Time to go

[BWFC_Insane]

no-one held a gun to his head when he swapped Taylor for Eagles and Mears, or signed a player he doesn't want in Tuncay), but that alone can't be enough to keep him in a job.

The decision to sell Matt Taylor wasn't taken by Owen Coyle.

If not Eagles and Mears then who? We needed cover for CYL and a right back to replace Steinsson. They were available for the right price. Eagles would have been a squad player if CYL had been fit.

Who said he doesn't want Tuncay?

And your evidence for that is?

If you don't know how it works by now, I really can't be bothered explaining it all again for the simpletons.

So that's no evidence then and just a bollocks statement.

No player will be sold without the manager being consulted at Bolton. As Coyle said at the fans forum he and Gartside work very closely together on all aspects.

Sure sometimes deals are too good to turn down.

But if Owen had said absolutely no we are not selling Taylor at that price then he wouldn't have been sold.

Which is what happened in the case of Cahill.

[BWFC_Insane]

But bad runs are one thing, 13 defeats out of 15 suggest the manager does not know how to reverse the slide!

Oh I see - you include some, not all, of last season's results. For us that was a great season - couple of points of top half and a trip to Wembley. Newsflash - it's not going to get much better than that with our resources. We're in a new season now and I'd bet neither the owner or manager, or anyone at the club for that matter is concentrating on last year's results.

This year's results are poor but as detailed above there are several reasons that may account for this other than solely Coyle.

Before you get your bedsheet out why don't you make a list of the managers out there who are realistically going to come to Bolton. Don't forget they need to be able to win with 10 men, use our limited squad and will have zero to spend.

I'll wager there not be one on that list who will be a better option than the one we have now.

If that's the case we might as well pack up the club now and let Eddie go back to his kettles.

Not much point if all we can do is 2 wins in 15 and be happy with it!

[BL3]

But if Owen had said absolutely no we are not selling Taylor at that price then he wouldn't have been sold.

Jesus wept.

[Wandering Willy]

So BWFCi - there's nobody better then?

[CAPSLOCK]

we were fine against Swansea.

Bollocks, man

All the usual failings were apparent

Way too open, mega spaces in front of our back 4

[Wandering Willy]

we were fine against Swansea.

Bollocks, man

All the usual failings were apparent

Way too open, mega spaces in front of our back 4

I thought it was a good contest first half but you're right about the space in midfield.

Playing Pratley and M. Davies was a mistake. One of them plus Muamba for me.

[CAPSLOCK]

So BWFCi - there's nobody better then?

There might not be anybody capable of keeping us up

But surely, surely, theres somebody who could get this lot organised

[CAPSLOCK]

That'd do for me

Frankly, the points return has to be the yardstick, but even defeats could be more easily swallowed if there was evidence of a plan...

Not bothered about a Plan B...a Plan fcuking A would do

Change, change, change, gets us nowhere

All these changes and through it all, his 'marquee' signing keeps stealing a living

[Worthy4England]

I wonder how long the fixture card is going to be played for? When we are in the championship, league one?

Fact is we've played the three promoted teams and managed one PPG against three teams we have to target for points.

Keep burying your head in the sand if you like, but we can't afford to sleepwalk to relegation and oblivion!

We have had players sent off in 2 of those games, the other we won comfortably. Keep ignoring the facts so you can fit it to your "Coyle Out" agenda if you so wish. I am not laying the blame solely at Coyle's door for the losses against Swansea and Norwich.

In any situation when a team is losing you can always point to 'circumstances' beyond the managers control.

When you've lost 13 out of 15 you have to start looking to do something about it.

Our form is simply not good enough, and I doubt you'd find anyone in the club argue it was.

Of course it's not good enough, but there'll be many who will argue with your opinion that it is solely Coyle's fault and we should get rid.

Buck stops with the Manager - that's why they have the job title "Manager".

You keep talking about half a game here, and half a game there, but half a game doesn't make "points", if you get dicked out of sight in the other half.

As for "facts", last season, we finished 14th - could've easily been 8th, regardless of the paucity of the last few games, so I don't think anyone, when we closed last season off would have been looking to bin Coyle off (although I'm sure some were starting to get concerned in the dramatic dip in form).

This season, we've won 2 out of 10. That's a fact.

We're in the bottom 3. That's a fact.

Coyle is responsible for the performance of team, the buck stops with him and is de facto his "fault" when we don't achieve results that we're supposd to. As it does with any Manager in any walk of life.

[CAPSLOCK]

Its possible its an impossible job, though

He's lost Sturridge, Holden, Elmander, Taylor and Lee

Jussi is on the wane - though still a good keeper

Davies is way over the hill

So, 6 big players, and he's replaced 'em with signings, the majority of whom are suspect - at best

I reckon it's beyond him, but its probably beyond some better managers than him

Like I say, its a tough job, and I'd be happy to see him at least making us hard to beat, with some consistency of selection

[BWFC_Insane]

So BWFCi - there's nobody better then?

You can always argue that.

But don't see how it can get much worse?

Someone capable of organising a team would be a start.

It's like Sammy Lee at the minute, any kind of organiser would possibly give us a chance!

[Prufrock]

we were fine against Swansea.

Bollocks, man

All the usual failings were apparent

Way too open, mega spaces in front of our back 4

They had one shot on target first half, and whilst there were a few hairy moments they never actually looked like scoring. We looked as likely as they did, for all the pissing about with it in their own half they did. Second half was a different matter like. At half time I wasn't thinking we're going to lose this like I have most of this season. Was evenly matched.

[CAPSLOCK]

A few times they picked the ball up and ran at our back line, unchecked until the centre backs pulled off a tackle

And when they score

Pick it up 35 yards from goal, nobody between the scorer and our centre backs

Its just not good enough

[Wandering Willy]

Buck stops with the Manager - that's why they have the job title "Manager".

You keep talking about half a game here, and half a game there, but half a game doesn't make "points", if you get dicked out of sight in the other half.

As for "facts", last season, we finished 14th - could've easily been 8th, regardless of the paucity of the last few games, so I don't think anyone, when we closed last season off would have been looking to bin Coyle off (although I'm sure some were starting to get concerned in the dramatic dip in form).

This season, we've won 2 out of 10. That's a fact.

We're in the bottom 3. That's a fact.

Coyle is responsible for the performance of team, the buck stops with him and is de facto his "fault" when we don't achieve results that we're supposd to. As it does with any Manager in any walk of life.

This is true, but in the context of the thread as to whether it's time to let him go I think it is important to recognise what is beyond his control - specifically, spending power, injuries and sendings off. If you look at it in that context' as CAPS says, it may be beyond Coyle, and better managers, to do any better. In which case why would you get rid?

As far as talking about half a game here and there I am not sure what you are referring to other than perhaps where I have tried to point out that playing a half with 10 men is detrimental to us and not necessarily in Coyle's control. Of the games discussed we were not "dicked out of sight" in any of them so I am not sure of your point.

[CAPSLOCK]

WW - we were totally outplayed for the first half v Norwich

Sunderland - started brightly, once it got a bit rough, we went hiding, and got battered

We've got no less than we deserve

[One Hump Or Two?]

What does "maybe" mean? "I don't have an opinion but I'm going to press a button anway"?

Democracy, you've got to love it. Cheers, Greece. (And for Stelios as well.)

[Wandering Willy]

WW - we were totally outplayed for the first half v Norwich

Sunderland - started brightly, once it got a bit rough, we went hiding, and got battered

We've got no less than we deserve

Agreed CAPS and I have not said otherwise.

Though we were the better side second half against Norwich which I put down to the removal of KD and we were down a man.

I am merely tying to point out to those who argue we haven't got enough points against the teams we should get points from, that in the 3 games with 11 versus 11 we have won 2 and lost one. We lost the other 2 with 10 men - not necessarily Coyle's fault.

We only have 3 "winnable" games with a full team with which to judge him and we won 2.

[Prufrock]

I kinda get where you are coming from Willy, but we're almost getting towards Arsenal fan stlye, "Stylish goals plus relatively little spent means technically we win the league". Facts are we keep going down to ten men, we keep only performing for half games, and most importantly, we keep getting beat.

[Wandering Willy]

Will a manager change now rectify that?

[Prufrock]

It's feasible. I certainly don't they are all circumstances beyond his control. The red cards possibly, particularly if as he says he made a point of telling folk not to do anything to get themselves sent off. He picked the wrong team against Norwich though. It's all well and good saying we were better second half and with ten men and already 2-0 down, but if you leave yourself those mountains consistently, you're going down. Equally it was obvious within five minutes what the problem was against Chelsea, but still we kept letting them waltz through midfield and double up on our left. Our problem a the moment is that we have all these players set up to attack, but if you never win the ball, if you are soft centred you will still always get beaten. Coyle takes big responsibility for that.

Would a new manager change that? If they were good enough, almost certainly, but I'm not convinced anyone we'd be likely to get would be any more capable.