Statement of Capital

Where fellow sufferers gather to share the pain, longing and unrequited transfer requests that make being a Wanderer what it is...

Moderator: Zulus Thousand of em

Post Reply
Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:04 pm

:roll:
Last edited by Gudnib on Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:23 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 9:08 am
Gudnib wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 8:45 am
Still no Confirmation statement from FV so still no news on exactly who has paid £9.5million for 34% of FVWL shares (which, of course, owns 100% of BWFC).
Really? I'm on tenterhooks here
Let me try to put this another way.
Who would be daft enough, if it was their own money? :conf: :conf:

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:18 pm

Congratulations to the Supporters Trust. It has produced its 2021 accounts and sent them to members a day in advance of its AGM tomorrow. Not that there's much too 'em mind you but the board member who wanted to 'get rid of these people' has departed himself, along with a couple of others.

Apparently:
'The objectives of the Society are to strengthen the bonds between the supporters and the football club and to achieve the maximum possible influence of the members in the running and ownership of the club'.

All very laudable except that there was a major change in share ownership three months back and neither the club nor the Supporters Trust have told us who the new shareholders are or how many shares the old shareholders now own.

officer_dibble
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 11747
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 9:33 pm
Location: Leeds

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Jan 26, 2022 7:54 pm


Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:42 pm

officer_dibble wrote:
Wed Jan 26, 2022 7:54 pm
Paging gudnib:
https://t.co/Bc2a5nlGA6
Not exactly quick out of the blocks and only half the story but better than the BN, the ST and Wanderersways who seemed to have been quite oblivious. Until FV come clean, we won't know the true facts and they should have filed their statement by close of play on 24 January 2022.

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Thu Jan 27, 2022 3:14 pm

Who tipped off the Telegraph then? Is it just coincidence that this emerged 48 hours after Lord Agnew's resignation?

Still no sign of the overdue Confirmation statement and still no explanation of where any of these make-believe numbers came from. What about Maguire K and Professor Lalaland. Anyone heard from either of those two?

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:33 am

I'm not going to castigate Sharon for taking out this loan or for converting loans to shares but I would like to know the truth, not some contrivance of the truth.

If the only money FV has got from 'the taxpayer' is £5million, that should have 'bought' 18% of the company at £6.7878 per share or 14% at £8.48746. Both of these figures are, of course, shocking overvaluations but if the taxpayer has ended up with a derisory 8% where have the rest of the shares gone?

User avatar
TANGODANCER
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 40426
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:35 pm
Location: Between the Regency and the Rubaiyat and forever trying to light penny candles from stars.

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by TANGODANCER » Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:42 am

Blimey mate. Do you have an Abacus beside your bed? :wink:
Si Deus pro nobis, quis contra nos?

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:58 am

TANGODANCER wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:42 am
Blimey mate. Do you have an Abacus beside your bed? :wink:
No mate. Neither have I a pitchfork nor rose-tinted specs. Its public money and Sharon must account for it.

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Fri Jan 28, 2022 11:48 am

The plot thickens. Another document has arrived at Companies House in the last hour.
You can't see it yet but whenever there's a contrivance there's often a cock-up somewhere alongside it. Lets see what this latest effort says.

User avatar
TANGODANCER
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 40426
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:35 pm
Location: Between the Regency and the Rubaiyat and forever trying to light penny candles from stars.

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by TANGODANCER » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:03 pm

Gudnib wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:58 am
TANGODANCER wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:42 am
Blimey mate. Do you have an Abacus beside your bed? :wink:
No mate. Neither have I a pitchfork nor rose-tinted specs. Its public money and Sharon must account for it.
I was actually referring to the time of your post , 9-30 am, not the topic.. :|
Si Deus pro nobis, quis contra nos?

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Sat Jan 29, 2022 8:44 am

TANGODANCER wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:03 pm
Gudnib wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:58 am
TANGODANCER wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:42 am
Blimey mate. Do you have an Abacus beside your bed? :wink:
No mate. Neither have I a pitchfork nor rose-tinted specs. Its public money and Sharon must account for it.
I was actually referring to the time of your post , 9-30 am, not the topic.. :|
Thanks TD. I tend to do my 'what the heck's going on' thinking before I get up in a morning and I honestly don't need any calculating aids to know when summat doesn't smell right.

This latest episode seems to me to fall into the 'taking candy from a baby' category rather than 'cautious and prudent business practice' . Five million of taxpayers' smackers should buy you a bit more than 8% of not very much.

FV are keeping us waiting for the list of shareholders and shareholdings at 10 January 2022 probably because Companies House will let them get away with it. It should have been on the file by 24 January at the latest. This new document, dated 21 January, is still not available to see but, in the circumstances, is beginning to take on the guise of something between a smokescreen and a diversion.

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Sun Jan 30, 2022 10:40 am

Well that was a day to remember, wasn't it just? An hour or so before kick-off, Companies House revealed the latest filed document on FV's share capital and what a tangled web it seems to be. Sparing you all the detail, it remains indecipherable without facts that are still under wraps, despite the legal obligation to disclose.

The COVID loan schemes were plainly a well-intentioned policy that turned into an omnishambles but you can't blame FV for taking advantage especially in the situation they were in. But lets not get carried away into believing that there was anything smart, clever or astute about it.

We know about the £5m loan because it was referred to, somewhat vaguely, in the last accounts but we don't know if there were any more loans that may still be on the books. And other than FGR, we don't know of any other club owners that have taken advantage of the situation who might presently have undisclosed and unconverted loans on their books.

Other clubs and supporters might well feel angry though if only Bolton and FGR have profited and it may be that the £1m grant to Bury was a pre-emptive attempt to diffuse or divert some of the anger in the knowledge that Lord Agnew was about to let off steam.

The share allocation granted in return for the £5m loan seems pathetic but would it really have been a good idea for the club or the government if it had been more significant or commensurate with the government's outlay? Isn't running football clubs challenging enough without some government appointed lackey putting an oar into every policy and every decision?

Have any of you completed the Supporters Trust Survey btw?

User avatar
TANGODANCER
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 40426
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:35 pm
Location: Between the Regency and the Rubaiyat and forever trying to light penny candles from stars.

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by TANGODANCER » Sun Jan 30, 2022 10:48 am

Sorry Gudnib, but even Ebenezer Scrooge couldn't diffuse the euphoria of our win this morning. The football prioritises all, because without it the rest is just financial hey-ho.
Si Deus pro nobis, quis contra nos?

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Sun Jan 30, 2022 11:10 am

TANGODANCER wrote:
Sun Jan 30, 2022 10:48 am
Sorry Gudnib, but even Ebenezer Scrooge couldn't diffuse the euphoria of our win this morning. The football prioritises all, because without it the rest is just financial hey-ho.
There's no footie without finance TD. You and I will both remember/never forget the Wanderers winning the FA Cup with a team that cost 11 x £10 signing on fees but those days are long gone.

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Mon Jan 31, 2022 10:32 am

Spare a thought for Lord Agnew. Its quite possible he'd have been carrying the can if he hadn't resigned but he reckons there's 'Zippo' detail on how the Treasury's going to tackle COVID cashgate.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... with-covid

There's plenty of detail to conjure with down at the Unibol though. We've now got £1 shares that folk have paid £1 per share for, £1 shares that folk have paid £6.78780 per share for, £1 shares that folk have paid £8.48476 per share for and £1 shares that folk have paid nowt for. And now we've also got £0.0001 shares that folk have paid all of £0.0001 per share for.

The only problem is we don't know who has paid what, who has not paid what and who owns what.

Oh what a tangled web we weave.........................................

Bruce Rioja
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 38000
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:19 pm
Location: Drifting into the arena of the unwell.

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Bruce Rioja » Tue Feb 01, 2022 6:34 am

To we know the details of the amortisation of the Covid loan, Gudnib?
May the bridges I burn light your way

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Tue Feb 01, 2022 3:11 pm

Bruce Rioja wrote:
Tue Feb 01, 2022 6:34 am
To we know the details of the amortisation of the Covid loan, Gudnib?
The short answer, Bruce, is 'not applicable'.

Anyone who would like an explanation of how amortisation affects player acquisition costs could do worse than take a look here.

http://priceoffootball.com/football-tra ... at-i-want/

There are other amortisation expenses that affect FV which arise because FV agreed to pay a lot more for the assets than the valuation of the 'tangible assets'. The difference is called 'intangible assets' and these are amortised. That's another story though.

The £5m government guaranteed COVID loan itself was real money but seems to have disappeared in exchange for something akin to a handful of magic beans without the magic. There might be other loans that we don't know about yet.

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Wed Feb 02, 2022 9:04 am

Momentum's building alright. Another win in Shrimpland on Saturday and who knows?

Meanwhile FV aren't half keeping the commercial lawyers busy. They don't come cheap.

Another 39 pages of documents arrived at Companies House yesterday but not the missing one. You know the one we all want to see, don't we lads?

Gudnib
Promising
Promising
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 4:14 pm

Re: Statement of Capital

Post by Gudnib » Fri Feb 04, 2022 9:24 am

Still no sign of the missing document at Companies House. BBB have plainly done a bum deal with at least £5m of taxpayers money (there may be more) and whilst a policy of 'least said, soonest mended' might have no legal justification why not try it if there is zilch chance of being held to account.

Sharon's interview has now had nearly 8,600 viewings. She said some interesting things that were plainly true and some others that didn't quite cut the mustard for me. Wigan, for example, are presently showing that you can turn a lower league club round quite quickly with money and a decent manager.

I'd be interested to know why Sharon thinks that 'one superfan is enough' and who precisely are the five investors she spoke of, how much each has put in and what share they have got for it.

'Every single thing you do is analysed', said Sharon. No it isn't, luv.

Meanwhile I notice that, because of COVID, Saint Marcus' MUCS Enterprises has got a three month extension for filing its accounts. COVID must have made it more difficult to add all the money up.

I'm keeping an eye out for the Wythenshawe food bank's accounts. I'm not expecting that they will have been experiencing the same difficulty.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: The_Gun and 17 guests