Is anybody not convinced yet

[Jakerbeef]

Yes, we've turned our academy into a promising one but don't do it to the detriment of players coming in from overseas.

Er....really?

[BL3]

He had an accidental good run when 4-5-1 was forced upon him.

So he gets the blame when we lose but no credit when we win?

[BWFC_Insane]

He had an accidental good run when 4-5-1 was forced upon him.

So he gets the blame when we lose but no credit when we win?

No he gets the blame for the overall ratio of winning to losing being bad enough to take us down.

Is that fair enough?

[norm the jedi]

Didn't starting out 4-5-1 last night indicate the possibility of a glimmer of a lesson learned..?

[boltonboris]

It probably just means he wanted to keep Davies and Sordell fresh for Hull.

[Verbal]

Time to shuffle off this (im)mortal Coyle?

[Relentless09]

Didn't starting out 4-5-1 last night indicate the possibility of a glimmer of a lesson learned..?

Yes it did until he switched back to 442 for some unbelievable reason

[truewhite15]

Didn't starting out 4-5-1 last night indicate the possibility of a glimmer of a lesson learned..?

Unfortunately, after 18 months of diabolical tactical mistakes, or lack of tactics altogether, a "possibility of a glimmer of a lesson learned" is no-fecking-where near enough.

[bobo the clown]

He had an accidental good run when 4-5-1 was forced upon him.

So he gets the blame when we lose but no credit when we win?

... but HE didn't make that switch last December & January. It was forced onto him.

We got a number of good performances & results & seemed to have turned a corner then, as soon as the players became available again he reverted .... v Wigan at home. This was the moment I lost all ability to put up with him.

We lost that & began our terminal decline during which time e held onto the failed tactics again.

So, credit where it's due ..... & in that case, none to him.

[BWFC_Insane]

Its not just tactics though. Its the fact that players over long periods are "underperforming", we don't ever look like a team, more a group of individuals where we hope some will perform well so we win games.

There doesn't from the sidelines at least appear to be a great unity, or passion or collective responsibility and desire. There seems to be a lot of "we'll get our heads down and work harder" and "we have to do better" stuff, but actually the same problems keep cropping up.

The 4-4-2 and the "walking through our midfield" could to an extent be forgiven IF players were performing to their peak and we looked hungry for results.

However, we don't. We look unsure, scared and in some cases a bit unwilling.

The whole thing doesn't look or feel or seem right. It seems like there are some pretty huge problems.

When we had bad runs under Allardyce you always felt we would bounce back stronger, come out punching.

Even under Megson the players seemed to be able to really pull together every so often when the going got tough.

We had some of that after Muamba's unfortunate situation. Once that went though we're back to what looks again from the sidelines to be a pretty soulless, unmotivated, leaderless, limp group!

[bobby5]

Isn't there meant to be coaching in between games? I'm convinced there is no game plan, no studying of the opposition, no tactics just a 'go out and express yourself' mentality. The team needs coaching. Start with pass the ball then move. Massive gaps all over the pitch. Always look like conceding at corners.

[P.O.S.]

Isn't there meant to be coaching in between games? I'm convinced there is no game plan, no studying of the opposition, no tactics just a 'go out and express yourself' mentality. The team needs coaching. Start with pass the ball then move. Massive gaps all over the pitch. Always look like conceding at corners.

Exactly how Ive felt for months. Never look like theyre set up to deal with a certain opponents' strengths or attack in a way that will expose the opponents' weaknesses.

I keep saying it, but you cant say we're good at or specialise in a certain area anymore (okay cue the obvious response!). You couldnt say we're dangerous from set pieces, or that we can cause a problem from the wings, or that weve got a playmaker who you can rely on to force something to happen more often than not.

[50sQuiff]

Isn't there meant to be coaching in between games? I'm convinced there is no game plan, no studying of the opposition, no tactics just a 'go out and express yourself' mentality. The team needs coaching. Start with pass the ball then move. Massive gaps all over the pitch. Always look like conceding at corners.

Just bob on. Extremely well said. It makes me sick to think about Allardyce with his dossiers, DVDs, prozone, sat up in the stands with his radio mic. OK, by the end Sam squeezed the creativity out of football completely. But he was the epitome of a modern sports manager in his methodical and holistic approach. Coyle is a cavalier Keegan-type who is completely ill-equipped for his job. Once the buccaneering honeymoon period (made possible by two unusually fit, dynamic and aggressive central midfielders) was over we just sank like a rock.

Its not just tactics though. Its the fact that players over long periods are "underperforming", we don't ever look like a team, more a group of individuals where we hope some will perform well so we win games.

There doesn't from the sidelines at least appear to be a great unity, or passion or collective responsibility and desire. There seems to be a lot of "we'll get our heads down and work harder" and "we have to do better" stuff, but actually the same problems keep cropping up.

The 4-4-2 and the "walking through our midfield" could to an extent be forgiven IF players were performing to their peak and we looked hungry for results.

However, we don't. We look unsure, scared and in some cases a bit unwilling.

The whole thing doesn't look or feel or seem right. It seems like there are some pretty huge problems.

When we had bad runs under Allardyce you always felt we would bounce back stronger, come out punching.

Even under Megson the players seemed to be able to really pull together every so often when the going got tough.

We had some of that after Muamba's unfortunate situation. Once that went though we're back to what looks again from the sidelines to be a pretty soulless, unmotivated, leaderless, limp group!

Couldn't have put it better. If you've got one or two players looking listless, unfit and disinterested, it's probably a problem with the individuals. But if the malaise is affecting the whole side, there's little doubt in my mind that the problem is with the leadership.

It's not a case of wealthy footballers not giving a shit either. Better-paid sides perform with much more passion and intensity. Hell, just look at Man Ure's megabucks millionaires with double-digit trophies. They still play with pride and a hunger for three points completely unfamiliar to our own team.

In any walk of life the manager is responsible for the team's organisation, discipline, motivation and morale. We've plumbed new depths - below the Megson oceanic trench - on all four counts now, so I can only surmise the manager is incapable of fulfilling his most basic duties. Coyle should've gone before Christmas when the writing was on the wall. Every week since has been a slow-motion train wreck.

Owen, you're a deeply religious man, so by the grace of God, go!