A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:04 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:40 pm
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:19 pm
Oh, you and your worst-case scenarios :mrgreen:
Its not a fanciful one though. If we can go up this season it could be the start of a magical rise all the way up to 4th bottom in the championship!
:D
I'll level with you: after last time, and with football's finances as they are, I'm not sure I want to be back in the Champo.

Whether that'll change with All This, I dunno. But I don't fancy being back in a place where I'm worried for my club's future, or (perhaps correlating inversely) watching us get arses bagged every week.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:42 pm

I think if we stop chasing the dream, that'd be me done. I'm not suggesting we put the Club in jeopardy to do that - just for clarity - so it might take some time. :-) But I think the minute you settle for an "not progressing" plan, there's only one way you're going to go...

You can have the conversation about any League. What if we only have the budget for L2 and not L1, are we really saying we shouldn't try and win the League to go up to L1?

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:50 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:04 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:40 pm
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:19 pm
Oh, you and your worst-case scenarios :mrgreen:
Its not a fanciful one though. If we can go up this season it could be the start of a magical rise all the way up to 4th bottom in the championship!
:D
I'll level with you: after last time, and with football's finances as they are, I'm not sure I want to be back in the Champo.

Whether that'll change with All This, I dunno. But I don't fancy being back in a place where I'm worried for my club's future, or (perhaps correlating inversely) watching us get arses bagged every week.
FV's business plan is getting into the championship and midtable and then attracting further investment or selling...so I think you might prefer the lower leagues but Sharon's pockets definitely do not!

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:53 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:42 pm
I think if we stop chasing the dream, that'd be me done. I'm not suggesting we put the Club in jeopardy to do that - just for clarity - so it might take some time. :-) But I think the minute you settle for an "not progressing" plan, there's only one way you're going to go...

You can have the conversation about any League. What if we only have the budget for L2 and not L1, are we really saying we shouldn't try and win the League to go up to L1?
Absolutely this. I want to see us back in the top flight but not at any cost and not by spending money we don't have. If we can't get there then fine but at least try to. I see FV as being ambitious for the next half decade and then trying to offload or find investors and to do that we need to be within striking distance of premiership riches (if they still exist). I've absolutely no interest in watching a club that's happy bumming around league 1 or 2. And thankfully I don't think Bolton are that club - even if a few fans are that way inclined.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Bertie Wooster » Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:15 pm

Evatt needs to start Delfouneso tonight IMO and go with a front 4, play with proper passion & intensity for 90 mins and put them under pressure, we don't need 3 central midfielders at home. Saying that after Saturday I'm convinced that they have bottled it, Carlisle will have watched the Grimsby game and they will start quickly and probably score inside the 1st 10 mins and go on to win.

I honestly can't see us winning tonight but I very much hope that I'm wrong - we normally play ok on Tuesday nights, but I'm still not confident that they have it in them to raise their game under a bit of pressure.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:27 pm

Bertie Wooster wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:15 pm

I honestly can't see us winning tonight but I very much hope that I'm wrong - we normally play ok on Tuesday nights, but I'm still not confident that they have it in them to raise their game under a bit of pressure.
Not even considering we've got to third top from nowhere ? I'd argue that mate.
Si Deus pro nobis, quis contra nos?

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:43 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:42 pm
I think if we stop chasing the dream, that'd be me done. I'm not suggesting we put the Club in jeopardy to do that - just for clarity - so it might take some time. :-) But I think the minute you settle for an "not progressing" plan, there's only one way you're going to go...

You can have the conversation about any League. What if we only have the budget for L2 and not L1, are we really saying we shouldn't try and win the League to go up to L1?
Having seen the debt-to-turnover ratios of clubs in the leagues, I'd say there's no comparison. The Championship is a financial basket case in which almost without exception (maybe Barnsley rn) all clubs lose millions and millions, every single season, in a division which has sadly become an expensive anteroom to the Premier League trough. As I say, that might change, but we'll see.

And of course, if we were to be chasing promotion from the Third, I wouldn't want us to fail. I didn't last time, and I won't next time (because there will be a next time.) I'm just saying that the prospect of trying to fight a fair fight in that division worries me - and if that is FV's business plan, then they obviously feel the same. It's a fool's game.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Bertie Wooster » Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:46 pm

TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:27 pm
Bertie Wooster wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:15 pm

I honestly can't see us winning tonight but I very much hope that I'm wrong - we normally play ok on Tuesday nights, but I'm still not confident that they have it in them to raise their game under a bit of pressure.
Not even considering we've got to third top from nowhere ? I'd argue that mate.
There wasn't & isn't the same pressure TD - its different going on a great run from being near the bottom, playing catch up as opposed to being in the top 3, with everything in their own hands and potentially throwing away automatic promotion if they don't win the last 4 games, as was shown on Saturday.

Look we are all BWFC fans and we all ultimately want the same thing & outcome, I'll be absolutely delighted and will celebrate with a good few beers if we can get 3 points tonight, but I do have reservations about the mentality & desire of the squad - I'm not saying that I'm right and would love to be proved wrong but it is my opinion and is a concern (perhaps only for me ?)

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Mar » Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:57 pm

Feeling more confident about this one tonight than I was about Grimsby. That being said I was expecting Grimsby to park the bus and not attack us as much as they did so that didn't work out to plan. I'm certainly expecting a reaction this time around.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 5:09 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:43 pm
Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:42 pm
I think if we stop chasing the dream, that'd be me done. I'm not suggesting we put the Club in jeopardy to do that - just for clarity - so it might take some time. :-) But I think the minute you settle for an "not progressing" plan, there's only one way you're going to go...

You can have the conversation about any League. What if we only have the budget for L2 and not L1, are we really saying we shouldn't try and win the League to go up to L1?
Having seen the debt-to-turnover ratios of clubs in the leagues, I'd say there's no comparison. The Championship is a financial basket case in which almost without exception (maybe Barnsley rn) all clubs lose millions and millions, every single season, in a division which has sadly become an expensive anteroom to the Premier League trough. As I say, that might change, but we'll see.

And of course, if we were to be chasing promotion from the Third, I wouldn't want us to fail. I didn't last time, and I won't next time (because there will be a next time.) I'm just saying that the prospect of trying to fight a fair fight in that division worries me - and if that is FV's business plan, then they obviously feel the same. It's a fool's game.
The comparison is pretty moot in a "you've got what you've got" model. If you can't afford L1, you can't afford it, irrespective of whether it's debt to turnover is less than the Championship, you just go up, maybe spend a little more as the revenues are maybe a couple of mill higher on average per club in L1 from L2, and hope it's enough to keep you there... There's plenty of owners who've had plenty to say about the cost of running a L1 or L2 football team :-)

https://gameofthepeople.com/2020/10/09/ ... g-crisis-2

...So for sure, we'd want to be in a sustainable position. If we're still in the third tier in 15 years time, then I suspect I'll be getting bored with it. :-)

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:01 pm

TEAM NEWS Unchanged side.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:06 pm

Bertie Wooster wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:46 pm
TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:27 pm
Bertie Wooster wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:15 pm

I honestly can't see us winning tonight but I very much hope that I'm wrong - we normally play ok on Tuesday nights, but I'm still not confident that they have it in them to raise their game under a bit of pressure.
Not even considering we've got to third top from nowhere ? I'd argue that mate.
There wasn't & isn't the same pressure TD - its different going on a great run from being near the bottom, playing catch up as opposed to being in the top 3, with everything in their own hands and potentially throwing away automatic promotion if they don't win the last 4 games, as was shown on Saturday.

Look we are all BWFC fans and we all ultimately want the same thing & outcome, I'll be absolutely delighted and will celebrate with a good few beers if we can get 3 points tonight, but I do have reservations about the mentality & desire of the squad - I'm not saying that I'm right and would love to be proved wrong but it is my opinion and is a concern (perhaps only for me ?)
As it should be Bertie, as it should be. :wink: Meantime, COME ON YOU WHITES....... :oyea: :oyea: :oyea:
Si Deus pro nobis, quis contra nos?

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:09 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:01 pm
TEAM NEWS Unchanged side.
Would have been tempted to make a couple of changes to freshen things up and see if Miller could get a start as we do lack goals. Feel Evatt has settled on this side though and isn’t for changing. Hope subs come into it early if not going to plan,

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Worthy4England » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:10 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:01 pm
TEAM NEWS Unchanged side.
Not to universal acclaim in the Twattersphere.... :-)

COYWM

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:34 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:10 pm
universal acclaim in the Twattersphere.... :-)
Such a thing doesn't exist.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by The_Gun » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:40 pm

Not sure I’m fully supportive of lack of rotation at this stage, but I will defer to the infinite wisdom of our glorious leader.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:42 pm

I don't know Zanzala, but apparently he isn't playing which Marc Iles thinks is a plus. ?
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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:43 pm

TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:42 pm
I don't know Zanzala, but apparently he isn't playing which Marc Iles thinks is a plus. ?
He’s massive and a striker that’s all I know. Oh and heard a few say he’s overrated.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by The_Gun » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:46 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:43 pm
TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:42 pm
I don't know Zanzala, but apparently he isn't playing which Marc Iles thinks is a plus. ?
He’s massive and a striker that’s all I know. Oh and heard a few say he’s overrated.
We don’t have a great recent record of dealing with massive strikers, so I’ll take that as a positive.

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Re: A Borderline affair.Bolton v Carlisle, Home 20-04-21. 1900..

Post by officer_dibble » Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:46 pm

Well, I didn’t think I was worried but my arse has just told me different 😂

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