Season expectations

[Mar]

I despise the notion that we have a better squad than the rest of the league. Apparently we had the same last year but with no cutting edge in the midfield or up front, are we suddenly supposed to think just because we've dropped down a league that all of our players are going to start banging the goals in left right and a center?

We're still going to struggle for goals up front. We should definitely score more but we're missing clinical goal scorers at the club. The midfield should help chip in with a few but what we need is to sort out the problem we had last season of the possession being given away cheaply by the midfield and upfront. I don't think we've corrected that yet with who we have signed in midfield (I don't even think we've got like for like, as Keith Andrews just seems another Pratley type as opposed to Muamba/Reo-Coker role).

If creating chances is having Eagles longshots or Andrews longshots then i'd rather just keep possession. They'll get their chances but certainly don't want them being outside the box (except the odd one).

[Worthy4England]

I despise the notion that we have a better squad than the rest of the league.

I understand - but.

The point is we should have a better squad (than many) with the finances the Manager has at his disposal. If we ain't then it's right to ask why.

[thebish]

I despise the notion that we have a better squad than the rest of the league.

I understand - but.

The point is we should have a better squad (than many) with the finances the Manager has at his disposal. If we ain't then it's right to ask why.

I can understand the claim that one or two of the players are "obviously better than championship" players - but I'm not so sure that it is as clear as BWFCi makes out that MOST of them are.

nor am I sure how you would make the judgement that a player fits into the category "premiership standard" or "championship standard" - at best it would be a highly subjective judgement and so, not at all obvious.

the easiest measure I can think of is that a "premiership standard" player playing in the championship would find himself a target for a premiership club looking to fill that position - no?

[Tombwfc]

It doesn't really matter what my opinions of the players we have are, although FWIW I don't subscribe to the view that dropping down a division is the equivalent of sticking Fifa on 'Amateur' mode.

The thread is about season expectations (well it's actually about some fella who'll never post again plugging his site, but beyond that), and there's no reason to expect anything other than success. Three teams get promoted and we have advantages that are only shared by two other sides in the division (both of whom we finished above last season).

In 10/11 our wage bill was £46mil (I think) and the biggest in the Championship was £29.7mil (QPR, who won the league), only three teams had a wage bill of over £20mil. Ours will have dropped significantly, but surely not to that degree.

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

My expectation is that we should be very competitive in the Championship...meaning top 6 minimum. We will only achieve promotion if Coyle has learnt most of the lessons that need to be learnt. This I expect wont be achieved and we'll have a mixed season of results and much bitching and bedsheets. I can't wait

[Worthy4England]

I despise the notion that we have a better squad than the rest of the league.

I understand - but.

The point is we should have a better squad (than many) with the finances the Manager has at his disposal. If we ain't then it's right to ask why.

I can understand the claim that one or two of the players are "obviously better than championship" players - but I'm not so sure that it is as clear as BWFCi makes out that MOST of them are.

nor am I sure how you would make the judgement that a player fits into the category "premiership standard" or "championship standard" - at best it would be a highly subjective judgement and so, not at all obvious.

the easiest measure I can think of is that a "premiership standard" player playing in the championship would find himself a target for a premiership club looking to fill that position - no?

I think there is possibly an easier measure - which would be are we in the Premiership or are we in the Championship.

I look across the squad we have left, and I'd say that quite a few of them have managed to play and stay in the Premiership for more than one season.

Knight, Ricketts, Holden, CYL, Petrov, SKD, Mavies (who I'll add just to prevent national outcry), Muamba.

Of those, you could easily argue that Muamba, Holden and CYL might never get back to their best - probably with varying degrees by player.

Petrov/SKD aren't getting any younger

Knight generally has "help" from his defensive partner

Then you're left with Ricketts - who we would probably have regarded as "decent cover" when he was signed - and Mavies who is either Messi or Danny Guthrie, dependent on who you talk to.

I've deliberately left off N'gog as he generally wasn't good enough for Liverpool and the one full season he's had with us we got relegated.

I've also left off our recent signings as I'm not really sure about any of them at this stage.

It starts to look fairly thin.

We probably spent more just on N'gog than Reading spent in total last season on transfer fees.

[BWFC_Insane]

I despise the notion that we have a better squad than the rest of the league.

I understand - but.

The point is we should have a better squad (than many) with the finances the Manager has at his disposal. If we ain't then it's right to ask why.

I can understand the claim that one or two of the players are "obviously better than championship" players - but I'm not so sure that it is as clear as BWFCi makes out that MOST of them are.

nor am I sure how you would make the judgement that a player fits into the category "premiership standard" or "championship standard" - at best it would be a highly subjective judgement and so, not at all obvious.

the easiest measure I can think of is that a "premiership standard" player playing in the championship would find himself a target for a premiership club looking to fill that position - no?

Bish you are right that it isn't as simple as saying they are 'championship' or 'premiership' standard. But equally your measure that if any of our players were premiership standard a premiership club would have bought them is a little off too. We were a premiership club when we signed Mears, Eagles, Sordell etc.....

Personally I think we've got a good enough side to go back up. More than good enough IMO. If you don't think we do, then you must think Coyle is a truly horrible manager beyond all proportion.

It would be arrogant to say we are definitely going up. But to say we should go up, when you look at the budget we have the players we have and the experience in there, we should go back IMO barring mismanagement again.

[Wandering Willy]

We'll go nowhere if we keep starting Kevin Davies.

Time to move on.

[the-Bowtun-Warrior]

We'll go nowhere if we keep starting Kevin Davies.

Time to move on.

Oh let's try N'Gog who's been in training 2 days or Sordell who's with the England & Wales football team...

[Peter Thompson]

We'll go nowhere if we keep starting Kevin Davies.

Time to move on.

This....absolutely spot on.

He was generally poor & past it last season, now at 35 it will be very surprising (but typical of Coyle !) to start him every week. IMO though we won't go up playing K Davies & N'Gog every week, it was a daft decision by Coyle to retain K Davies & Knight both are just not good enough.

We desperately need another goalscoring striker to play alongside Sordell if we are to have a chance of going up.

[Wandering Willy]

We'll go nowhere if we keep starting Kevin Davies.

Time to move on.

Oh let's try N'Gog who's been in training 2 days or Sordell who's with the England & Wales football team...

I was referring to the season ahead, not tonight's game.

That's why it's in the "Season's Expectations" thread.

[thebish]

I despise the notion that we have a better squad than the rest of the league.

I understand - but.

The point is we should have a better squad (than many) with the finances the Manager has at his disposal. If we ain't then it's right to ask why.

I can understand the claim that one or two of the players are "obviously better than championship" players - but I'm not so sure that it is as clear as BWFCi makes out that MOST of them are.

nor am I sure how you would make the judgement that a player fits into the category "premiership standard" or "championship standard" - at best it would be a highly subjective judgement and so, not at all obvious.

the easiest measure I can think of is that a "premiership standard" player playing in the championship would find himself a target for a premiership club looking to fill that position - no?

Bish you are right that it isn't as simple as saying they are 'championship' or 'premiership' standard. But equally your measure that if any of our players were premiership standard a premiership club would have bought them is a little off too. We were a premiership club when we signed Mears, Eagles, Sordell etc.....

Personally I think we've got a good enough side to go back up. More than good enough IMO. If you don't think we do, then you must think Coyle is a truly horrible manager beyond all proportion.

It would be arrogant to say we are definitely going up. But to say we should go up, when you look at the budget we have the players we have and the experience in there, we should go back IMO barring mismanagement again.

I think we have a good enough side to go up. (I've never said otherwise)

but I don't think we have any RIGHT to go up - so that if we don't - then I don't think it will necessarily be an utter and total shameful failure.

we are not the only club in the championship that has a squad capable of competing.

and I don't think it really means anything to say that most of our players are simply above all this - they aren't.

I disagree with you that mismanagement could be the only explanation for not going up - the game is a lot more complicated than that. It might be the reason - but it's not the only possible reason.

so - to say - barring mismanagement we SHOULD go up - (to me) - does sound arrogant.


(also I think you are (deliberately?) guilty of a logic-fail. If I say that a sign of a premiership player in the championship is that a premiership club looking to fill his position would have a look at him - that is in no way logically equivalent to your characterization of my argument that every player bought by a premiership club - like the examples you gave - is a "premiership standard" player.)

[Harry Genshaw]

The championship is an odd division in that players who may be considered Premiership class can suddenly look ordinary or lose motivation. The fact we finished above Wolves & Blackburn last year will mean nowt this year. In the same way it meant nowt to City & QPR when they finished above us when we all went down, then were left by the wayside when we romped through to promotion the following year.

There were some well supported and/or financially strong sides in the championship already. Theres now 3 decent sides coming up into the division as well as the 3 of us that came down.

We have to hope we'll be in the mix somewhere but I cant understand anyone who thinks we'll be a shoe in

[officer_dibble]

We'll go nowhere if we keep starting Kevin Davies.

Time to move on.

I'd of given you a plus one, or a fvcking A or whatever it is 6 months ago...however as I do every pre seasonI'm thinking he is due another chance. He was clearly injured for about 6 months last season. We're in a league he should do well in.

However I wouldnt contemplate him and ngoals up top. Two non scoring centre forwards, no thanks. Yet I expect that to be what we go for...

If he plays like he did most of last year use him as an impact sub

[plymouth wanderer]

We'll go nowhere if we keep starting Kevin Davies.

Time to move on.

I'd of given you a plus one, or a fvcking A or whatever it is 6 months ago...however as I do every pre seasonI'm thinking he is due another chance. He was clearly injured for about 6 months last season. We're in a league he should do well in.

However I wouldnt contemplate him and ngoals up top. Two non scoring centre forwards, no thanks. Yet I expect that to be what we go for...

If he plays like he did most of last year use him as an impact sub

Fvcking A

[Wandering Willy]

You're falling for it again, like Coyle is. I'll be along with a big "I told you so" around Christmas.

KD - rubbish facing the goal and no longer effective with his back to it.

[Lord Kangana]

It doesn't really matter what my opinions of the players we have are, although FWIW I don't subscribe to the view that dropping down a division is the equivalent of sticking Fifa on 'Amateur' mode.

The thread is about season expectations (well it's actually about some fella who'll never post again plugging his site, but beyond that), and there's no reason to expect anything other than success. Three teams get promoted and we have advantages that are only shared by two other sides in the division (both of whom we finished above last season).

In 10/11 our wage bill was £46mil (I think) and the biggest in the Championship was £29.7mil (QPR, who won the league), only three teams had a wage bill of over £20mil. Ours will have dropped significantly, but surely not to that degree.

By 50% I seem to recall our infallible chairman (not our fallible manager) saying.

Which, with some rudimentary maths, would put us somewhere below last season's winners.

[BWFC_Insane]

It doesn't really matter what my opinions of the players we have are, although FWIW I don't subscribe to the view that dropping down a division is the equivalent of sticking Fifa on 'Amateur' mode.

The thread is about season expectations (well it's actually about some fella who'll never post again plugging his site, but beyond that), and there's no reason to expect anything other than success. Three teams get promoted and we have advantages that are only shared by two other sides in the division (both of whom we finished above last season).

In 10/11 our wage bill was £46mil (I think) and the biggest in the Championship was £29.7mil (QPR, who won the league), only three teams had a wage bill of over £20mil. Ours will have dropped significantly, but surely not to that degree.

By 50% I seem to recall our infallible chairman (not our fallible manager) saying.

Which, with some rudimentary maths, would put us somewhere below last season's winners.

What was Readings wage bill? Can't have been 23M?

[officer_dibble]

WW = why wait till Crimbo?

I'll know by mid september if he's up to it. And if not, he should be binned off in favor of Sordell and another. Or Sordell on his own.

I'm not saying your wrong, I'm saying lets see if your wrong...if not, bin him off. And risk the wrath of Tango!!

[Tombwfc]

It doesn't really matter what my opinions of the players we have are, although FWIW I don't subscribe to the view that dropping down a division is the equivalent of sticking Fifa on 'Amateur' mode.

The thread is about season expectations (well it's actually about some fella who'll never post again plugging his site, but beyond that), and there's no reason to expect anything other than success. Three teams get promoted and we have advantages that are only shared by two other sides in the division (both of whom we finished above last season).

In 10/11 our wage bill was £46mil (I think) and the biggest in the Championship was £29.7mil (QPR, who won the league), only three teams had a wage bill of over £20mil. Ours will have dropped significantly, but surely not to that degree.

By 50% I seem to recall our infallible chairman (not our fallible manager) saying.

Which, with some rudimentary maths, would put us somewhere below last season's winners.

What was Readings wage bill? Can't have been 23M?

Reading's for that season was £18.3mil.

Even if we have halved ours since then, that'd still put us higher than every team in the Championship from that year apart from QPR and Middlesborough, who also claim to have cut their wage bill by half since. Birmingham and Blackpool both entered the league for last season, but Blackpools was never that high to begin with and Brum sold off their entire team.

All in all, almost certainly, the teams with the three largest wage bills in the Championship next season (by a fair distance) will be us, Blackburn and Wolves.