Stoke at the Reebok...

[bobo the clown]

Oh yeah, Kevin Davies was shite, again

I'm going to have to burgle him soon and get those negatives of Coyle and Gartys wife

Sir Nut ? .... is that you Nutty ???

I tend to agree, to a point, but whenever we go into games without him we look impotent.

[officer_dibble]

Oh yeah, Kevin Davies was shite, again

I'm going to have to burgle him soon and get those negatives of Coyle and Gartys wife

Sir Nut ? .... is that you Nutty ???

I tend to agree, to a point, but whenever we go into games without him we look impotent.

Games like Stoke, big teams who can cope with him, we've got to look to sub him now and then though for a Plan B. That Huth (Hooof?) is shite, would of liked to see some pace from Moreno up against him.

Great result anyway, so important that our next result, after all those draws, wasn't a defeat - then you get 'haven't won since August' whereas now its 'unbeaten in 6' or whatever.

Great stuff. Proper contribution from Klasnic as well, 15 mins, 1 goal, couple of shots and 2 yellows. Shame on anyone for forgetting about him!

Can't even be arsed commenting on the fooligan action...

[officer_dibble]

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xf8lb3 ... from=embed

Highlights

[Lord Kangana]

3 things:

Huth leads with his elbow when shoving Knight. Free kick to us, yellow card for Huth, if I'm being generous.

Whitehead should have gone for violent conduct. Ditto probably Klsanic.

The guy who shoves Klasnic in the back should be yellow carded and freekick to us, not other way round, as its first offence.

[SuperChung-Yong]

Thats absolute nonsense. As we're currently set up with two luxuries out wide we couldn't accomodate Campo, even at his very best.

Campo was nowhere near a luxury player, he was simply good in every department apart from pace. Which, much like Djorkaeff, he didn't need. But then again we did have Gudni behind 'em.

Muamba and Holden do an amazing job of holding things together in midfield given the lack of support the two wide men give them.

Well, defensively Muamba is a definite physical presence, and yes I don't have anything against holden defensively. However Holden in my book is simply not good enough in possession, from what I've seen, and I confess I don't go to as many home games as I used to. Holden did play better against United.

As LK says Petrov and Lee can both produce things that win us games. However, when they don't they're both absolute liabilities. Lee scored and so he gets away with what was otherwise a nothing performance and we'll give him some consideration for his travels. The only thing Petrov produced was an assist for their goal.

I'd gently suggest that you're overlooking the subtle qualities of Lee, nearly every time he gets the ball, he creates positive attacking play, to feet. Now when you have 4 Mahoosive defenders like Stokes, you need something else apart from "hit it to Davies", it's not a luxury, it's a necessity. Lee is an attacking midfielder, it's not his role to back up the defense in that formation, and that said I think he does alright physically compared witht he reputation most asian players have of being lightweights.

Both Muamba and Holden were instrumental in their work yesterday and the fact you can't see it, says a lot. I'd like to see Campo press the ball all over the pitch as Coyle has repeatedly said he demands from his midfielders.

Well, I'd say the same if you couldn't see how Campo used to dictate the play despite being over 150 years old. yes he'd lost it towards the end... but that goes for every player near retirement.

[TKIZ!]

Muamba gets a lot of flack from certain sections but his solid performance combined with Holden yesterday saw us through that game and I for one think although slightly lightweight it's been effective so far.

Its all about balance.

Yes, we'll get carved open now and then, and yes, we provide less protection for our back four.

But the goal we scored against Utd, for example, would never have happened a year ago with the pedestrian midfield we had.

I'm happy with the direction we've taken.

And, like anything new, needs a bit of time to settle. For me it's doing that gradually and making us less defensive and more prone to get it forward and attack. Muamba's the stopper, Holden the link man who's always happy to find a space and receive the ball. Something we've needed for ages.

Totally agree both of you on these points, good posts

[bw@bw]

I'd gently suggest that you're overlooking the subtle qualities of Lee, nearly every time he gets the ball, he creates positive attacking play, to feet. Now when you have 4 Mahoosive defenders like Stokes, you need something else apart from "hit it to Davies", it's not a luxury, it's a necessity. Lee is an attacking midfielder, it's not his role to back up the defense in that formation, and that said I think he does alright physically compared witht he reputation most asian players have of being lightweights.

Oh yes it is.

There are 2 games
When WE have the ball, and
When THEY have the ball


When THEY have the ball every player has to get into position to cut off their attacking options.

In CYL case - to support Steinsson and ensure he is not left to stop the whole of their left side single handed

[malcd1]

Just as an aside. Robinson made the most passes by a considerable distance yesterday according to Chalkboards.

Robinson 51 passes (47 successful)

Next best

Holden 33 passes (26 successful - although 4 of the unsuccessful ones were either corners or a freekick/cross)


http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/chalkboards/create

[SuperChung-Yong]

Oh yes it is.

There are 2 games
When WE have the ball, and
When THEY have the ball

Exactly, and one game leads very quickly into another in the Premier League, to seamlessly transition into a fast attack is very important, having attacking players in good attacking positions is essential just after you've won back the ball.

[boltonboris]

Just as an aside. Robinson made the most passes by a considerable distance yesterday according to Chalkboards.

Robinson 51 passes (47 successful)

Next best

Holden 33 passes (26 successful - although 4 of the unsuccessful ones were either corners or a freekick/cross)


http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/chalkboards/create

That percentage from Holden, in the middle of a very busy and battling midfield is magnificent!!

I was going to comment, that I like him as a player, but despite his top workrate, his busyness and his battling qualities I don't see him as very 'accomplished'. But everytime I see him, he is that little bit better. This time next year, he could be Xavi mark II!

[boltonboris]

Another thing for people slating Davies yesterday, Knight was the only one launching stupid balls at him, but he dominated Shawcross and Faye in the air apart from when he was being blatantly fouled. At the other end, Cahill was dealing with Jones much more easily than Knight, who I thought was relatively poor yesterday

[BWFC_Insane]

Campo was nowhere near a luxury player, he was simply good in every department apart from pace. Which, much like Djorkaeff, he didn't need. But then again we did have Gudni behind 'em.

Well, defensively Muamba is a definite physical presence, and yes I don't have anything against holden defensively. However Holden in my book is simply not good enough in possession, from what I've seen, and I confess I don't go to as many home games as I used to. Holden did play better against United.

I'd gently suggest that you're overlooking the subtle qualities of Lee, nearly every time he gets the ball, he creates positive attacking play, to feet. Now when you have 4 Mahoosive defenders like Stokes, you need something else apart from "hit it to Davies", it's not a luxury, it's a necessity. Lee is an attacking midfielder, it's not his role to back up the defense in that formation, and that said I think he does alright physically compared witht he reputation most asian players have of being lightweights.

Well, I'd say the same if you couldn't see how Campo used to dictate the play despite being over 150 years old. yes he'd lost it towards the end... but that goes for every player near retirement.

Sorry I didn't mean Campo was a luxury, I meant he'd never have worked in a 4-4-2 with two wingers as we play now. I doubt he'd have ever been able to cover half the ground Muamba and Holden do. He fitted into the to the 4-5-1/4-3-3 as the deep lying midfield player but we don't play that system now and he could in no way do Holden or Muamba's job.

I think you seriously underrate Holden. All the stats for passing and tackling point to him being very very very good. I'll be very worried if he or Muamba are out for a significant time ever!

[hisroyalgingerness]

Another thing for people slating Davies yesterday, Knight was the only one launching stupid balls at him, but he dominated Shawcross and Faye in the air apart from when he was being blatantly fouled. At the other end, Cahill was dealing with Jones much more easily than Knight, who I thought was relatively poor yesterday

Wouldn't have said any of the balls were particularly stupid. He got nowt off the ref first and foremost, and he never tends to have good games if he gets nowt off the ref. I remember his first pass he sprayed it out to Steinsson and I thought we were going to see a majestic performance from him. But sadly after that he just gave the ball away too often, some were really sloppy and the two chances he missed were sitters at this level.

[jimbo]

Another thing for people slating Davies yesterday, Knight was the only one launching stupid balls at him, but he dominated Shawcross and Faye in the air apart from when he was being blatantly fouled. At the other end, Cahill was dealing with Jones much more easily than Knight, who I thought was relatively poor yesterday

Wouldn't have said any of the balls were particularly stupid. He got nowt off the ref first and foremost, and he never tends to have good games if he gets nowt off the ref. I remember his first pass he sprayed it out to Steinsson and I thought we were going to see a majestic performance from him. But sadly after that he just gave the ball away too often, some were really sloppy and the two chances he missed were sitters at this level.

Exactly. Just wasn't one of his better days. Got the ball caught in his feet a couple of times, and as mentioned got nothing off the ref. Looked more dangerous when we had players running with the ball at the back 4 rather than when launching it. Must have been difficult for him though after the excitement of midweek.

[CarlosHernandez]

Just wanted to point out what a classic "Klasnic" strike that was... it's damn hard to turn and shoot with that power and accuracy and he is one of the best, and he's done it a few times for us. A great option off the bench as a change up to the bustling Elmander. Another late winner or two like that and he's certainly worth his reported highish wages for a guy with limited minutes.

[Salford Trotter]

If this Stoke Fan Forum thread isn't good enough reason to allow those Staffordshire inbreds to never have more a 1k tickets in any future season at the 'Bok I don't know what is. This is a throwback to the 80s when the hooligan element blighted English football and I can't genuinely remember the last time we saw violence on this scale in the Reebok, if ever! It's a disgrace and hope those involved get banned from football for a very long time!

http://oatcakefanzine.proboards.com/ind ... 705&page=1

I don't get what you mean?

Everyone in that forum thread isn't condoning the action of the said individual, in fact 2 of em give him a clout for doing it. There are nob heads at every club. Hopefully they'll find the guy responsible and ban him.

I know of a few Bolton fans on 3 year banning orders for away game mischief.

Spot on, DJ. Those stokies are giving real shit to the idiot who lobbed a seat into his OWN supporters on the lower tier!!!

I mustn't have made my point clear which is aimed at the general violence surrounding this game not just at the particular incident commented about in the thread quoted. I understand the club trying to maximise the ticket income for the game; god knows we've sold that whole away end out on lots of occasions but we've never had such a bunch of a*seholes come a try and cause havoc the way that a significant minority of Stoke fans have done. Quite laudibly some of their own have rounded on the idiot(s) that instigated the trouble but unless we invest in dozens more coppers then we won't be able to cope so my view would have to only ever limit them to a number that was more manageable in future. Even then I'd insist the travelling fans were members of an official travel club.

[ratbert]

As ever, we have no match report...

Please, please volunteer someone, anyone - even Marc Iles if he posts in here

[Owen_Coyle]

I can't believe that I have seen posts on here complaining about Holden. In my view he has been a revelation. The guy never stops running, breaks play up, helps the attack and defence in equal measures and, most importantly, is easy with ball at his feet; something we have all been seeking for years.

The number of times he "shows" himself for a quick throw-in and brings it down on a sixpence and is ready to splay it round all over the place is a skill that we have long been starved of, and makes a welcome change from our constant throw down the line, which we have become accustomed to for too many years now.

He is a real "find" in my book.

[Salford Trotter]

I can't believe that I have seen posts on here complaining about Holden. In my view he has been a revelation. The guy never stops running, breaks play up, helps the attack and defence in equal measures and, most importantly, is easy with ball at his feet; something we have all been seeking for years.

The number of times he "shows" himself for a quick throw-in and brings it down on a sixpence and is ready to splay it round all over the place is a skill that we have long been starved of, and makes a welcome change from our constant throw down the line, which we have become accustomed to for too many years now.

He is a real "find" in my book.

I couldn't agree more, he is a star in the making mark my words

[TKIZ!]

I can't believe that I have seen posts on here complaining about Holden. In my view he has been a revelation. The guy never stops running, breaks play up, helps the attack and defence in equal measures and, most importantly, is easy with ball at his feet; something we have all been seeking for years.

The number of times he "shows" himself for a quick throw-in and brings it down on a sixpence and is ready to splay it round all over the place is a skill that we have long been starved of, and makes a welcome change from our constant throw down the line, which we have become accustomed to for too many years now.

He is a real "find" in my book.

Down to OC that really, plus the fact he also made the choice to 'follow' OC when he moved to the Wanderers. Otherwise we could have been watching him play in a Burnley shirt