Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Where fellow sufferers gather to share the pain, longing and unrequited transfer requests that make being a Wanderer what it is...

Moderator: Zulus Thousand of em

Post Reply
jaffka
Legend
Legend
Posts: 8439
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2006 1:36 pm
Location: uk

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by jaffka » Tue Apr 28, 2015 1:38 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:After three undefeated trips this was reversion to the mean. The last 10 away league games: LLLLLLDWDL.

"Mean" is not an adjective one might apply to our back three. I see why Lennon wants to persevere: It's the easiest way to accommodate two strikers and a No.10, and unlike his predecessor the manager wants us to carry an attacking threat. And when played well, the 3-4-1-2 can give you more overloads in more areas of the pitch. But you need three spatially-aware defenders, at least two of whom should be good with the ball at their feet; you also need wingbacks, arguably football's most demanding skill-set (positioning, pace, passing, tackling, stamina, determination, communication). We seem to be asking that of tyros like Walker and Vela or tryers like Feeney. Credit to them for giving it a go, and to Lennon for having the belief in them, but as noted it's starting to smack of stubbornness and tactical paralysis.

This has long felt like a season petering into insignificance but we can't entirely rely on a summer slate-wipe: as noted above, seven of last night's starters are contracted beyond the summer, while the other four – Bogdan, ALF, Bannan and Heskey – would be high on most shopping lists, including Lennon's. He will find fresh faces but he also needs to revive some slumped shoulders. It's his job, and at the minute he's simply not doing it very well, with far more talking than walking. He said he wanted to spoil three promotion parties: we got one point from nine. He said he wanted to equal last season's 59-point total: we're eight short of it. Of his 13 wins, only two have come against opponents who were in the top half when we played them (Blackburn on Boxing Day, Wednesday in January). The wins against poor teams have been welcome, kept us up, and shown some promise – but let's not kid ourselves that this season has been impressive: Lennon's side has lost as many as they've won, and his 35.14% win ratio is spookily similar to Freedman's. (Usual caveat: Thank F*ck Freedman F*cked Off.)

The club could really do with a decent performance in the home closer against Birmingham. Our frequently hopelessness away was at least counterbalanced by an impressive home record, but we haven't won in the last three at the Macron – and if we don't again this weekend, that will be one victory in the last nine league games – hardly the sort of thing to start a season ticket renewal rush.
It's all about setting targets so that there is something to aim for.

Peter Thompson
Passionate
Passionate
Posts: 2076
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2006 12:54 pm

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Peter Thompson » Tue Apr 28, 2015 2:21 pm

Peter Thompson wrote:
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Peter Thompson wrote:
boltonboris wrote:
officer_dibble wrote:I feel for walker. Exposed tonight. No help from his senior colleagues at all
The way his team 'mates' isolated him, was nothing short of disgraceful. I feel for the lad, but most of our know-nowts will be right on his back
Walker has got potential and a great left foot, but IMO he's not ready for the 1st team at this level. His decision making isn't great and no matter what position he plays he needs to learn to track back and not just leave runners.

He certainly isn't the worst by any means but if we are to improve at all next season, he should come off the bench not be starting games. We have too many rank bad, bog average journeymen players who shouldn't be anywhere near the starting eleven....Walker is far better than the likes of Feeney, Danns etc
Which of our current players would you keep?
Probably only Bogdan, Clayton, Clough, Pratley, M Davies
Forgot to mention Baptiste, bring him back and play him centre half not full back....

Prufrock
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 20941
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:51 pm

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Prufrock » Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:06 pm

Should be all right as long as we're playing Kermogant every week.
In a world that has decided
That it's going to lose its mind
Be more kind, my friends, try to be more kind.

thebish
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 37588
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:01 am
Location: In my armchair

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by thebish » Tue Apr 28, 2015 6:48 pm

Neil Lennon: 'If they think we’ll go all the way down there to make up the numbers, roll over and give them three points then they’d better think again. It’s good to think we could give teams like this a bloody nose from time to time.'


(source: http://www.gazettelive.co.uk/sport/foot ... ro-9125699)
Some people are like Slinkies … not really good for anything, but you can’t help smiling when you see one tumble down the stairs.

malcd1
Passionate
Passionate
Posts: 3565
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 5:33 pm

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by malcd1 » Tue Apr 28, 2015 6:50 pm

Peter Thompson wrote:Forgot to mention Baptiste, bring him back and play him centre half not full back....
I thought Baptists was on too much money?
Do not trust atoms. They make up everything.

Devon White
Promising
Promising
Posts: 307
Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:18 pm
Location: Devon

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Devon White » Tue Apr 28, 2015 7:25 pm

thebish wrote:ahh well - there you go - can someone make it stop now? please??

utter bag of shoite we were (except for Boggers) - for all his talk of character and passion on the pitch, Lennon has us playing like a bunch of absolute pussies. we'll be doing well to avoid another relegation scrap next season...

bournemouth happy - which you can't begrudge... twas amusing to see all 30 of the real coppers gathered in front of the bolton fans 5mins before the whistle went as if (what?) we were gonna invade the pitch OR (really?) they were gonna protect us from marauding Bournemouth fans! Meanwhile - behind them, a huge pitch invasion happens and they stand watching us!

good company - you'd never believe it, but Devon White is actually a nice bloke! :wink: Also joined up with Pisshead Dan :shock: and his minder whose name I forget but surely was actually Phil Tufnell??

was Mavis injured? it seemed a wee bit bizarre to me to take Mavis off and leave Heskey on - Heskey was 7 separate shades of useless... not that Mavis made a huge contribution...

Woolery - he's the future!! who?? :D
Yes, enjoyed the company bish, most of you have covered the main points, I have to admit to bawling at feeney for that goal, utter disgrace ( petrov style ), hopefully meet up with some more of you next season, that's if dans out of AA :shock:

officer_dibble
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 10345
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 9:33 pm
Location: Leeds

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by officer_dibble » Tue Apr 28, 2015 9:19 pm

DSB is right - the 352 is there to play to ALF's strengths. I know we meed options next year but i cannot see how clayton, clough and alf fit in if we get all 3 fit and firing. Two of them are ours already. Limited budget.

Then mobing to midfield again would you play mark davies and bannon in the same team? Its too weak for me - you'd play one of them with pratley and Danns/vela or sign a big beast to win the ball in there or a proper holder at least. Then we need two wing backs. Plus at least two centre halves and a keeper!

For me we get a big target man, play clough and clayton off them (with feeney in there as an option), 2 from mavies, pratley, vela and a holding mid, and spend the budget on full backs and a decent centre half. Keeper we should sign one on (my bets lonergan or amos or both) for free.

If there's budget after that lot (maybe we cure cravies) then i'd sign alf to give us a 442 option.

Prufrock
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 20941
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:51 pm

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Prufrock » Tue Apr 28, 2015 10:54 pm

Also, watched this in a pub in central London on my tod. Ended up chatting to some guys at the bar, one of who was a United fan from Poole slagging off his mates who were at the game because they support Bournemouth instead of Poole, their local club.

I didn't really know what to do with that.
In a world that has decided
That it's going to lose its mind
Be more kind, my friends, try to be more kind.

officer_dibble
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 10345
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 9:33 pm
Location: Leeds

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by officer_dibble » Tue Apr 28, 2015 11:14 pm

Glass the fcker?

User avatar
Dave Sutton's barnet
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 20144
Joined: Sun May 14, 2006 4:00 pm
Location: Hanging on in quiet desperation
Contact:

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Wed Apr 29, 2015 1:54 pm

officer_dibble wrote:DSB is right - the 352 is there to play to ALF's strengths. I know we meed options next year but i cannot see how clayton, clough and alf fit in if we get all 3 fit and firing.
Our best (part) performances this season came with a 4-2-3-1 featuring Clayton wide, Chungy behind Cravies. Clough is Chungy's heir, but the problem is poachers like ALF need someone alongside them - a 4-2-3-1 wouldn't work with Jimmy Greaves up top. Mind, Spurs did well when they just had Clive Allen there...

Prufrock
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 20941
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:51 pm

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Prufrock » Wed Apr 29, 2015 2:09 pm

Being a short-arse doesn't make you just a poacher though. Palace under Dowie had a decent go at staying up with Andy Johnson up top on his own with two wide of him, and Johnson looked better than I ever saw him afterwards. He stretched teams in behind, and he was busy in front. I haven't seen a lot of ALF but what I have seen he's battled for stuff in the air and more importantly always been on the move looking to run in behind. From the admittedly little I've seen it would be unfair to label him just a box striker. He's not Beckford.

It would necessitate not aimlessly twatting it forward, mind, but with Clough, Clayton and Mark Davies (or a Bannan-type) as one of the two there's potential to go through midfield. Then you don't need a battering ram. You can either slip ALF in behind on the floor or if they drop off to cover it makes the space to get Clough on the half-turn just in front, where he's looked scarily good.

I'm not saying I'd want to play that way away to Derby or Boro, and we certainly need a Cravies type in the squad as well, but I don't think ALF *has* to be in a two, he just can't be the one when most of his passes are coming from Matt Mills.
In a world that has decided
That it's going to lose its mind
Be more kind, my friends, try to be more kind.

boltonboris
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 13033
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:27 pm

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by boltonboris » Wed Apr 29, 2015 2:15 pm

I think Le Fondre's best performances have come when he was up top on his own to be honest
"I've got the ball now. It's a bit worn, but I've got it"

Enoch
Icon
Icon
Posts: 4269
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 7:08 pm
Location: The Garden of England.

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Enoch » Wed Apr 29, 2015 2:50 pm

After Saturday it may be academic, but it's all about the quality of service he gets for me.

User avatar
Dave Sutton's barnet
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 20144
Joined: Sun May 14, 2006 4:00 pm
Location: Hanging on in quiet desperation
Contact:

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Wed Apr 29, 2015 4:31 pm

Prufrock wrote:Being a short-arse doesn't make you just a poacher though. Palace under Dowie had a decent go at staying up with Andy Johnson up top on his own with two wide of him, and Johnson looked better than I ever saw him afterwards. He stretched teams in behind, and he was busy in front. I haven't seen a lot of ALF but what I have seen he's battled for stuff in the air and more importantly always been on the move looking to run in behind. From the admittedly little I've seen it would be unfair to label him just a box striker. He's not Beckford.

It would necessitate not aimlessly twatting it forward, mind, but with Clough, Clayton and Mark Davies (or a Bannan-type) as one of the two there's potential to go through midfield. Then you don't need a battering ram. You can either slip ALF in behind on the floor or if they drop off to cover it makes the space to get Clough on the half-turn just in front, where he's looked scarily good.

I'm not saying I'd want to play that way away to Derby or Boro, and we certainly need a Cravies type in the squad as well, but I don't think ALF *has* to be in a two, he just can't be the one when most of his passes are coming from Matt Mills.
Fair points. On the last, it's seldom a good sign when most of your forward passes are coming from a defender. In fact, usually one could argue it's dereliction of duty by the midfield.

Prufrock
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 20941
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:51 pm

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Prufrock » Wed Apr 29, 2015 5:12 pm

Indeed. There's only Mavies and Clough from the snatches I've seen who constantly look for it. It's not that the likes of Danns hide, but they don't have the desire to always have the ball you'd expect. Central midfielders should be the ones thinking "you're just a up-and-down winger/greedy striker/clogging defender" give me the thing - I'll sort this creativity lark".
In a world that has decided
That it's going to lose its mind
Be more kind, my friends, try to be more kind.

User avatar
TANGODANCER
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 38949
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:35 pm
Location: Between the Regency and the Rubaiyat and forever trying to light penny candles from stars.

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by TANGODANCER » Wed Apr 29, 2015 5:13 pm

The midfield were pretty redundant most of the time. A very obvious point that couldn't be ignored was the high percent of balls knocked forward and finishing up easily dealt with by the opposition defence. Reason mainly being there was either nobody there, our soul target-Heskey" was mob-marked or the ball went into touch. I know we had ten men for too long, but we never really looked anything like dangerous. Mark Davies hardly came out of his kennel. It probably looked far worse because Bournemouth played so well in comparison.
Si Deus pro nobis, quis contra nos?

thebish
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 37588
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:01 am
Location: In my armchair

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by thebish » Wed Apr 29, 2015 5:26 pm

From where I was sat, Bournemouth were not dazzling - they just did the simple things right... and they played as a team - not like an odd assortment of players who seemed never to have met...
Some people are like Slinkies … not really good for anything, but you can’t help smiling when you see one tumble down the stairs.

Prufrock
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 20941
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:51 pm

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by Prufrock » Wed Apr 29, 2015 6:19 pm

The best teams are the ones that do the simple things right. They move it very quickly and they get 2v1s and 3v2s wherever they can. It's not a lot more difficult than that. The difficulty is the 2s and the 3s knowing and when and where to show up!
In a world that has decided
That it's going to lose its mind
Be more kind, my friends, try to be more kind.

User avatar
TANGODANCER
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 38949
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:35 pm
Location: Between the Regency and the Rubaiyat and forever trying to light penny candles from stars.

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by TANGODANCER » Wed Apr 29, 2015 6:32 pm

thebish wrote:From where I was sat, Bournemouth were not dazzling - they just did the simple things right... and they played as a team - not like an odd assortment of players who seemed never to have met...
I'm always impressed by teams with defences that don't panic and play kick and rush stuff that got left behind in juniour school. Bournmouth did that and brought the ball out, retaining possession (not that we pressed them very much) and still had the option of a striker or two able to win long balls. Against a good midfield, once Dervite went, we were absolutely lost. Watch one of their goals again, if Dervite had just used a bit of nous and anticipation, and stretched a leg he could have got / blocked the ball. He didn't. Mind you, he made up for it by giving away a penalty and getting himself sent off. Which ever way you cut it, we were out-muscled, out-thought and out-played. We never looked at the races.
Si Deus pro nobis, quis contra nos?

thebish
Immortal
Immortal
Posts: 37588
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:01 am
Location: In my armchair

Re: Life Is A Bowl Of Cherries

Post by thebish » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:06 pm

TANGODANCER wrote:Which ever way you cut it, we were out-muscled, out-thought and out-played. We never looked at the races.

indeed... which doesn't augur well for next season...
Some people are like Slinkies … not really good for anything, but you can’t help smiling when you see one tumble down the stairs.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Bruce Rioja, officer_dibble and 40 guests