Wanderers v Man U

[thebish]

You've been down south too long squire. I had a pie the other day that was very dry. It was shocking. IE- Very poor. It was a very poor tackle. You bring Robbo up, his performances have often been described as 'shocking'. I have certainly seen tackles of his described on here as 'shocking',

find me an example.. (that wasn't you!)

[Prufrock]

Jesus wept you can be hard work. You can live in a frightfully literal world sometimes. Since you are in Captain Pedantically Literal mode, it is perfectly possible I didn't certainly see a Paul Robinson tackle specifically described as shocking. I certainly could find examples of others on the forum using the word 'shocking' just to mean 'very poor'. In the meantime, care to continue to argue your point that the word 'shocking' can't, hasn't and isn't often used to mean 'very poor'? Other than how I used it in describing Jonny Evans' tackle on Saturday, which I maintain was very poor, or shocking.

Also, am I getting an answer as to whether or not you thought it was a red card? And if not what action would you have taken? Free kick either way?

Two can do belligerent.

[Lord Kangana]

Anyhoo, they're still all filthy red rags.

[TANGODANCER]

KD woul probably have gone for the top corner and at least made the keeper work

Well, his intentions would've been wrong and he'd have completely fluffed it too

Aye, okay. Like he did against Cech a couple of seasons ago?

[CAPSLOCK]

TD, do you want a bigger spade?

2 seasons, you say...good lord, man

[TANGODANCER]

TD, do you want a bigger spade?
2 seasons, you say...good lord, man

You come to bury Kev and not to praise him?

[William the White]

Jesus wept you can be hard work. You can live in a frightfully literal world sometimes. Since you are in Captain Pedantically Literal mode, it is perfectly possible I didn't certainly see a Paul Robinson tackle specifically described as shocking. I certainly could find examples of others on the forum using the word 'shocking' just to mean 'very poor'. In the meantime, care to continue to argue your point that the word 'shocking' can't, hasn't and isn't often used to mean 'very poor'? Other than how I used it in describing Jonny Evans' tackle on Saturday, which I maintain was very poor, or shocking.

Also, am I getting an answer as to whether or not you thought it was a red card? And if not what action would you have taken? Free kick either way?

Two can do belligerent.

Bet you do... thebish does answers better than Jeeves...

[Prufrock]

nahh - don't buy it. it is a shocking OUTCOME - but not a shocking tackle. as CAPS points out - quite rightly - robbo does those on a regular basis... never described as "shocking" on here...

either that - or you're wayyyyyyyyyyyy too easily shocked!

He was shocked to discover politicians are economical with the truth

Delicate soul is Pru

Indeed. You should all just be nicer to me.

Have you ever used shocking to mean 'very poor', CAPS?

[CrazyHorse]

Let's cut to the chase, where did you get the pie, pru? I need to know to give the place a wide berth.

[Prufrock]

Not much use to be honest. Was in the canteen at work, no idea where they get them from. Think it was just a duff one though, coz they've usually been pretty good.

[thebish]

Jesus wept you can be hard work. You can live in a frightfully literal world sometimes. Since you are in Captain Pedantically Literal mode, it is perfectly possible I didn't certainly see a Paul Robinson tackle specifically described as shocking.

so - the opposite of what you originally claimed then!!

I certainly could find examples of others on the forum using the word 'shocking' just to mean 'very poor'. In the meantime, care to continue to argue your point that the word 'shocking' can't, hasn't and isn't often used to mean 'very poor'? Other than how I used it in describing Jonny Evans' tackle on Saturday, which I maintain was very poor, or shocking.

many people do - you don't, though - you do not usually write in such a hyperbolic fashion - you are usually very measured. I thought it was born of you NOT being a Daily Mail reader... anyway - it was not YOUR "shocking" that I first responded to - you were leaping to the original offender's defence. I thought you were merely adopting his language - and he meant genuinely "shocking" - as in - you'd be "shocked" to see it.

Also, am I getting an answer as to whether or not you thought it was a red card? And if not what action would you have taken? Free kick either way?

no - I don't think it was a red card offense - unless we have all become Arsenal fans where we judge a tackle by how seriously someone is injured afterwards... please tell me we haven't become that?? have we?

[CAPSLOCK]

nahh - don't buy it. it is a shocking OUTCOME - but not a shocking tackle. as CAPS points out - quite rightly - robbo does those on a regular basis... never described as "shocking" on here...

either that - or you're wayyyyyyyyyyyy too easily shocked!

He was shocked to discover politicians are economical with the truth

Delicate soul is Pru

Indeed. You should all just be nicer to me.

Have you ever used shocking to mean 'very poor', CAPS?

Ermm, y'know, I might have (hope not, though) but I'd generally just say shite

Leaves little room for interpretation

[Lord Kangana]

I think you'll find Worthy calls Robbo shocking all the time, bish.

[thebish]

I think you'll find Worthy calls Robbo shocking all the time, bish.

find me one example...

[Lord Kangana]

Found it.

[Prufrock]

Jesus wept you can be hard work. You can live in a frightfully literal world sometimes. Since you are in Captain Pedantically Literal mode, it is perfectly possible I didn't certainly see a Paul Robinson tackle specifically described as shocking.

so - the opposite of what you originally claimed then!!

Meh, not necessarily. LL and Worthy have both described Robinson performances in less than glowing terms. At some point the word shocking may well have been used in such a sense. To go all John Prescott, it is certain however, than I haven't certainly seen it.

I certainly could find examples of others on the forum using the word 'shocking' just to mean 'very poor'. In the meantime, care to continue to argue your point that the word 'shocking' can't, hasn't and isn't often used to mean 'very poor'? Other than how I used it in describing Jonny Evans' tackle on Saturday, which I maintain was very poor, or shocking.

many people do - you don't, though - you do not usually write in such a hyperbolic fashion - you are usually very measured. I thought it was born of you NOT being a Daily Mail reader... anyway - it was not YOUR "shocking" that I first responded to - you were leaping to the original offender's defence. I thought you were merely adopting his language - and he meant genuinely "shocking" - as in - you'd be "shocked" to see it.

I do. I don't think to use the word 'shocking' to mean 'very poor' is necessarily hyperbolic anymore. That pie was shocking. My phone reception down by the Black Horse is shocking. My Nana often describes the weather as shocking. She doesn't say it wide-eyed and over the top, it has just come to mean a bit shit. Similarly I describe things as awesome I'm not actually awed by. Things are superb. Twere just an everyday word. In my original go on the Evans thing, well my original, calm, go, I didn't quote anyone. I used the word shocking off my own back. It's back on page 14 I think. .

Also, am I getting an answer as to whether or not you thought it was a red card? And if not what action would you have taken? Free kick either way?

no - I don't think it was a red card offense - unless we have all become Arsenal fans where we judge a tackle by how seriously someone is injured afterwards... please tell me we haven't become that?? have we?

The counter reaction against Arsenal style logic is understandable, but one must be careful not to go too far. I have seen, I think, two people suggest that the severity of Holden's injury is a factor in the decision. The rest have been sensible. Evans went in with his studs showing, his leg straight and his full body weight straight behind in the jump. The crucial question should not be whether or not serious injury occurs, but whether or not serious injury is likely to occur. That surely determines whether or not the challenge is reckless. The way Evans went in, in my view, with studs up and out, and at speed means he was likely to hurt his opponent seriously. The way Holden went in meant there was a possibility his opponent would get hurt, it is after all a full blooded contact sport, but the manner he went in meant it was unlikely Evans would get hurt. There is the difference in my mind. Any talk of getting the ball or not, and where the ball is hit is irrelevant when considering these straight red tackles, because getting the ball or not makes little relevance as to the recklessness of a tackle.

All pedantry aside, I'm interested in whether or not you thought Evans went in with his studs showing, and if so, why the tackle wasn't reckless given the pace it was made at. If you didn't think he did then we shall have to agree to disagree on what we have seen.

[Worthy4England]

I think you'll find Worthy calls Robbo shocking all the time, bish.

find me one example...

You sure?

I might have mentioned Pub XI occasionally, but don't remember using "shocking" for much, as I'm not often shocked...

[irie Cee Bee]

It was a reckless and dangerous tackle. Evans saw Holden coming and decided to go through him with full force, studs up. Definitely red.

It may not have been deliberately to injure him, but he made the decision to be a tough guy and go through Stuart. Stuart also went in, but his tackle was to win the ball. He tried to tackle.

Evans intention, based on how he jumped in was to get both man and maybe, the ball.

Red card for me.

[thebish]

All pedantry aside, I'm interested in whether or not you thought Evans went in with his studs showing, and if so, why the tackle wasn't reckless given the pace it was made at. If you didn't think he did then we shall have to agree to disagree on what we have seen.[/i]

I think the phrase "studs showing" is one of those commentator phrases that has crept in. In this instance - the ball was on the floor - it was a sliding attempt to get the ball.

if you slide in to get a ball - then, yes, unless you stupidly attempt to get the ball with your knee (like Holden did) - then some of your studs will be visible.

Robinson makes this kind of tackle all the time - sometimes takes the ball - sometimes doesn't - but I have NEVER seen his tackles described on here as "shocking" or "very poor" in the sense that he should be instantly red-carded.

the pace of the tackle was about two players showing do-or-die commitment - this happens all the time - sometimes someone gets injured, often not. we should not scream and shout for the players to be sent off simply on the basis that an injury occurs.

[Lord Kangana]

None of this alters their status as filthy red vermin I hope.