Re: A survival party brewing, or will we be drowning our sorrows? Burton v BWFC 28/4/2018 3pm

Post by palindromeofbolton » Sun Apr 29, 2018 1:55 pm

Kenny speaks:
There has been a great deal of comment about the defensive strategy and team setup recently and we have taken this on board and having discussed this with the manager, l can assure you, that there will be a positive and offensive line up against Nottingham Forest this Sunday.
https://www.bwfc.co.uk/news/2018/april/ ... chairman7/

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