Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Worthy4England » Tue May 21, 2024 2:19 pm

Agree mate and no one wants us to play hoofball. It's just a dreamt up witch...look what you're going to get if we move away from the known to the unknown. Pompey played decent enough football from what I saw, probably alongside some turgid dig a result out stuff as happens to all teams on occasion...

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue May 21, 2024 3:05 pm

Pompey didn't hire Ainsworth, they hired an unproven manager in his 30s

You can flick Evatt and get perfectly decent football

if you hire Ainsworth, you get hoofball

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by boltonboris » Tue May 21, 2024 3:07 pm

Let's get rid of a manager with a reluctance to change his nice football
And hire a manager with a reluctance to change his horrible football

Sounds grrrrrrrreat
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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by GhostoftheBok » Tue May 21, 2024 3:12 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 3:05 pm
if you hire Ainsworth, you get hoofball
...and no "Plan B."

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Prufrock » Tue May 21, 2024 3:17 pm

I'd rather bleach my eyes out that it be Ainsworth. If that's what you want, get yourself one of those dungeons.

Ipswich and Plymouth did it last year, Pompey and Oxford this. The only teams to have gone up in the last two years not being modern and front foot have been spending 5 figures a week on individual players.

We need fewer points of failure, and ways to win when we're not at our best. We don't need to rip it all up.
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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by GhostoftheBok » Tue May 21, 2024 3:40 pm

The reality is that all the promoted managers got close to the sack last season. All three had fans calling for their heads, all got called bottlers, etc.

Mousinho and Bucks did genuinely good jobs. They navigated difficult moments when they could have lost their jobs, under really difficult circumstances for them both.

Warne didn't do anything much. He got away with it this season thanks to Evatt fecking up a bit more than him. Derby were, in truth, really lucky to go up.

So Evatt needs to come to terms with the fact he's blown it. He should have taken this team up and he's failed. He had multiple chances to sort it. I expected him to take one of those chances and he hasn't. I'm disappointed in him.

I can understand why some want him sacked. I think our best chance of promotion next season is to keep him and that's the only thing I care about.

He is starting the season with the best set-up of any club in the division. The three coming down are likely to be able to spend enough that by the end of the summer that's no longer the case, but it's where we are for now. Chances are that the top 6 next season will be between about a dozen teams and that 2-3 will massively under perform. We have to not be one of the 2-3.

Since January we've won 7 out of 19. Lost 3 and Drawn 9. 1.2 PPG, roughly. So we're basically Charlton.

We've conceded 24 goals in those 19 games. So about ~60 over a season when you allow for decimal places and a bit of rounding up. That's lower half stuff.

We scored 36. ~90 over a season. That's superb.

You can blame loads of things, but ultimately that's on the manager. Months of underperformance isn't something he can fob off on the players.

You have got to look reality in the face before you can move forward. Our weaknesses are fairly stark. Stark enough to be consistently targeted.

There are positives and there's a pathway to an excellent season, but first you have to account for the shite. You have got to sort out the defending and you've got to add a competitive edge in the toughest games.

If he stays then what he has to do is obvious. He has shored his sides up defensively before. So he has the ability to set it right.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Worthy4England » Tue May 21, 2024 4:10 pm

TBF, I think Ainsworth has fewer votes in favour than keeping Evatt - he's got one with maybe a second pick after Duff from Dibs...Move on. The "get ridders" sometimes don't help themselves much... :-)

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by GhostoftheBok » Tue May 21, 2024 4:13 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 4:10 pm
TBF, I think Ainsworth has fewer votes in favour than keeping Evatt - he's got one with maybe a second pick after Duff from Dibs...Move on. The "get ridders" sometimes don't help themselves much... :-)
They don't, but equally your point about "dead man walking" isn't miles off. Like I say, every promoted manager had a period in the season where their fans wanted them out. That's almost always the case in a League One campaign, because you're dealing with League One players.

If Evatt genuinely can't survive a single blip next season he's doomed, because there have been maybe half a dozen promotion campaigns in the past decade without one.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue May 21, 2024 4:55 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 4:10 pm
TBF, I think Ainsworth has fewer votes in favour than keeping Evatt - he's got one with maybe a second pick after Duff from Dibs...Move on. The "get ridders" sometimes don't help themselves much... :-)
Maybe but equally nobody wanted Parky or would want him now (me aside) yet he’s more likely to win us promotion than Evatt or a whole host. A lot of people on this forum skew to the ‘well as long as it’s nice football’ side whereas I suspect come December and January if we are miles off those in the ground would far rather an Ainsworth or Parky with us up there than the usual frailties under a ‘nice looking’ Evatt side.

Ultimately I don’t care how we play and next season is going to be a horrible horrible slog if we want to fight through and out of this league. I don’t think it will be pretty regardless.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Worthy4England » Tue May 21, 2024 5:31 pm

GhostoftheBok wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 4:13 pm
Worthy4England wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 4:10 pm
TBF, I think Ainsworth has fewer votes in favour than keeping Evatt - he's got one with maybe a second pick after Duff from Dibs...Move on. The "get ridders" sometimes don't help themselves much... :-)
They don't, but equally your point about "dead man walking" isn't miles off. Like I say, every promoted manager had a period in the season where their fans wanted them out. That's almost always the case in a League One campaign, because you're dealing with League One players.

If Evatt genuinely can't survive a single blip next season he's doomed, because there have been maybe half a dozen promotion campaigns in the past decade without one.
There are always going to be ups and downs - Season in L2 we were shite before Christmas (plenty of extenuating circs) but then stellar after Jan for results if not performances. Season 2, we blipped out for a few weeks, Season 3 pretty poor overall from Jan. There's blips (we've lost a game) and blips (we've surrendered the League). EFL cup is a sideshow and League Cup/FA Cup not overly important.

My concern here, given that there's likely to be at best more people than last year that have him at least on notice, if not in the go already bucket, that a tricky set of fixtures in the first 10 games could seal his fate, if they're below par - you're then looking for a new manager a quarter through the season.

I fell on "yeah go on then, give him another year last season." Next I'll be travelling with a fold-away pitch fork and spare bed-sheet (not literally, but you get the drift).

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by GhostoftheBok » Tue May 21, 2024 5:39 pm

Yeah, I wasn't arguing the point. Merely sort of agreeing with you, with a bit of an extra worry.

Evatt might be on a promotion season and people could still turn on a sixpence at the first sight of a hiccup.

"Here we go again" is bound to be a concern, even when we're going well.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Worthy4England » Tue May 21, 2024 5:53 pm

GhostoftheBok wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 5:39 pm
Yeah, I wasn't arguing the point. Merely sort of agreeing with you, with a bit of an extra worry.

Evatt might be on a promotion season and people could still turn on a sixpence at the first sight of a hiccup.

"Here we go again" is bound to be a concern, even when we're going well.
Think we're saying the same thing - I'm not actually one for booing during a game etc. so I'm talking metaphorically - as we've seen, plenty are. If they get wind in the sails early doors, then it's probably curtains.

He might have been on a promotion season this season - but wasn't, after overseeing three? months of overall, not good enough performances. The promise of jam tomorrow, for me, has run it's course.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by BWFC_Insane » Tue May 21, 2024 6:18 pm

GhostoftheBok wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 5:39 pm
Yeah, I wasn't arguing the point. Merely sort of agreeing with you, with a bit of an extra worry.

Evatt might be on a promotion season and people could still turn on a sixpence at the first sight of a hiccup.

"Here we go again" is bound to be a concern, even when we're going well.
Has to be automatic promotion and there is very little room for error. Mid 90’s maybe high 90’s next season I suspect.

So you can pretty much say 2PPG plus is the target from the off. Won’t be able to afford many runs below that.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by GhostoftheBok » Tue May 21, 2024 6:20 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 6:18 pm
So you can pretty much say 2PPG plus is the target from the off.
Has to be the target, yes.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by officer_dibble » Tue May 21, 2024 6:54 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 4:10 pm
TBF, I think Ainsworth has fewer votes in favour than keeping Evatt - he's got one with maybe a second pick after Duff from Dibs...Move on. The "get ridders" sometimes don't help themselves much... :-)
Both Duff and ainsworth have managed at a higher level than Evatt looks able to. Not particularly well mind! I get all the style merchants being up in arms but I think some of the criticism is unfair.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Wed May 22, 2024 6:45 pm

Lovely to get served this ad TODAY on the smoking hole where Twitter used to be
.
IMG_6807.jpeg
IMG_6807.jpeg (836.03 KiB) Viewed 460 times
.
Of the many things I don’t understand about the modern world, near the top is why the juddering arse-bags football-adjacent companies pay to serve outdated content

Maybe it’s legacy and they’re served up as freebies but it makes them look dense - if Twitter had done this to FourFourTwo when I was in charge I’d have been raging at them

Anyway, as you were

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Hoboh » Thu May 23, 2024 11:26 am

boltonboris wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 3:07 pm
Let's get rid of a manager with a reluctance to change his nice football
And hire a manager with a reluctance to change his horrible football

Sounds grrrrrrrreat
Mmmm never played much brilliant football under Sam, but we got what really matters, results.

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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by TANGODANCER » Thu May 23, 2024 12:08 pm

Hoboh wrote:
Thu May 23, 2024 11:26 am
boltonboris wrote:
Tue May 21, 2024 3:07 pm
Let's get rid of a manager with a reluctance to change his nice football
And hire a manager with a reluctance to change his horrible football

Sounds grrrrrrrreat
Mmmm never played much brilliant football under Sam, but we got what really matters, results.
We did have J.J Okocha, Nolan and Kev Davies mind.. :wink:

ae:) ae:)
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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by Prufrock » Thu May 23, 2024 12:53 pm

We played plenty of brilliant football under Sam until the last couple of seasons. I'd quite happily watch Jay Jay and Djorkaeff whatever shape you play!
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Re: Rising in Wembley's Glow: A Bolton Wanderers Tale - Bolton vs Oxford. 18th May 2024, 4.15pm

Post by boltonboris » Thu May 23, 2024 1:02 pm

Don't compare Gareth Ainsworth and Sam Allardyce
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