JUST FCUK OFF

[Worthy4England]

I contend that you can't make a silk purse from a sowes ear.
Jose Mourinho would struggle to get a tune out of this lot.

Mourinho would organise this lot better than clown Coyle. Actually so would just about any manager with sense.

And he wouldn't have wasted the limited funds we have on players that dont get in the side......

Absolutely right BWFCI, we should of sacked him in december but if we do fluke it and stay up we should still sack him, i can't watch the same disorganised shit again next season.

When i got some tickets yesterday for sunday the guy at the ticket office was telling me for half an hour how clueless, naive, tactically inept coyle is, everyone but the board know this.

I guess that had a small b in front of it, to include some folk on here too?

[Ianmooreslovechild]

I contend that you can't make a silk purse from a sowes ear.
Jose Mourinho would struggle to get a tune out of this lot.

Mourinho would organise this lot better than clown Coyle. Actually so would just about any manager with sense.

And he wouldn't have wasted the limited funds we have on players that dont get in the side......

Absolutely right BWFCI, we should of sacked him in december but if we do fluke it and stay up we should still sack him, i can't watch the same disorganised shit again next season.

When i got some tickets yesterday for sunday the guy at the ticket office was telling me for half an hour how clueless, naive, tactically inept coyle is, everyone but the board know this.

I guess that had a small b in front of it, to include some folk on here too?

Surely that would be TheBored and come Sunday The Boned

[lovethesmellofnapalm]

Back to the thread title

To the BARCLAYS Premier Best League in the World League with its one- eyed, truculent (most apt word DSB), pontificating ponces of managers (ref: King Kenny today, Wenger at Stoke and Red Nose practically every week)
To the crass, overpaid self indulgent ,cheating, drunken ,wife/girlfriend beating, drink driving, nightclub brawling "superstars" that grace the above
To the Euros, the Champions League, the FA, SkySports, the b'stard Olympics, the recession, austerity, the Voice, the Levison enquiry,the cold, the price of ale, ASDA, kids toys tripping me up when i get in pissed, lawnmowers, garages.

Just fcuk off

[Sponge]

Back to the thread title

To the BARCLAYS Premier Best League in the World League with its one- eyed, truculent (most apt word DSB), pontificating ponces of managers (ref: King Kenny today, Wenger at Stoke and Red Nose practically every week)
To the crass, overpaid self indulgent ,cheating, drunken ,wife/girlfriend beating, drink driving, nightclub brawling "superstars" that grace the above
To the Euros, the Champions League, the FA, SkySports, the b'stard Olympics, the recession, austerity, the Voice, the Levison enquiry,the cold, the price of ale, ASDA, kids toys tripping me up when i get in pissed, lawnmowers, garages.

Just fcuk off

[Ianmooreslovechild]

Meh ..........

[Sponge]

On Twitter a fan asks Gartside: "can you confirm please OC job is safe no matter what happens next two games"

Gartside: "never in doubt"

[plymouth wanderer]

On Twitter a fan asks Gartside: "can you confirm please OC job is safe no matter what happens next two games"

Gartside: "never in doubt"

[norm the jedi]

Someone explain how organisation becomes the Holy Grail ?
According to the stats we created as many chances on goal as Spurs and ony 3 less on target 8 to their 11 [bbc]
So we broadly competed with a massively superior opposition [ in player quality terms] but got reamed because they too their chances and we didn't.
You can't blame a disorganised approach for that..
Conceding goals at corners or set plays could be an organisational failure or you just get done by someone who executes better..
As I recall we've been conceding goals at set pieces since Warwick Rimmers time.. [one for the ipad generation] even under Megson and Allerdyce famed for rigid organisation and system.. In fact I can recall any time in the last 40 years when a ball into the box hasn't initiated panic in me and half our back four? -
Tactics and plans and systems are all very well.. if you don't got the players? I You can organise all you like but when it comes down to it in a straight race between Sam Ricketts and Gareth Bale or Aaron Lennon I'm never backing Sam..
De Matteo is doing a top job at chelsea and seems able to influence the game with selection and subs and tactical set up...
I imagine all attributes noted by WBA fans when they shovelled him unceremoniously out the door 18 months ago..
Now unless 9 months watching AVB fail is the holy grail of coaching badges.. I imagine the principle difference is the quality and ability of the players at his disposal and the depth of squad available to make changes..
In the case of Swansea, Norwich who compare well to us in our pomp, they have a system they all buy into and have been using for 2 -3 years Norwich and since Martinez for Swansea and for the most part they have remained fit and as we did in that period in the cycle, made good starts that allowed for a dip in form not too be terminal.. Either may make it to 11 seasons in the prem.. but either could be relegated next season with relatively minor shift in fortune..
I think Coyles failings often stem from over estimating the ability/quality of the team.. Making tactical changes or selections which have some basis in logic if you have better players.. Norwich away for instance where the change to 4-4-2 when they lost both centre backs and we were comfortable for a point but the game was there to win - Coyles default is try and win - we lost .. because we aren't secure enough to sacrifice a body in midfield for a front player.. On the plus side the pragmatism of others would have seen us hold the point at Norwich and almost never recover from being a gaol down which was the case in 90% of occasions we fell behind [particularly conceding the first goal] under Megson and Sam.. So may be being organised would have gained us some points.. in a competition of such slim margins, possibly enough to stop up? Couldn't it just as easily have cost us as many, Wolves, Everton, Sunderland, or more ? Who knows? Add to that the bizarre statistic that we are the best team in the league at protecting a wining position, [ie] we have let fewer points slip when ahead than anyone else in the prem [no I didn't believe it either] The principle problem all season has been replacing the 25 goals we lost in transfers and the return to Chelsea of Sturridge at the end of last season.. Ngog isn't a lone striker - I'm not sure what he is, mostly a bloke who can't get it out from under his feet, if we could inject him with Klasnic dna he'd be brilliant because he works and holds and tries like nobodies business and he's got massive heart.. but He needs a foil a strike partner or someone to link with.. Davo is past being the carry us on his back workhorse nuisance of Yore but as recently, is capable of a positive bit part, Klas is potentially an impact sub.. Feck knows what Sordell is, [a tax right off? investment in the future?]
Poor organisation won't relegate us as much as poor finishing will.

just saying.. and this is not some massive Coyle vote of confidence.. He's made odd decisions at times he's been single minded, obstinate and stubborn - in his defence when he go the message and started sorting out some of the early season shortcomings he was already running out of personnel - I suppose when you lose these traits are lit upon as failings - oddly if you look at profiles of successful individuals they are similar, in some cases identical to the traits that the Wengers fergusons Mourhino's etc are lauded for.. I doubt Coyles in their class remotely at this point..
I personally don't mind giving hiom the chance to make ammends if we do drop down..
But I don't come from the want everything now Skyhype sports prem league, champs league is all, generation..
Over time none is as good or as bad as we thought at the time with the possible exception of George Mulhall [?]
Sun'll come up tomorrow, and this would be a mighty competetive championship squad if the decent ones stay and stay fit.

[bobo the clown]

He's been making this plain throughout.

We can all forget the idea of him exiting by dint of large boot. Add this 'loyalty' to the St. Owen period when he handled the Muamba stuff as well as anyone could have wanted & he's untouchable.

The fact that he was misusing Muamba at the time is conveniently overlooked.

The club & Coyle can point to a huge amount of ill luck with long-term injuries and illness to key players on a scale I can't recall. This allows them to excuse & skirt over an ineptness of system, selection, fight, organisation, spirit and fitness. It's a bloody miracle we enter the final 2 games with a hope in hell.

The test for Coyle will be the first 10 games of next season, added to who he keeps and who he ships out in the summer.

For me, nice guy & all that, I'd get rid now .... well, a few months ago tbh. I'm a patient man, but I'd have sacked him as he handed in the team sheet for the Wigan at home match. However, it's not going to happen, so we have to hope he can turn a few corners in the coming weeks. ... and if not, then he gets binned sooner, rather than later, next season.

[Hoboh]

Sun'll come up tomorrow, and this would be a mighty competetive championship squad if the decent ones stay and stay fit.

And there in lay's the problem! It and they won't.

Nice defence of Coyle but it just don't cut it, it's not just this season we are talking about here or has the horror show after last years semi been lost in the mists of time? Coyle has had the chance to sort out the teams survival over the Christmas period, to replace injuries with players who could have had an imeadiate impact and bolstered the team instead he spent some money "for the future". The first half of this season was a joke by anyones measure, by Christmas we had has good as lost it! A club that has been in the Prem for 11 years is not the place for someone to serve his aprenticeship and cut his teeth, a lot of us were too quick to think after Megson we had the massiah (and I include Gartside in that), clearly we didn't.
Yes I think Coyle may cope well if we go down but I'm in the camp of he's had his chance and blown it and not worth the risk!

[BWFC_Insane]

Someone explain how organisation becomes the Holy Grail ?
According to the stats we created as many chances on goal as Spurs and ony 3 less on target 8 to their 11 [bbc]
So we broadly competed with a massively superior opposition [ in player quality terms] but got reamed because they too their chances and we didn't.
You can't blame a disorganised approach for that..
Conceding goals at corners or set plays could be an organisational failure or you just get done by someone who executes better..
As I recall we've been conceding goals at set pieces since Warwick Rimmers time.. [one for the ipad generation] even under Megson and Allerdyce famed for rigid organisation and system.. In fact I can recall any time in the last 40 years when a ball into the box hasn't initiated panic in me and half our back four? -
Tactics and plans and systems are all very well.. if you don't got the players? I You can organise all you like but when it comes down to it in a straight race between Sam Ricketts and Gareth Bale or Aaron Lennon I'm never backing Sam..
De Matteo is doing a top job at chelsea and seems able to influence the game with selection and subs and tactical set up...
I imagine all attributes noted by WBA fans when they shovelled him unceremoniously out the door 18 months ago..
Now unless 9 months watching AVB fail is the holy grail of coaching badges.. I imagine the principle difference is the quality and ability of the players at his disposal and the depth of squad available to make changes..
In the case of Swansea, Norwich who compare well to us in our pomp, they have a system they all buy into and have been using for 2 -3 years Norwich and since Martinez for Swansea and for the most part they have remained fit and as we did in that period in the cycle, made good starts that allowed for a dip in form not too be terminal.. Either may make it to 11 seasons in the prem.. but either could be relegated next season with relatively minor shift in fortune..
I think Coyles failings often stem from over estimating the ability/quality of the team.. Making tactical changes or selections which have some basis in logic if you have better players.. Norwich away for instance where the change to 4-4-2 when they lost both centre backs and we were comfortable for a point but the game was there to win - Coyles default is try and win - we lost .. because we aren't secure enough to sacrifice a body in midfield for a front player.. On the plus side the pragmatism of others would have seen us hold the point at Norwich and almost never recover from being a gaol down which was the case in 90% of occasions we fell behind [particularly conceding the first goal] under Megson and Sam.. So may be being organised would have gained us some points.. in a competition of such slim margins, possibly enough to stop up? Couldn't it just as easily have cost us as many, Wolves, Everton, Sunderland, or more ? Who knows? Add to that the bizarre statistic that we are the best team in the league at protecting a wining position, [ie] we have let fewer points slip when ahead than anyone else in the prem [no I didn't believe it either] The principle problem all season has been replacing the 25 goals we lost in transfers and the return to Chelsea of Sturridge at the end of last season.. Ngog isn't a lone striker - I'm not sure what he is, mostly a bloke who can't get it out from under his feet, if we could inject him with Klasnic dna he'd be brilliant because he works and holds and tries like nobodies business and he's got massive heart.. but He needs a foil a strike partner or someone to link with.. Davo is past being the carry us on his back workhorse nuisance of Yore but as recently, is capable of a positive bit part, Klas is potentially an impact sub.. Feck knows what Sordell is, [a tax right off? investment in the future?]
Poor organisation won't relegate us as much as poor finishing will.

just saying.. and this is not some massive Coyle vote of confidence.. He's made odd decisions at times he's been single minded, obstinate and stubborn - in his defence when he go the message and started sorting out some of the early season shortcomings he was already running out of personnel - I suppose when you lose these traits are lit upon as failings - oddly if you look at profiles of successful individuals they are similar, in some cases identical to the traits that the Wengers fergusons Mourhino's etc are lauded for.. I doubt Coyles in their class remotely at this point..
I personally don't mind giving hiom the chance to make ammends if we do drop down..
But I don't come from the want everything now Skyhype sports prem league, champs league is all, generation..
Over time none is as good or as bad as we thought at the time with the possible exception of George Mulhall [?]
Sun'll come up tomorrow, and this would be a mighty competetive championship squad if the decent ones stay and stay fit.

Because essentially to survive in the premiership for a club like ourselves you have to find a way of picking up results against teams with better players. We've been doing that for 11 years.

Coyle had a system where Lennon was often left on his own against Ricketts. That was always going to end one way, would for example Hodgson have set up to double up in those situations?

We haven't created a team that's hard to beat. We've created a team that attacks well but it's defensive shape and organisation is all over the show.

We are now colin Todd rather than Sam Allardyce. And which kept us in the top flight and which didnt?

Offer large periods this season we've been as big a shambles as we were under Sammy Lee. And it's all down to a naive set up with a lack of understanding of what you have to do to stay in this league.

[Jez]

Just to note, Coyle may be pretty poor at keeping a team up but he did bring burnley up meaning he might be not all too bad next season if we do go down

[Peter Thompson]

We haven't created a team that's hard to beat. We've created a team that attacks well but it's defensive shape and organisation is all over the show.

We are now colin Todd rather than Sam Allardyce. And which kept us in the top flight and which didnt?

Offer large periods this season we've been as big a shambles as we were under Sammy Lee. And it's all down to a naive set up with a lack of understanding of what you have to do to stay in this league.

Spot on - but do we really attack well, I've not seen much evidence of that over the past 12 months.

[norm the jedi]

Because essentially to survive in the premiership for a club like ourselves you have to find a way of picking up results against teams with better players. We've been doing that for 11 years.

Coyle had a system where Lennon was often left on his own against Ricketts. That was always going to end one way, would for example Hodgson have set up to double up in those situations?

We haven't created a team that's hard to beat. We've created a team that attacks well but it's defensive shape and organisation is all over the show.

We are now colin Todd rather than Sam Allardyce. And which kept us in the top flight and which didnt?

Offer large periods this season we've been as big a shambles as we were under Sammy Lee. And it's all down to a naive set up with a lack of understanding of what you have to do to stay in this league.

So with the personnel available a don't lose first and try and nick a 1-0 approach would have brought us more points..
ala Don Howe 'you start off with a point' ...
I wonder whether that approach with our squad produces a Blackburn v Spurs scenario with no forward thrust and 0 shots on goal..
When we were doing this week in week out, most of this present team would have struggled to make the bench..
Whether the blame for the squad rests solely wth Coyle is arguable, you'll say yes, i'll wonder how much the budget and stretching scant resources played a part.. That said, the Sordell situation is a bizarre episode in a fairly bizarre old season..

I think Coyles management was a major issue until December Jan after that he's contributed a lot less than 'events'
Bottom line for me since day one has been that we aren't very good, lack pace everywhere and don't have enough goals in the team..
But we still aren't down..

[Ianmooreslovechild]

We haven't created a team that's hard to beat. We've created a team that attacks well but it's defensive shape and organisation is all over the show.

We are now colin Todd rather than Sam Allardyce. And which kept us in the top flight and which didnt?

Offer large periods this season we've been as big a shambles as we were under Sammy Lee. And it's all down to a naive set up with a lack of understanding of what you have to do to stay in this league.

Spot on - but do we really attack well, I've not seen much evidence of that over the past 12 months.

No we dont because we have an attack made up of impact players who lack the skills to link up consistently. We continue to play a high line even with the lightening speed of Wheater and Steinsson in place and we fail to do the thing the high line is supposed to provide ie pressure the ball in opponents half and when we get it maintain possession and press. With what we have had available we'd have been better sitting deeper and trying to be compact and play on the break.Coyle hasnt really been that successful with his signings and remains naive and incapable of using what he has available in anything like an effective way. He's a likeable fella,means well.... but he's been woefully incompetent most of the season.

[Worthy4England]

I've heard numerous times, that we can't afford the '"classy" footballers. I'd generally agree. So why are we buying first/second division "classy" footballers, instead of some proper grafters, that might be less skilled, but much more difficult to beat?

The man's a feck*.

[Worthy4England]

fcukwit

[Ianmooreslovechild]

I've heard numerous times, that we can't afford the '"classy" footballers. I'd generally agree. So why are we buying first/second division "classy" footballers, instead of some proper grafters, that might be less skilled, but much more difficult to beat?

The man's a feck.

Indeed, in the jolly robin space between his ears there are dreams of fancy dans and wondergoals and the beautiful game. Now where is that diagram Doughal

[Verbal]

I've heard numerous times, that we can't afford the '"classy" footballers. I'd generally agree. So why are we buying first/second division "classy" footballers, instead of some proper grafters, that might be less skilled, but much more difficult to beat?

The man's a feck.

Indeed, in the jolly robin space between his ears there are dreams of fancy dans and wondergoals and the beautiful game. Now where is that diagram Doughal

[Ianmooreslovechild]

I've heard numerous times, that we can't afford the '"classy" footballers. I'd generally agree. So why are we buying first/second division "classy" footballers, instead of some proper grafters, that might be less skilled, but much more difficult to beat?

The man's a feck.

Indeed, in the jolly robin space between his ears there are dreams of fancy dans and wondergoals and the beautiful game. Now where is that diagram Doughal

That's the one. Can't someone take it in the ground and hold it up for coyle every time he thinks of a "tactical" substitution. Even if we are fortunate enough to get a lead at stoke I cant see us holding it. It has to be time for a new manager and a fresh start in the championship. Coyle could get on a run and get us up but he just isnt smart enough to manage at the top level. His naivity and inability to recognise the blindingly obvious is embarrasing