Dougie's pre-match routine

[jaffka]

Here's a question. Do you think the players should be at the ground (for home games) at about 12:30 for a pre-match meal?

I know that red nose had his set of tw@ts at The Cliff on the training pitch at 10am for a 3pm kick off

[boltonboris]

I don't know enough to answer that. Is there a physiological advantage to say having massage and a slow warm up, the correct food taken at the correct time before a game? I think there's more to it than how many keepy uppies you do in sight of the public.

In my opinion, that's routine. But I can imagine that some players feel physically and mentally well after having one.. In terms of the meal, what you take in and when is massively important when you're playing at the intensity these fellas do. So again, it begs the question, do we think its important that the squad meet up for a pre match meal? (Not aimed exclusively at anybody in particular)

[boltonboris]

I wouldn't say 'should', I don't think it would be unreasonable for a manager to expect them to though. The way I've always thought best to manage that kind of thing is give the players a couple of options you'd be happy with and let them pick which one.

a)ground at 12 (I seem to remember reading somewhere 3 hours is the best time to eat before a game); or,

b)eat at home, ground later, but you'll be told what to eat (as in the sorts of foods, rather than specific meals).

Vote on it, but everyone does the same thing. Some groups would prefer the camaraderie of eating together, some the independence.

We're talking pissing about 90 mins before kick-off here though!

Reason I ask, is because the great scientist and (as some have said) the old Dougie Freedman, Sam Allardyce never bothered with any of it. Trusted the players to do the right thing. Treated them as adults.

THAT is professionalism in my opinion. Not being a hall monitor.

[jaffka]

The days of having steak and chips and couple of pints are well behind us.

[Prufrock]

I wouldn't say 'should', I don't think it would be unreasonable for a manager to expect them to though. The way I've always thought best to manage that kind of thing is give the players a couple of options you'd be happy with and let them pick which one.

a)ground at 12 (I seem to remember reading somewhere 3 hours is the best time to eat before a game); or,

b)eat at home, ground later, but you'll be told what to eat (as in the sorts of foods, rather than specific meals).

Vote on it, but everyone does the same thing. Some groups would prefer the camaraderie of eating together, some the independence.

We're talking pissing about 90 mins before kick-off here though!

Reason I ask, is because the great scientist and (as some have said) the old Dougie Freedman, Sam Allardyce never bothered with any of it. Trusted the players to do the right thing. Treated them as adults.

THAT is professionalism in my opinion. Not being a hall monitor.

I think the aim is to have the rules necessary to make sure you're professional and prepared properly whilst as you say treating them like adults.

Allardyce trusted them to do the right thing, but the players also knew the science bods would be able to tell if they'd been kebabbing it up.

[chester white]

Not all the time, Allardyce had them staying over at De Vere Whites before some home games, sending the players to bed with a sleeping pill whilst he and Suntan stayed in the bar until the small hours.

[Lord Kangana]

Allardyce seemed to have an eye for a good professional though. Or his agents. But look at the likes of gary Speed. Yes, we extended his career, but you need the willingness from the player to do that. Youri, Hierro come from the same mould IMHO.

[chester white]

And Dioufy!!

In all seriousness I do agree to an extent, but if you were to ask me what I'd prefer out of the players having to dick about with sponsors and kids 2 hours before kick off, or concentrating solely on the game in hand and getting us out of the shit we've been dragged into, I know which I'd prefer.

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

Its an interesting, and quite well worn point that Boris is making though. Someone (and the name Ruud Gullit seems to jump to mind here) wrote years ago that he and fellow foreigners (in that initial Premier League influx) were astounded by the childishness of British football. The laddish culture that was in part begotten by, and reinforced by, being treated like naughty little schoolboys all the time. The culture seemed to fuel itself.

They are professionals. They need guidance (coaching), but I think a great deal of energy is being expended for little benefit in suggesting this could make a significant difference to our matchday performance.

That's true, but I have also read continental players expressing their disbelief at the nutrition habits of English players too.

For some reason, Materazzi's comments about Everton back in 2001 stick in my mind:

While at Everton, I had to learn how to concentrate myself for games. I would go into the dressing room beforehand and disco music would be blaring out, the kit men were booting tennis balls around and my team-mates would be wolfing down three bananas each before kick off. I remember a furious row between Don Hutchison and the manager. I thought he would never play for us again but instead he was captaining the side the next weekend. I went to England for the money. I was earning 10 times my salary but Italian football is far more skilful.

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news ... AZZI-BLAST" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I personally don't see a problem with coming to the latest scientific view about what is a good idea nutritionally and making its execution certain and easier for the players by serving it up for them together.

[Enoch]

I've looked at that image taken from facebook by mummywhycantieatcrayons a couple of times and all I can see is the bit where someone has stated that the new manager wants the players focused on the game at least 90 minutes prior to kick off.

How does that get extrapolated to 'smacks of paranoia and inexperience'? Or anything else for that matter.

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

I've looked at that image taken from facebook by mummywhycantieatcrayons a couple of times and all I can see is the bit where someone has stated that the new manager wants the players focused on the game at least 90 minutes prior to kick off.

How does that get extrapolated to 'smacks of paranoia and inexperience'? Or anything else for that matter.

That has since been extended to 2 hours, but it's a good point.

[General Mannerheim]

Im pretty sure utd havent trained at The Cliff for about 15 years?

[boltonboris]

I've looked at that image taken from facebook by mummywhycantieatcrayons a couple of times and all I can see is the bit where someone has stated that the new manager wants the players focused on the game at least 90 minutes prior to kick off.

How does that get extrapolated to 'smacks of paranoia and inexperience'? Or anything else for that matter.

Because it seems like he's putting an unnecessary stamp on to demand some kind of domineering "I'm the boss" respect. It doesn't work nowadays

[Enoch]

That has since been extended to 2 hours, but it's a good point.

Where does it say that?

[Enoch]

Because it seems like he's putting an unnecessary stamp on to demand some kind of domineering "I'm the boss" respect. It doesn't work nowadays

Seems like that to you maybe boltonboris, but it doesn't seem like that to me.

[89bwfc89]

I've looked at that image taken from facebook by mummywhycantieatcrayons a couple of times and all I can see is the bit where someone has stated that the new manager wants the players focused on the game at least 90 minutes prior to kick off.

How does that get extrapolated to 'smacks of paranoia and inexperience'? Or anything else for that matter.

Because it seems like he's putting an unnecessary stamp on to demand some kind of domineering "I'm the boss" respect. It doesn't work nowadays

Or....he could just be doing his job and doing what he thinks is best for our club and our players.

[jaffka]

Im pretty sure utd havent trained at The Cliff for about 15 years?

they havent they are at Carrington now

not everyone is a young spunker like you

[ohjimmyjimmy]

A what with the what now?

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

I've looked at that image taken from facebook by mummywhycantieatcrayons a couple of times and all I can see is the bit where someone has stated that the new manager wants the players focused on the game at least 90 minutes prior to kick off.

How does that get extrapolated to 'smacks of paranoia and inexperience'? Or anything else for that matter.

Because it seems like he's putting an unnecessary stamp on to demand some kind of domineering "I'm the boss" respect. It doesn't work nowadays

Possibly the thinking is that less players do what they should be doing in this day and age compared to the Speeds, Hierros et al. Maybe the Twittering is not the only thing players are doing that they shouldn't be and Dougie thinks the discipline needs to be improved. Didn't Knight get in bother for turning up late? Sordell and his social networking. Moo tweeting last year when he couldn't get in the team. Alonso allegedly drink driving. These immediately spring to mind and possibly show that in recent years too many have been unprofessional. Old school shouting may not work any more, but I'd argue leaving players to their own devices doesn't work. We don't know how left to their own devices players have been left. It hasn't worked for a few years, so maybe a new approach from Dougie will eventually reap some dividends.

[BWFC_Insane]

I wouldn't say 'should', I don't think it would be unreasonable for a manager to expect them to though. The way I've always thought best to manage that kind of thing is give the players a couple of options you'd be happy with and let them pick which one.

a)ground at 12 (I seem to remember reading somewhere 3 hours is the best time to eat before a game); or,

b)eat at home, ground later, but you'll be told what to eat (as in the sorts of foods, rather than specific meals).

Vote on it, but everyone does the same thing. Some groups would prefer the camaraderie of eating together, some the independence.

We're talking pissing about 90 mins before kick-off here though!

Reason I ask, is because the great scientist and (as some have said) the old Dougie Freedman, Sam Allardyce never bothered with any of it. Trusted the players to do the right thing. Treated them as adults.

THAT is professionalism in my opinion. Not being a hall monitor.

I'm not sure thats strictly true. There were a lot of rules under Allardyce, about all sorts of things and as said before he often got the entire squad together on the eve of a Reebok game and kept them that way to avoid anyone "being distracted". Not always.

I can only presume there were rules about arrival times before games etc.

There were certainly dietary rules, rules about conduct between games etc etc.

Like any employer employee relationship.

Sure he trusted the players to do the right thing and it wasn't an old school, say Bruce Rioch approach to discipline but to say it was a free for all "do what you want" is very misleading.

And as such to make out that Dougie is taking an "old school" disciplinary approach on the basis that there are now some set rules in place, may well also be misleading.