Time to go

[BWFC_Insane]

Who are the alternatives? Does this also not suggest that we're a bit quick on the old trigger finger? What happens if the new manager doesn't do very well and we still end up in the Championship?

Don't think O'Neill will come as he wants money to spend and I don't think we're pragmatic enough to have Hughes in charge, to me that would be similar to having HWSNBN in charge.

Not pragmatic enough to have Hughes? We have a team crying out for organisation as it's not good enough to football it's way out of this!

Hughes is proven at the top level. Whether he'd come or not is the question?

[Tombwfc]

'Who are the alternatives?' was one of the reasons I picked 'maybe' (and because I'm an indecisive feck*), but it's fast becoming irrelevant. I've seen just about enough to say that it's not working, and isn't going to work in the forseeable future. I don't think whoever we appoint will do any worse than we are now, and if they do, well we tried.

[Wandering Willy]

Who are the alternatives? Does this also not suggest that we're a bit quick on the old trigger finger? What happens if the new manager doesn't do very well and we still end up in the Championship?

Don't think O'Neill will come as he wants money to spend and I don't think we're pragmatic enough to have Hughes in charge, to me that would be similar to having HWSNBN in charge.

Not pragmatic enough to have Hughes? We have a team crying out for organisation as it's not good enough to football it's way out of this!

Hughes is proven at the top level. Whether he'd come or not is the question?

There's also a big elephant in the room re his time at City. Unlimited funds in the January and only managed to achieve 10th with a much better squad than we have. Also, finished the last eleven games with only 2 wins. Not sure he's going to be a saviour with a zero budget and limited squad.

[lovethesmellofnapalm]

'Who are the alternatives?' was one of the reasons I picked 'maybe' (and because I'm an indecisive feck), but it's fast becoming irrelevant. I've seen just about enough to say that it's not working, and isn't going to work in the forseeable future. I don't think whoever we appoint will do any worse than we are now, and if they do, well we tried.

this bit.
Coyle is either good enough or not. of all the reasons to or not to sack Coyle worryiing about "the alternatives" is bottom of the pile of considerations.

[Turkish Trotter]

No point debating who will replace him, as I can't see the board getting rid. He was Gartsides first choice, and he'll stick with him.
Whether thats right or wrong is open to debate, but FFS whilst he's still here lets get behind him, every one was happy when he came unlike HWSNBN.

[Wandering Willy]

Coyle is either good enough or not. of all the reasons to or not to sack Coyle worryiing about "the alternatives" is bottom of the pile of considerations.

Ah - the "he's shite, just get someone else" position. I fear that's a large step towards Deluded Geordie territory.

[Prufrock]

'Who are the alternatives?' was one of the reasons I picked 'maybe' (and because I'm an indecisive feck), but it's fast becoming irrelevant. I've seen just about enough to say that it's not working, and isn't going to work in the forseeable future. I don't think whoever we appoint will do any worse than we are now, and if they do, well we tried.

this bit.
Coyle is either good enough or not. of all the reasons to or not to sack Coyle worryiing about "the alternatives" is bottom of the pile of considerations.

No it isn't. Good enough for what? To keep us up? If he isn't good enough, great, but there is no point spending money we don't have to get somebody else in who also can't keep us up. I'm in the 'stay' camp, because I don't think there is anybody we could get who would be an improvement. My current thinking is, if the board think they can get somebody better, at this stage, I'd be saying fine, sack him. If Hughes were interested, fine, sack Coyle, bring him in. Personally I don't think he is, but the board would be in a much better position than any of us to judge that.

Whenever we talk about who may be interested it is guess work, and as such I fully understand those who want rid because they feel we could get somebody better. What I can't agree with is those who want rid regardless of whether we could get anybody better.

Everton is massive, IMO. Our success last season was built on our home form. So far this season we have had City, United and Chelsea, which, dissapoiting or not, we can take losing in. We have also had Norwich, Sunderland, and Stoke. The first two were woeful, the latter very good. Home form is crucial in relegation scraps. We were top half for most of last year based entirely on home form, when that fell away, we dropped like a stone.

[Andy Waller]

I think a change in the back room staff might be the answer? We were bloody useless 2nd half yesterday.

[lovethesmellofnapalm]

Coyle is either good enough or not. of all the reasons to or not to sack Coyle worryiing about "the alternatives" is bottom of the pile of considerations.

Ah - the "he's shite, just get someone else" position. I fear that's a large step towards Deluded Geordie territory.

no not at all
i think he is/will prove to be a good manager.
but if he isnt/doesn,t the argument that we should keep him because we might not get anything "better" is bollox.

[officer_dibble]

I think a change in the back room staff might be the answer? We were bloody useless 2nd half yesterday.

See I'd agree - whoever he has coaching is fecking useless

But he picked em

And if he's anything about him, he'll fire 'em, more likely it will be 'me and my staff' so they go, I go type of thing (hang on I'm turning into a1).

It aint working, it's lookling ever less likely to work - if ever we had a chance to string together two positive (i.e. non defeats) results it would be on the back of walloping someone 5-0, particularly the original team where it all began 5-0. We fecked it up. In style.

Some of the posters now saying this is inevitable are the level heads - once prufrock turns we have the full set.

I don't want him to be sacked but I fear he has to be save a miracle next couple of matches.

[thebish]

I suspect this "back room staff" has basically been employed to be the gurning cheerleaders - like the original Steve Wright in the afternoon radio crew - now morphed into the gurning morons who laugh in the background at everything fatty moyles says or does...

[Hoboh]

I do wish those who want to keep Coyle would actually tell us were the the turning point is coming from preferably before Christmas instead of falling behind the "who else could do better". We need max points from the next two games, failiure is not an option or Owen Coyle should go along with his "ping pong" trainers.
IMHO I think he's lost the ability to motivate the players by being too close to some of them and it shows on the field, he is fast approaching the time were even if he was to get tough with a few of them it would make no difference, managers have to manage its what they are paid for you can never be "one of the lads" and succeed.

[Armchair Wanderer]

I suspect this "back room staff" has basically been employed to be the gurning cheerleaders - like the original Steve Wright in the afternoon radio crew - now morphed into the gurning morons who laugh in the background at everything fatty moyles says or does...

Do we have anyone on the backroom staff who isn't part of Team Coyle? Who would we get to take over as a caretaker for a couple of games?

I'm not sure exactly how crucial this whole EPL thing is. With parachute payments we might be willing to give this year a go with OC. If he keeps us up it's awesome, if he takes us down his contract expires anyway. Inexpensive either way. Also, it depends on how long-term we're thinking. Even if OC does take us down, maybe he's learned lessons and can get us back up again!? No idea what ED/PG will be thinking on this.

[Hoboh]

I suspect this "back room staff" has basically been employed to be the gurning cheerleaders - like the original Steve Wright in the afternoon radio crew - now morphed into the gurning morons who laugh in the background at everything fatty moyles says or does...

Do we have anyone on the backroom staff who isn't part of Team Coyle? Who would we get to take over as a caretaker for a couple of games?

I'm not sure exactly how crucial this whole EPL thing is. With parachute payments we might be willing to give this year a go with OC. If he keeps us up it's awesome, if he takes us down his contract expires anyway. Inexpensive either way. Also, it depends on how long-term we're thinking. Even if OC does take us down, maybe he's learned lessons and can get us back up again!? No idea what ED/PG will be thinking on this.

He had those at Burnley they were sinking like a stone when he left them, we are now in the same position he must have been bunking school!

I was so excited when Coyle came to us after the drudge of Megson so excited I kinda glossed over what was happening and the warning bells from Turf Moor and saw a brighter future. Sure it worked well to start and when your on a roll its great such as it must have been for the Burnley fans but then the bubble burst. Owen must be a great guy to have around when its going well but he don't cut it when times are tough, sorry.

[Wandering Willy]

I do wish those who want to keep Coyle would actually tell us were the the turning point is coming from preferably before Christmas instead of falling behind the "who else could do better". .

For me that's very relevant. I suspect the problems we have at the club are much more systemic than "we're not doing well, it's the manager's fault". The lack of funds and injuries to key players are just two issues we are possibly just not strong enough to deal with.

A relegation battle is certainly on the cards at the moment, and barring some amazing signings/loans in January we are in for a struggle this year all the way to the end. Making a change for the sake of it will not address the underlying issues at the club and in the absence of a miracle-working saviour manager we just may well be still in the best hands available. Hands that may not be able to keep us up.

[BWFC_Insane]

I think there is a lot of people trying to fudge the issue.

You are either confident Coyle will keep us up or not.

If you think he may not then SURELY to GOD we have to try and change? If you think he's taking us down then irrespective of "is there anyone better?" surely we've got to try something different?

I also think it doesn't come down to necessarily someone "better", but someone with the requisite skills for the situation we're in. Someone astute who can get us to fight our way out of it, someone who will send a team out and give them a chance rather than hamper them?

[boltonboris]

I'm not sure what else can be done. I'm been in his camp for ages, but it comes down to the players mentality. I'm not sure he's got it in him to get the players out of their slump.

The midfield was deeper than the remnants of the titanic in the second half on Saturday, but for whatever reason, he just couldn't get the team to play higher up the pitch.. I didn't even see him gesturing them out. That suggests a defeatist attitude in the lads on the pitch and I'm positive it wasn't a tactical instruction.

[Worthy4England]

I think there is a lot of people trying to fudge the issue.

You are either confident Coyle will keep us up or not.

If you think he may not then SURELY to GOD we have to try and change? If you think he's taking us down then irrespective of "is there anyone better?" surely we've got to try something different?

I also think it doesn't come down to necessarily someone "better", but someone with the requisite skills for the situation we're in. Someone astute who can get us to fight our way out of it, someone who will send a team out and give them a chance rather than hamper them?

As a "while we're at it", the people who are saying "can we afford to replace the Manager" and "we're skint" probably need to weigh that against the loss of TV Revenue from £38m in the last Accounts to £16m which is the current parachute payment. I think I could replace a couple of managers for £22m

[BWFC_Insane]

I'm not sure what else can be done. I'm been in his camp for ages, but it comes down to the players mentality. I'm not sure he's got it in him to get the players out of their slump.

The midfield was deeper than the remnants of the titanic in the second half on Saturday, but for whatever reason, he just couldn't get the team to play higher up the pitch.. I didn't even see him gesturing them out. That suggests a defeatist attitude in the lads on the pitch and I'm positive it wasn't a tactical instruction.

But Hodgson pushed their back four up 10 yards at half time and pushed Shorey right up (realising that Mark Davies wasn't a natural winger).

It meant they overloaded the right hand side against a young right back and Mark Davies who went missing. And you could see the problems 5 minutes in.

Where did the goal come from? Mark Davies in no mans land letting Shorey get an unchallenged cross into the box.

Hodgson worked us out. No pace in behind and narrow in midfield on the right hand side.

Blatantly what Coyle needed to do was put someone on the right hand side who would either track Shorey adequately or ideally stop him from being able to push so far forwards. He didn't. He also blatantly needed to change it up front to stop their centre halves dominating so high up the pitch. He did, but only once the game was up.

The players were shocking second half no question. But the manager hampered them as well!

[Andy Waller]

I'm not sure what else can be done. I'm been in his camp for ages, but it comes down to the players mentality. I'm not sure he's got it in him to get the players out of their slump.

The midfield was deeper than the remnants of the titanic in the second half on Saturday, but for whatever reason, he just couldn't get the team to play higher up the pitch.. I didn't even see him gesturing them out. That suggests a defeatist attitude in the lads on the pitch and I'm positive it wasn't a tactical instruction.

But Hodgson pushed their back four up 10 yards at half time and pushed Shorey right up (realising that Mark Davies wasn't a natural winger).

It meant they overloaded the right hand side against a young right back and Mark Davies who went missing. And you could see the problems 5 minutes in.

Where did the goal come from? Mark Davies in no mans land letting Shorey get an unchallenged cross into the box.

Hodgson worked us out. No pace in behind and narrow in midfield on the right hand side.

Blatantly what Coyle needed to do was put someone on the right hand side who would either track Shorey adequately or ideally stop him from being able to push so far forwards. He didn't. He also blatantly needed to change it up front to stop their centre halves dominating so high up the pitch. He did, but only once the game was up.

The players were shocking second half no question. But the manager hampered them as well!

The worst thing was that Shorey had done exactly the same thing 3-4 times in the 5 mins leading up to their 2nd goal.