Pre season friendlies at Macc, Preston, Tranmere and Dale

[Burnden Paddock]

Thought it looked harsh until I saw a replay; it wasn't. Really poor tackle. Hope Brondby's manager doesn't get a load of stick for playing that lad in a pointless pre-season friendly against some Championship no-hopers.

Also, I'm convinced it's in Baptiste's contract that he can't play centre-half. Him at LB and Ream at CB makes, like, no sense.

same old, same old, no creativity and low level of skill.

And so it begins!!!

[Worthy4England]

Thought it looked harsh until I saw a replay; it wasn't. Really poor tackle. Hope Brondby's manager doesn't get a load of stick for playing that lad in a pointless pre-season friendly against some Championship no-hopers.

Also, I'm convinced it's in Baptiste's contract that he can't play centre-half. Him at LB and Ream at CB makes, like, no sense.

same old, same old, no creativity and low level of skill.

And so it begins!!!

Pretty much as it finished.

Good news is, at two pengy's per match, we're looking good for one goal!

Woot!

[Devon White]

Thought it looked harsh until I saw a replay; it wasn't. Really poor tackle. Hope Brondby's manager doesn't get a load of stick for playing that lad in a pointless pre-season friendly against some Championship no-hopers.

Also, I'm convinced it's in Baptiste's contract that he can't play centre-half. Him at LB and Ream at CB makes, like, no sense.

same old, same old, no creativity and low level of skill.

And so it begins!!!

sorry, its just like the majority of the away games i saw last season, and i only wish it would change, but based on that tonight thats the way i see it. Hope it changes, i may get value for money at away games !

[Burnden Paddock]

Thought it looked harsh until I saw a replay; it wasn't. Really poor tackle. Hope Brondby's manager doesn't get a load of stick for playing that lad in a pointless pre-season friendly against some Championship no-hopers.

Also, I'm convinced it's in Baptiste's contract that he can't play centre-half. Him at LB and Ream at CB makes, like, no sense.

same old, same old, no creativity and low level of skill.

And so it begins!!!

sorry, its just like the majority of the away games i saw last season, and i only wish it would change, but based on that tonight thats the way i see it. Hope it changes, i may get value for money at away games !

I know what you're saying. It was the first game of pre-season though tbf. Let's give them a few weeks before the pitchforks come out, eh?

[Devon White]

Thought it looked harsh until I saw a replay; it wasn't. Really poor tackle. Hope Brondby's manager doesn't get a load of stick for playing that lad in a pointless pre-season friendly against some Championship no-hopers.

Also, I'm convinced it's in Baptiste's contract that he can't play centre-half. Him at LB and Ream at CB makes, like, no sense.

same old, same old, no creativity and low level of skill.

And so it begins!!!

sorry, its just like the majority of the away games i saw last season, and i only wish it would change, but based on that tonight thats the way i see it. Hope it changes, i may get value for money at away games !

I know what you're saying. It was the first game of pre-season though tbf. Let's give them a few weeks before the pitchforks come out, eh?

yes fair point, looking forward to watford whatever happens,

[Il Pirate]

Just the ten subs at ht.

@OfficialBWFC: Baptiste, Dervite, Ream, Riley, @dannzy1, Spearing, Pratley, @RobHall46, @Craig28Davies and the trialist are all on.

All 10 outfielders. Nice!

PS: Bogdan not in matchday squad. Feel free to jump to a conclusion.

He's poorly!! Errr....pissed.........Missed the coach............Can't be arsed..................Oh feck, just get rid..............

[TonyDomingos]

Highlights
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xF6jK1g ... 53l44i0LFw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[bobo the clown]

Highlights
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xF6jK1g ... 53l44i0LFw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Nice strip.

[Gary the Enfield]

There's a fair few hospital balls in that clip.

[BWFC_Insane]

I only caught the last half hour or so last night but I thought our shape looked decent. The trialist lad looked like he had some clue. Played on the left and positionally seemed to understand the role. More than can be said for Rob Hall on the other side like. Craig Davies seemed to be trying to make a point, worked very hard. His problem is controlling the ball and making it stick. He's a big lad but the ball bounces off him way too much.

The challenge from Hall in a pre-season friendly was stupid and the lad wants to look at himself. It is a meaningless game, no need for that and I agreed with the refs verdict. Might in certain contexts be seen as harsh but it was an absolutely stupid and reckless challenge at that point in pre-season.

Considering Brondby are well ahead of us in pre-season terms I thought we held our own well enough but I missed the first half which sounded worse.

I'd be surprised if we don't give that trialist lad another chance, at 21 he doesn't look any worse to me than several who'll be in our side next season and perhaps might offer something a bit unusual. Time will tell.

I'd like Dougie to work on the midfield this pre-season. Too often last season we were caught out with one simple pass or run and I saw the same happen last night. One player has to drop a bit deeper and be disciplined when we don't have the ball for me so that we have depth in there. All too often Spearing presses when he should drop IMO and leaves a big gap in behind that is too easy for a team to exploit. But Spearing isn't the only culprit.

I also would like to see us really work on players offering up simple passes constantly. Too often we surrender possession, away from home especially, because someone is too dozy to drop into space to receive the ball. Even if it is square that is better than just giving it away.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

BWFCi's last two points there speak to football's central, obvious, underheralded truth: the game is about players and positions. Starting formations to a certain extent, but reacting to where the ball and the opponents are, in possession or out of it. We wouldn't be the first or last team to apparently lack shape, and one issue is that there's no right answer: for instance, in BWFCi's example, if Spearing *doesn't* press the ball the danger might only get worse. What team-mates have to do is react to each other as well as the developing situation. But hey-ho.

Thoughts: first penalty caused by typical Mavies run into the area, which is good to see. Second penalty caused by an intelligent through-ball by Creativity's Neil Danns, which is also good to see.

Hall's challenge deserved a managerial bollocking, red card or not. He'd just got tippled over and not got the free-kick, so he bundled into an unwise, hot-headed challenge. Whether or not it was expulsion-worthy, he gave the ref the option.

[Andy Waller]

Is anyone going to Macc or Port Vale??

[BWFC_Insane]

BWFCi's last two points there speak to football's central, obvious, underheralded truth: the game is about players and positions. Starting formations to a certain extent, but reacting to where the ball and the opponents are, in possession or out of it. We wouldn't be the first or last team to apparently lack shape, and one issue is that there's no right answer: for instance, in BWFCi's example, if Spearing *doesn't* press the ball the danger might only get worse. What team-mates have to do is react to each other as well as the developing situation. But hey-ho.

Thoughts: first penalty caused by typical Mavies run into the area, which is good to see. Second penalty caused by an intelligent through-ball by Creativity's Neil Danns, which is also good to see.

Hall's challenge deserved a managerial bollocking, red card or not. He'd just got tippled over and not got the free-kick, so he bundled into an unwise, hot-headed challenge. Whether or not it was expulsion-worthy, he gave the ref the option.

It is about communication though. Often Spearing and Danns both got caught square pressing. It happened so much last season, especially early on. I'm a big believer in having one midfield player sitting right in front of your back four, filling space. I personally think that is essential in the modern game. But if you don't have that you still need to make sure as you say that players are switched on and that both midfield players don't press the same ball and get caught out.

[Prufrock]

I think it's interesting in a proper nerdy way. The difference between the midfield three that we played under Sam and Mourinho's Chelsea played first time around, with a Makelele or Campo holding and two box-to-boxers, and the current trend of two deeper but not sitting midfielders behind a '10'. If you have the world-class 10, the Sneijder of a few years ago, of James Rodriguez now, then the current 4-2-3-1 is probably the best way to go (depending of course on what else you have) but if you don't, I'm not convinced it's better than the old Allardyce style 3.

In both cases you have a flat two 'engaged' in the middle, and one spare. In the old way, the one spare is your sitter, and gives you a bit more insurance. In the 'new' way, the spare is your 10, who has freedom to be in the best place to lead a counter. Given that I'm not sure we have that '10' we might be better having Spearing or Medo sit. Does put more onus on your wingers to be brilliant though...so maybe not

[TKIZ!]

Thought it looked harsh until I saw a replay; it wasn't. Really poor tackle. Hope Brondby's manager doesn't get a load of stick for playing that lad in a pointless pre-season friendly against some Championship no-hopers.

Also, I'm convinced it's in Baptiste's contract that he can't play centre-half. Him at LB and Ream at CB makes, like, no sense.

same old, same old, no creativity and low level of skill.

And so it begins!!!

sorry, its just like the majority of the away games i saw last season, and i only wish it would change, but based on that tonight thats the way i see it. Hope it changes, i may get value for money at away games !

I know what you're saying. It was the first game of pre-season though tbf. Let's give them a few weeks before the pitchforks come out, eh?

Wise words, BP.

[BWFC_Insane]

I think it's interesting in a proper nerdy way. The difference between the midfield three that we played under Sam and Mourinho's Chelsea played first time around, with a Makelele or Campo holding and two box-to-boxers, and the current trend of two deeper but not sitting midfielders behind a '10'. If you have the world-class 10, the Sneijder of a few years ago, of James Rodriguez now, then the current 4-2-3-1 is probably the best way to go (depending of course on what else you have) but if you don't, I'm not convinced it's better than the old Allardyce style 3.

In both cases you have a flat two 'engaged' in the middle, and one spare. In the old way, the one spare is your sitter, and gives you a bit more insurance. In the 'new' way, the spare is your 10, who has freedom to be in the best place to lead a counter. Given that I'm not sure we have that '10' we might be better having Spearing or Medo sit. Does put more onus on your wingers to be brilliant though...so maybe not

Well in the second half our number 10 was.......Darren Pratley......I rest my case m'lud.

But to be fair under Sam, Nolan often played as a number 10. I think that you can play a halfway house between the two if needs be.

[Prufrock]

Said it many times before, Darren Pratley is a tactical pioneer. The anti-Pirlo. The defensive number 10.

Not convinced Nolan ever played as a 10 either. If the three was Campo/Hierro + Speed + Nolan/Okocha then the latter had a greater emphasis on attack, it wasn't symmetrical, but they were still a central midfielder running from deep rather than somebody playing in the whole. That 10 is a different role. Because your starting position is so much further forward, you get the ball on the half-turn of sometimes even back to goal. Nolan was usually front-facing breaking forward as the ball went into Kev's feet. Much more 'Lampard at Chelsea Mourinho #1' than 'Oscar at Chelsea Mourinho #2'. Even then, in the big games Mourinho has often dropped one of his attacking midfield '3' and gone back to the sitter.

Germany are playing like that too. Schweinsteiger (Campo/Makelele) sits in front of the back 4, Khedira goes box to box (Speed/Essien), and Kroos (Nolan/Lampard) looks to dictate but starting from a deeper position.

[BWFC_Insane]

Said it many times before, Darren Pratley is a tactical pioneer. The anti-Pirlo. The defensive number 10.

Not convinced Nolan ever played as a 10 either. If the three was Campo/Hierro + Speed + Nolan/Okocha then the latter had a greater emphasis on attack, it wasn't symmetrical, but they were still a central midfielder running from deep rather than somebody playing in the whole. That 10 is a different role. Because your starting position is so much further forward, you get the ball on the half-turn of sometimes even back to goal. Nolan was usually front-facing breaking forward as the ball went into Kev's feet. Much more 'Lampard at Chelsea Mourinho #1' than 'Oscar at Chelsea Mourinho #2'. Even then, in the big games Mourinho has often dropped one of his attacking midfield '3' and gone back to the sitter.

Germany are playing like that too. Schweinsteiger (Campo/Makelele) sits in front of the back 4, Khedira goes box to box (Speed/Essien), and Kroos (Nolan/Lampard) looks to dictate but starting from a deeper position.

We could get bogged down in terminology (awful terminology at that).....

Nolan in certain games spent most of his time getting into the opposition's box. He might not have been playing the "hole" in the same way as Hazard/Oscar does for example, but definitely he was more advanced than a classic up and downer (Speed) for example.....

[Prufrock]

Whilst agreeing with your distaste for the awful terminology (the pretty wanky '10' is the least wanky way of describing it I can think of!) they're fundamentally different roles, both in what you do with the ball and without.

Going back to your original point, Nolan was in there with Speed putting a foot in while Campo provided cover. If you play someone in that '10' role, they aren't back there helping out and so it gives Spearing a dilemma, go and press with the third midfielder (Danns, say) or leave Danns 2v1 but protect the back 4. A downside worth taking if your 10 is brilliant, not if he isn't IMO.

[Trotski]

Terrible first half. Decent second.

First half was a real summer game, no energy, no grit, we didn't have any attacking momentum. I was looking forward to seeing the youngsters. Well now I have. None of them made any impression whatsoever.

Second half much better. Fight and fury and a few decent attacks too. Cravies was good throughout. Pratley not so much and the trialist looked like a player who's never goint to make it at this level.

Spearing should havebeen red carded for a harsh shoulder tackle - yellow - followed by a blatant push. Hall's sending off was correct. Stupid dangerous challenge.

Good day out though. Cold beer and sunshine.