Arsenal v Bolton (match thread)

[Lofthouse Lower]

Tango, we will be lucky to see Davies getting on the end of one of Petrovs, Lee's cross from open play and he'll only score 2 or 3 max from open play with his head. I think he's scored about 15 in his whole career. The fact he already has made his run before the cross has been made means - for him to score with his head it needs to be absoloutely perfect and delivered right on his noggin.

Think of players like Scholes, Owen, Shearer, Fowler ect all under 6 foot but scored goals with their heads for fun, its all about clever movement and Davies well just isnt clever when it comes to making runs, watch him, he passes the ball, he then just runs to the back post behind the defender not adapting to where the ball's being played (Lampard does the simular thing for England).

I never stated - smash goalkicks to his head, what i mean by set pieces is if we have a free kick around the half way line or further in, Taylor has the delivery to cause havok in the box and Davies has the pressence to cause Mayhem when deep in thier box, he doesnt have to head it to anyone, he just needs to head it (it can bounce anywhere), now when he heads it from goal kicks and just heads it 9 times out of 10 it falls to one of thier players meaning they have possesion. Elmander is having to guess where he is heading the ball.

Thanks for all that. After watching Bolton for sixty years, from Nat onwards, I think I might know what heading a ball's about. Davies inevitably gets pushed, pulled and barged in the back when, as I said, jumping for headers eight feet off the deck. His job is to drag defenders around and stop them winning the headers, something he does with great success, although most of the time, until very recently, he's been the only one up there anyway. If he gets the right balls from the wings he scores, he did it against Chelsea and again the disallowed one against Fulham last season by doing just that. When was the last time we had running wingers who could deliver early balls? I've nothing at all against Elmander and Klasnic being up front, but against big defenders they won't have Davies's effect. Horses for courses and, for me, Arsenal need to be harrassed. Nobody's better at that than Davies.

That header was a corner not from open play. Davies gets pushed pulled and barged, oh yeah and he just stands there does he? Also its no good making sure the defenders dont win the headers at the half way line when its a 1/4 chance of us getting it anyway. Theres a difference when Elmander heads the ball, he directs it to a player, Davies just makes a nuiscance of himself and lets it hit his head randomly behind him which makes it close to impossible for someone to guess where he's going to head it. You know why Big sam didnt go for wingers? because he knew Davies wouldnt work in that system, he's a set piece player who takes the biggest defenders out of the equation. Arsenal dont need to be relaxed they need to be countered, if we attack them we will get hammered just like Blackpool did.

Come on Chris, I know you and I know that you don't believe or repeat any of this when in civilised company - so why do you persist in playing up to this ridiculous character?

[Prufrock]

First big test in terms of making my mind up on Mr Coyle. A chance to see whether we have a Tony Mowbray martyr type, or a proper football manager. If he plays Elmander AND Davies, ELmander has to play much deeper and make up the numbers in midfield, otherwise....*gulp*

Sorry Pru but I'm not sure if I follow this argument.

When do we ever take points of Arsenal at the Emirates?

If we'd done that quite often under more shall we say "pragmatic" managers in Allardyce and Megson then I could understand that line of thought.

IMO its not a game to judge Coyle in.

Can't see him playing 2 up front but I guess either way a point is unlikely.

Whether or not we get a point isn't what I'll judge him on, it's whether or not he has the nous to realise going away to Arsenal with two up top and a gung-ho attitude is only going to end in one, very, ugly way. Tony Mowbray stylee. I expect us to give ourselves every chance. There are a few ways, formation, and personnel-wise to do this.

[truewhite15]

Think of players like Scholes, Owen, Shearer, Fowler ect all under 6 foot but scored goals with their heads for fun, its all about clever movement and Davies well just isnt clever when it comes to making runs, watch him, he passes the ball, he then just runs to the back post behind the defender not adapting to where the ball's being played (Lampard does the simular thing for England).

The supply that the people you're comparing against is rather better than the supply Davies has had in his career. I think just about all the names you mention are better strikers than Davo for goalscoring ability - although Scholes is a midfielder, but Davo scores a higher percentage of his goals with his head than any of them and the frequency of him doing so is pretty good too. Shearer has a much higher frequency, but the % of goals he got from open play isn't hugely different than Davo's. Just as an aside, Shearer is 6 foot tall...

Headed goals.

Scholes - 18 out of 102 (17.6%) - 447 appearances - heads one in every 25 games...
Owen - 16 out of 147 (10.9%) - 308 appearances - 19.25 games
Fowler - 28 out of 163 (17.1%) - 379 appearances - 13.5 games
Shearer - 46 out of 260 (17.7%) - 441 appearances - 9.5 games
Davies - 22 out of 74 (29.7%) - 378 appearances - 17.1 games

People who know football.....

Oi, wiki boy. You know what them stats tell me, that they have all scored more open play headers than Davies, also they are all smaller than him and we play 90% of our game around Davies, thanks for clearing that up for me.

Erm. Did you look at those stats? Davies has scored more open-play headers than both Scholes and Owen, and for a player who does his best work outside the box, that's not a bad thing.

[ChrisC]

Vermaelan is out now .. Squillaci to make his debut. Im sure Davo will give him a nice welcome to the english game

[as]

Tango, we will be lucky to see Davies getting on the end of one of Petrovs, Lee's cross from open play and he'll only score 2 or 3 max from open play with his head. I think he's scored about 15 in his whole career. The fact he already has made his run before the cross has been made means - for him to score with his head it needs to be absoloutely perfect and delivered right on his noggin.

Think of players like Scholes, Owen, Shearer, Fowler ect all under 6 foot but scored goals with their heads for fun, its all about clever movement and Davies well just isnt clever when it comes to making runs, watch him, he passes the ball, he then just runs to the back post behind the defender not adapting to where the ball's being played (Lampard does the simular thing for England).

I never stated - smash goalkicks to his head, what i mean by set pieces is if we have a free kick around the half way line or further in, Taylor has the delivery to cause havok in the box and Davies has the pressence to cause Mayhem when deep in thier box, he doesnt have to head it to anyone, he just needs to head it (it can bounce anywhere), now when he heads it from goal kicks and just heads it 9 times out of 10 it falls to one of thier players meaning they have possesion. Elmander is having to guess where he is heading the ball.

Thanks for all that. After watching Bolton for sixty years, from Nat onwards, I think I might know what heading a ball's about. Davies inevitably gets pushed, pulled and barged in the back when, as I said, jumping for headers eight feet off the deck. His job is to drag defenders around and stop them winning the headers, something he does with great success, although most of the time, until very recently, he's been the only one up there anyway. If he gets the right balls from the wings he scores, he did it against Chelsea and again the disallowed one against Fulham last season by doing just that. When was the last time we had running wingers who could deliver early balls? I've nothing at all against Elmander and Klasnic being up front, but against big defenders they won't have Davies's effect. Horses for courses and, for me, Arsenal need to be harrassed. Nobody's better at that than Davies.

That header was a corner not from open play. Davies gets pushed pulled and barged, oh yeah and he just stands there does he? Also its no good making sure the defenders dont win the headers at the half way line when its a 1/4 chance of us getting it anyway. Theres a difference when Elmander heads the ball, he directs it to a player, Davies just makes a nuiscance of himself and lets it hit his head randomly behind him which makes it close to impossible for someone to guess where he's going to head it. You know why Big sam didnt go for wingers? because he knew Davies wouldnt work in that system, he's a set piece player who takes the biggest defenders out of the equation. Arsenal dont need to be relaxed they need to be countered, if we attack them we will get hammered just like Blackpool did.

Words fail me.

Ever thought of getting yourself a girlfriend?

[Prufrock]

Vermaelan is out now .. Squillaci to make his debut. Im sure Davo will give him a nice welcome to the english game

He's wank. I hate the bastard hope.

[ratbert]

http://www.the-wanderer.co.uk/bolton/Th ... rsenal-916

Gary the Enfield fires away on this weekend's match.

Oh, and a match reporter vacancy is available...

[SonsOfThunder]

So are Van Persie, Walcott and Vermaelen playing?

It seems like the bounce of the ball has been going our way for the past couple of weeks so hopefully that will continue. I agree that a 4-5-1 is probably the best formation to give us a fighting chance. If Brum can go up 2-0 on our 4-4-2 with relative ease then Arsenal...

[Gary the Enfield]

The big question is who's going tomorrow?

If none of you buggers is going I'll give Big Red a miss and have a pint with the ne'er do well's at the Draycott Arms (opposite the away supporter's entrance)

Anyway, enjoy the game!

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

The big question is who's going tomorrow?

If none of you buggers is going I'll give Big Red a miss and have a pint with the ne'er do well's at the Draycott Arms (opposite the away supporter's entrance)

Anyway, enjoy the game!

Not I, sir. But enjoy it. I admire your in-preview optimism and I like your idea about Wenger resting players pre-Europe, but that lot don't play till Wednesday and even then it's a home match with Braga - impressive in Portugal last season but hardly a fixture to cause fear. It's arguably more likely that the players might fancy that game more than they fancy facing us. After all, you know what to expect when you play Bolton...

[jaffka]

Tango, we will be lucky to see Davies getting on the end of one of Petrovs, Lee's cross from open play and he'll only score 2 or 3 max from open play with his head. I think he's scored about 15 in his whole career. The fact he already has made his run before the cross has been made means - for him to score with his head it needs to be absoloutely perfect and delivered right on his noggin.

Think of players like Scholes, Owen, Shearer, Fowler ect all under 6 foot but scored goals with their heads for fun, its all about clever movement and Davies well just isnt clever when it comes to making runs, watch him, he passes the ball, he then just runs to the back post behind the defender not adapting to where the ball's being played (Lampard does the simular thing for England).

I never stated - smash goalkicks to his head, what i mean by set pieces is if we have a free kick around the half way line or further in, Taylor has the delivery to cause havok in the box and Davies has the pressence to cause Mayhem when deep in thier box, he doesnt have to head it to anyone, he just needs to head it (it can bounce anywhere), now when he heads it from goal kicks and just heads it 9 times out of 10 it falls to one of thier players meaning they have possesion. Elmander is having to guess where he is heading the ball.

Thanks for all that. After watching Bolton for sixty years, from Nat onwards, I think I might know what heading a ball's about. Davies inevitably gets pushed, pulled and barged in the back when, as I said, jumping for headers eight feet off the deck. His job is to drag defenders around and stop them winning the headers, something he does with great success, although most of the time, until very recently, he's been the only one up there anyway. If he gets the right balls from the wings he scores, he did it against Chelsea and again the disallowed one against Fulham last season by doing just that. When was the last time we had running wingers who could deliver early balls? I've nothing at all against Elmander and Klasnic being up front, but against big defenders they won't have Davies's effect. Horses for courses and, for me, Arsenal need to be harrassed. Nobody's better at that than Davies.

That header was a corner not from open play. Davies gets pushed pulled and barged, oh yeah and he just stands there does he? Also its no good making sure the defenders dont win the headers at the half way line when its a 1/4 chance of us getting it anyway. Theres a difference when Elmander heads the ball, he directs it to a player, Davies just makes a nuiscance of himself and lets it hit his head randomly behind him which makes it close to impossible for someone to guess where he's going to head it. You know why Big sam didnt go for wingers? because he knew Davies wouldnt work in that system, he's a set piece player who takes the biggest defenders out of the equation. Arsenal dont need to be relaxed they need to be countered, if we attack them we will get hammered just like Blackpool did.

Words fail me.

Ever thought of getting yourself a girlfriend?

He did but SKD sha**ed her

[Worthy4England]

Think of players like Scholes, Owen, Shearer, Fowler ect all under 6 foot but scored goals with their heads for fun, its all about clever movement and Davies well just isnt clever when it comes to making runs, watch him, he passes the ball, he then just runs to the back post behind the defender not adapting to where the ball's being played (Lampard does the simular thing for England).

The supply that the people you're comparing against is rather better than the supply Davies has had in his career. I think just about all the names you mention are better strikers than Davo for goalscoring ability - although Scholes is a midfielder, but Davo scores a higher percentage of his goals with his head than any of them and the frequency of him doing so is pretty good too. Shearer has a much higher frequency, but the % of goals he got from open play isn't hugely different than Davo's. Just as an aside, Shearer is 6 foot tall...

Headed goals.

Scholes - 18 out of 102 (17.6%) - 447 appearances - heads one in every 25 games...
Owen - 16 out of 147 (10.9%) - 308 appearances - 19.25 games
Fowler - 28 out of 163 (17.1%) - 379 appearances - 13.5 games
Shearer - 46 out of 260 (17.7%) - 441 appearances - 9.5 games
Davies - 22 out of 74 (29.7%) - 378 appearances - 17.1 games

People who know football.....

Oi, wiki boy. You know what them stats tell me, that they have all scored more open play headers than Davies, also they are all smaller than him and we play 90% of our game around Davies, thanks for clearing that up for me.

Be delighted to know where they tell you where they were from open play or not? Just post me the link, I'd love to go have a look.

Either way you said they score headers for fun which like most of the bollocks you spout is clearly untrue. I'd have expected a much bigger differential, but now you're saying actually half of 'em don't score headers for fun, but that's because they're dwarfs?

What those stats tell me, is you have no clue what you're talking about - not that I needed any statistics to be sure of that.

[Jakerbeef]

Oh, and a match reporter vacancy is available...

On it.


Some predictions for tomorrow, in no particular order.

1- An Arsenal penalty.
2- Davo to get sod-all from the ref.
3- Screaming from their players when tackled.
4- Howling from their fans when their players are tackled. Or possibly cheering if one of our boys get stretchered off.
5- Maybe, just maybe- a draw.

[hisroyalgingerness]

Is it a horrible time to point out that we'll never have a better chance of getting somert from the Emirates?

[Gary the Enfield]

Is it a horrible time to point out that we'll never have a better chance of getting somert from the Emirates?

Great minds think alike. Fools seldom differ.

[William the White]

Nice, upbeat preview, GtE...

May your desires come to fruition, sweet as a September nectarine...

[Sir Nut]

Think of players like Scholes, Owen, Shearer, Fowler ect all under 6 foot but scored goals with their heads for fun, its all about clever movement and Davies well just isnt clever when it comes to making runs, watch him, he passes the ball, he then just runs to the back post behind the defender not adapting to where the ball's being played (Lampard does the simular thing for England).

The supply that the people you're comparing against is rather better than the supply Davies has had in his career. I think just about all the names you mention are better strikers than Davo for goalscoring ability - although Scholes is a midfielder, but Davo scores a higher percentage of his goals with his head than any of them and the frequency of him doing so is pretty good too. Shearer has a much higher frequency, but the % of goals he got from open play isn't hugely different than Davo's. Just as an aside, Shearer is 6 foot tall...

Headed goals.

Scholes - 18 out of 102 (17.6%) - 447 appearances - heads one in every 25 games...
Owen - 16 out of 147 (10.9%) - 308 appearances - 19.25 games
Fowler - 28 out of 163 (17.1%) - 379 appearances - 13.5 games
Shearer - 46 out of 260 (17.7%) - 441 appearances - 9.5 games
Davies - 22 out of 74 (29.7%) - 378 appearances - 17.1 games

People who know football.....

Oi, wiki boy. You know what them stats tell me, that they have all scored more open play headers than Davies, also they are all smaller than him and we play 90% of our game around Davies, thanks for clearing that up for me.

Erm. Did you look at those stats? Davies has scored more open-play headers than both Scholes and Owen, and for a player who does his best work outside the box, that's not a bad thing.

I dont think they are open play headers, i think they are headers from set pieces! 90% of them anyway!

[thebish]

I dont think they are open play headers, i think they are headers from set pieces! 90% of them anyway!

1. How on earth do you know? as requested - show us some evidence of this claim. (I'd wager a decent percentage of shearer's were from corners..)

2. What would it add/detract from your argument anyway? Are "open play headers" necessarily harder or more techically skilful? do they count more?

3. you've been trumped royally by hard evidence - and resorted to desperate and ludicrous guesswork and hunch....

[Il Pirate]

Does anyone know of a sream for this match? Commentry is on absolute radio from 1.30 (build up); but would love to see it on 'tinternet

[Trotski]

Does anyone know of a sream for this match? Commentry is on absolute radio from 1.30 (build up); but would love to see it on 'tinternet

myp2p is your friend. Streams galore.