The Debt.

[StaffsTrotter]

So you are just aiming to squash any flickers of optimism then ?

FWIW my gut feeling is a deal will be done and admin will be avoided. At this moment I'm lets say apprehensive, about our likely new owners

Nah. Just trying to be realistic.
When you look back a few years we were punching above our weight but we did have a successful manager, a (fairly)wealthy owner and a board of experienced finance and management professionals.

sorry was directed at LLS - got caught out by the max quotes rule ...

always interesting the punching above weight logic, which has connotations of a 'natural' place in the pecking order. Most clubs need a wealthy backer and if you are in the PL that gives a huge shot in the arm. Strikes me there are lots of PL clubs who could be classed as punching above their weight - e.g. swansea, bournmouth, w brom watford, palace etc and long may they do so. Living where I do get to know a lot about stoke. Are they punching above their weight ? - before they sneaked into prem their gates were 11k to 13k and PL survival and success, has relied on P Coates and his Bet 365 empire pouring millions into that club.

[BWFC_Insane]

Kevin Davies has just tweeted....
What's the chance of the fans/local companies raising a few million in return for shares/ownership? #fanstrust

Ermm aye because the quoted requirements for keeping the club afloat for a year is £25M. To actually do anything useful is probably adding another 15M on top.

A few million, you might as well not bother.

There is a campaign live to contribute to pay towards the non-playing staff's wages which I think is excellent. However, for me I still think Eddie HAS to pay those wages out of his own pocket. If not that is disgraceful in my view.

[Gary the Enfield]

Kevin Davies has just tweeted....
What's the chance of the fans/local companies raising a few million in return for shares/ownership? #fanstrust

Ermm aye because the quoted requirements for keeping the club afloat for a year is £25M. To actually do anything useful is probably adding another 15M on top.

A few million, you might as well not bother.

There is a campaign live to contribute to pay towards the non-playing staff's wages which I think is excellent. However, for me I still think Eddie HAS to pay those wages out of his own pocket. If not that is disgraceful in my view.

I seem to recall that a lot of shareholders were angry when ED bought the club as their shares were reduced in value to almost nothing overnight in order for the sale to go through.

[BWFC_Insane]

Kevin Davies has just tweeted....
What's the chance of the fans/local companies raising a few million in return for shares/ownership? #fanstrust

Ermm aye because the quoted requirements for keeping the club afloat for a year is £25M. To actually do anything useful is probably adding another 15M on top.

A few million, you might as well not bother.

There is a campaign live to contribute to pay towards the non-playing staff's wages which I think is excellent. However, for me I still think Eddie HAS to pay those wages out of his own pocket. If not that is disgraceful in my view.

Completely agree. I was facing redundancy this time last year, and had to reinterview for my own role as our numbers were being reduced following an organisational restructure so I can sort of understand what they're going through during an already expensive time of year. I ultimately ended up being one of the people kept on, but facing not having a job (in this case not being paid) with not much savings at this time of year is not pleasant.

I appreciate that he doesn't want to support the club any more, but as a few people have said these aren't multi-millionaire footballers who can likely get by without a month or two's pay; they're people earning £20k-ish to £30k-ish a year who won't likely have a massive pot of savings to tide them over for long. I'm not one of the "ED has ruined us" crowd as he did give us some highs, but this is becoming an unforgivable farce now that it's extending to all staff. This has been a long time coming and both PG/ED have done sod all to try and sell the club, until it's all but too late - but I've already voiced my opinion on that elsewhere in the forum.

Exactly. ED is responsible. He is owner of the business. These staff are his responsibility. He can of course walk away and choose to leave them high and dry. But that would be a despicable thing to do.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

So you are just aiming to squash any flickers of optimism then ?

FWIW my gut feeling is a deal will be done and admin will be avoided. At this moment I'm lets say apprehensive, about our likely new owners

.

sorry was directed at LLS - got caught out by the max quotation rules...

I'm not aiming to do anything.
I was merely putting in my thruppence ha'pennyworth.
I feel I have a right to be as pessimistic as I want. Any optimists out there have no need to take on any victimhood issues over it. Bombard me with your optimism, see if it affects me...
Anyway, I'm like the government, after listening to me any reality will be sweeter than what I've outlined, which should make you feel better about life.

[BWFC_Insane]

Updates from press conference from Lennon:

Marc Iles ‏@MarcIles 18m18 minutes ago

Neil Lennon says takeover situation is "as you were" but manager having to get head round grim prospect of administration. #bwfc

BBC Manchester Sport ‏@BBCMancSports 9m9 minutes ago

#BWFC's Neil Lennon on takeover situation: "I have to trust Trevor & process. Some investors want more time, time isn't something we have"

BBC Manchester Sport ‏@BBCMancSports 6m6 minutes ago

#BWFC's Lennon on takeover situation "There is other avenues Trevor can pursue to see us to January & give people time to look at the books"

[BWFC_Insane]

The grim reality is that it sounds like there isn't going to be any prospect of a takeover happening till well into January now.

So no money in January for players (if there is of course any takeover proposing that).

This looks like dragging on for a while. The club seemingly have a choice.

1) Go into administration and clear debts with assets sold off followed by hopefully a takeover.

2) Or sell off assets to service immediate debts and payments and hope for a takeover in January etc....

Advantage of 1 is that Eddie can appoint administrators and being major creditor still has a say. He can therefore reduce liabilities for any new owner.

Advantage of 2 is no points reduction. But beyond that it takes assets out of the club and makes it less attractive to new buyers with reduced assets and likely not significantly reduced debts.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Non-update from the London Gazette ( so you don't have to trawl through it). No petition for winding up order against any companies with any relationship to BWFC in the last twenty four hours.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Thanks for the update LLS - no news is good news in this instance.

BWFCi - sounds feasible. Framed differently, here's a question: would you rather we sell Zach Clough or go into administration?

[BWFC_Insane]

Thanks for the update LLS - no news is good news in this instance.

BWFCi - sounds feasible. Framed differently, here's a question: would you rather we sell Zach Clough or go into administration?

Sadly it isn't an either or. Administrators would have to consider selling anyone with value in the playing squad in order to pay creditors.

If anyone offers a few hundred thousand for any player including Clough in January they are gone, whether we are in administration or not I think.

I think for me it comes down to a simple equation.

If there is a realistic prospect of a takeover backed by some money in January/February we should hang on and sell of what we need to in order to get through to then so long as we can do that without risking the deal.

However, if (as I suspect) interested parties are scrabbling around to raise the money and there aren't really any solid chances or guarantees I'd say administration might be more favourable to Davies simply because it could clear some of the external debt and potentially leave him with something too. And it would also allow a takeover to evolve more slowly without the need for upfront cash.

[Athers]

It will be a crying shame if we lose Clough, which I guess we will do due to relegation even if he's not sold for financial reasons. Best prospect in years (Vaz Te? Nolan?) and the whole point of that shiny academy. We'll probably get enough to keep the lights on

[Andy Waller]

It will be a crying shame if we lose Clough, which I guess we will do due to relegation even if he's not sold for financial reasons. Best prospect in years (Vaz Te? Nolan?) and the whole point of that shiny academy. We'll probably get enough to keep the lights on

I personally think he's another Mark Davies. Bags of talent but he'll be a permacrock and far to small to interest anyone.

[BWFC_Insane]

It will be a crying shame if we lose Clough, which I guess we will do due to relegation even if he's not sold for financial reasons. Best prospect in years (Vaz Te? Nolan?) and the whole point of that shiny academy. We'll probably get enough to keep the lights on

If he plays a few games and does anything half decent and doesn't get injured he's gone. For very little.

Clubs know we wouldn't be able to turn anything down and it would be a no brainer and no risk deal.

Few hundred thousand to a premiership club is nowt.

[midlands exile]

Kevin Davies has just tweeted....
What's the chance of the fans/local companies raising a few million in return for shares/ownership? #fanstrust

Ermm aye because the quoted requirements for keeping the club afloat for a year is £25M. To actually do anything useful is probably adding another 15M on top.

A few million, you might as well not bother.

There is a campaign live to contribute to pay towards the non-playing staff's wages which I think is excellent. However, for me I still think Eddie HAS to pay those wages out of his own pocket. If not that is disgraceful in my view.

I seem to recall that a lot of shareholders were angry when ED bought the club as their shares were reduced in value to almost nothing overnight in order for the sale to go through.

Correct, with many of those shareholders being your average fan in the stands type, rather than boardroom fat cats. At the time, ED got a fantastic price for an established premiership team, and the shareholders got two fingers.

[midlands exile]

So you are just aiming to squash any flickers of optimism then ?

FWIW my gut feeling is a deal will be done and admin will be avoided. At this moment I'm lets say apprehensive, about our likely new owners

Nah. Just trying to be realistic.
When you look back a few years we were punching above our weight but we did have a successful manager, a (fairly)wealthy owner and a board of experienced finance and management professionals.

Experience does not equal competence. And the performance of the club on all levels for the last few years has been like a slow motion car crash.

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

It will be a crying shame if we lose Clough, which I guess we will do due to relegation even if he's not sold for financial reasons. Best prospect in years (Vaz Te? Nolan?) and the whole point of that shiny academy. We'll probably get enough to keep the lights on

If he plays a few games and does anything half decent and doesn't get injured he's gone. For very little.

Clubs know we wouldn't be able to turn anything down and it would be a no brainer and no risk deal.

Few hundred thousand to a premiership club is nowt.

He's probably one of the most saleable, so yes. I'd hope that along with the peanuts we'd try and get a sell on clause though.

[Jugs]

People say we wouldn't be able to turn anything down and that we'd only get peanuts for Clough.

But can I ask, What is the point in accepting peanuts/a few hundred thousand? What good would that money actually do for us anyway? Surely it's just a drop in the ocean. We need millions, not a few grand. I don't see the point in accepting a derisory bid.

[BWFC_Insane]

People say we wouldn't be able to turn anything down and that we'd only get peanuts for Clough.

But can I ask, What is the point in accepting peanuts/a few hundred thousand? What good would that money actually do for us anyway? Surely it's just a drop in the ocean. We need millions, not a few grand. I don't see the point in accepting a derisory bid.

We need £600,000 to pay HMRC that I believe is immediate priority.

Then servicing loans presumably Nucleus finance being top given their rights over our assets if we don't make the payments. Then paying staff etc etc....

The point would be keeping the club going a few more weeks if that is the chosen path.

Enter administration and control over those assets is lost anyway and the end result is the same.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Framed differently, here's a question: would you rather we sell Zach Clough or go into administration?

Sadly it isn't an either or. .

You sure?

We get offered £600,000 - it pays the tax bill - no winding-up petition - no (immediate) administration.

No?

[Chief Brody]

We lost key young talent when we last went into administration. We also lost control over the transfer fee as a result. Vultures will be circling knowing you have little room for negotiation.

If this Nucleus company feel that HMRC will invoke a winding-up order, you may see a move from these guys to protect their assets.