Stats and stuff

[TANGODANCER]

career trajectories now.

As for right back I like Little but he cannot defend at all. But it is frustrating he hasn't played more. I'd say fullbacks and how he uses them is the main weakness in Parky's plan.

A bit more than that possibly? Despite the witches cauldron that's been our season, I'd reckon any plan worth calling one at least manages a few wins. We're bottom of the league and getting relegated.

[Worthy4England]

Parkinson couldn't even organise his side to bring the best out of ALF. I'd love to have seen what Doigdge could have done for us if we had a manager who was capable of playing to his strengths. Even Anelka would have been shit under Parkinson.

He turned Madine into a 6M player...

No. He didn't. He found a mug willing to pay £6m for him. That's not the same thing.

[BWFC_Insane]

Parkinson couldn't even organise his side to bring the best out of ALF. I'd love to have seen what Doigdge could have done for us if we had a manager who was capable of playing to his strengths. Even Anelka would have been shit under Parkinson.

He turned Madine into a 6M player...

No. He didn't. He found a mug willing to pay £6m for him. That's not the same thing.

He inherited a player that nobody would have paid £6 for let alone £6M. So I think to sell him for £6M is a huge achievement. However you cut it.

He turned him round and brought out a player who was in demand.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Parkinson couldn't even organise his side to bring the best out of ALF. I'd love to have seen what Doigdge could have done for us if we had a manager who was capable of playing to his strengths. Even Anelka would have been shit under Parkinson.

He turned Madine into a 6M player...

No. He didn't. He found a mug willing to pay £6m for him. That's not the same thing.

While I understand your suggestion that Madine was overpriced, there's a concomitant danger of underestimating Madine's improvement and importance. He was completely key to the Parkinsonian plan that got us promoted - remember this time two years ago, when we were all praying for his shoulder injury to heal? - and Cardiff bought a player who'd scored 10 in 28 Championship games (in a struggling, low-chance-frequency team) after having scored 8 in 67 second-tier appearances under various other managers.

With Madine under Parky in this division, we averaged 0.93 goals per game; hardly hallelujah, but since he left, we've slipped to an unmanageably low, record-breakingly bad 0.68.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Parkinson couldn't even organise his side to bring the best out of ALF. I'd love to have seen what Doigdge could have done for us if we had a manager who was capable of playing to his strengths. Even Anelka would have been shit under Parkinson.

He turned Madine into a 6M player...

No. He didn't. He found a mug willing to pay £6m for him. That's not the same thing.

While I understand your suggestion that Madine was overpriced, there's a concomitant danger of underestimating Madine's improvement and importance. He was completely key to the Parkinsonian plan that got us promoted - remember this time two years ago, when we were all praying for his shoulder injury to heal? - and Cardiff bought a player who'd scored 10 in 28 Championship games (in a struggling, low-chance-frequency team) after having scored 8 in 67 second-tier appearances under various other managers.

With Madine under Parky in this division, we averaged 0.93 goals per game; hardly hallelujah, but since he left, we've slipped to an unmanageably low, record-breakingly bad 0.68.

Every time this comes up everybody seemingly ignores the fact we were in a relegation position when Nadine got passed on to Cardiff. He wasn't the Messiah, he wasn't even very good. Just because Parkinson arranged his entire team and tactics around him doesn't justify that decision. He, Madine, was the frothy cream on a pint of shit. We should have taken the pint back and demanded a fresh one; instead the landlord told the barman to scrape the froth off and hand the pint back.

[Worthy4England]

Parkinson couldn't even organise his side to bring the best out of ALF. I'd love to have seen what Doigdge could have done for us if we had a manager who was capable of playing to his strengths. Even Anelka would have been shit under Parkinson.

He turned Madine into a 6M player...

No. He didn't. He found a mug willing to pay £6m for him. That's not the same thing.

While I understand your suggestion that Madine was overpriced, there's a concomitant danger of underestimating Madine's improvement and importance. He was completely key to the Parkinsonian plan that got us promoted - remember this time two years ago, when we were all praying for his shoulder injury to heal? - and Cardiff bought a player who'd scored 10 in 28 Championship games (in a struggling, low-chance-frequency team) after having scored 8 in 67 second-tier appearances under various other managers.

With Madine under Parky in this division, we averaged 0.93 goals per game; hardly hallelujah, but since he left, we've slipped to an unmanageably low, record-breakingly bad 0.68.

I get and agree that he got our team playing to the best of Madine's ability. His record prior and since hasn't really been stellar. So maybe he can only play well if an entire team bases it's entire footballing ethos around him and his strengths. So maybe Parkinson is at fault here too - because despite us having a squad, it was painfully obvious we didn't have a plan regarding how to use it, in the event Madine got injured. Having signed a couple of lump it up donkeys and not managed to convert them to temporary thoroughbreds, yet.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Every time this comes up everybody seemingly ignores the fact we were in a relegation position when Nadine got passed on to Cardiff. He wasn't the Messiah, he wasn't even very good. Just because Parkinson arranged his entire team and tactics around him doesn't justify that decision. He, Madine, was the frothy cream on a pint of shit. We should have taken the pint back and demanded a fresh one; instead the landlord told the barman to scrape the froth off and hand the pint back.

So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have.

Quick reminder that our top scorers this season have four, and one of them - our main striker this season - has scored one league goal since August. Madine wasn't to everyone's liking, including mine, but to suggest we haven't missed him seems madness to me.

I get and agree that he got our team playing to the best of Madine's ability. His record prior and since hasn't really been stellar. So maybe he can only play well if an entire team bases it's entire footballing ethos around him and his strengths. So maybe Parkinson is at fault here too - because despite us having a squad, it was painfully obvious we didn't have a plan regarding how to use it, in the event Madine got injured. Having signed a couple of lump it up donkeys and not managed to convert them to temporary thoroughbreds, yet.

Yep, fair point, Parkinson's Bolton suited Madine as much as Madine suited Parkinson's Bolton. Since then it's been wing and prayer.

I still wonder how we'd have done had we been able to sign a decent striker last summer - many of the ones we were linked with have done well - but it doesn't change the fact that Parky is an essentially overcautious manager with a station above his ideas.

[malcd1]

Parkinson couldn't even organise his side to bring the best out of ALF. I'd love to have seen what Doigdge could have done for us if we had a manager who was capable of playing to his strengths. Even Anelka would have been shit under Parkinson.

He turned Madine into a 6M player...

No. He didn't. He found a mug willing to pay £6m for him. That's not the same thing.

While I understand your suggestion that Madine was overpriced, there's a concomitant danger of underestimating Madine's improvement and importance. He was completely key to the Parkinsonian plan that got us promoted - remember this time two years ago, when we were all praying for his shoulder injury to heal? - and Cardiff bought a player who'd scored 10 in 28 Championship games (in a struggling, low-chance-frequency team) after having scored 8 in 67 second-tier appearances under various other managers.

With Madine under Parky in this division, we averaged 0.93 goals per game; hardly hallelujah, but since he left, we've slipped to an unmanageably low, record-breakingly bad 0.68.

Every time this comes up everybody seemingly ignores the fact we were in a relegation position when Nadine got passed on to Cardiff. He wasn't the Messiah, he wasn't even very good. Just because Parkinson arranged his entire team and tactics around him doesn't justify that decision. He, Madine, was the frothy cream on a pint of shit. We should have taken the pint back and demanded a fresh one; instead the landlord told the barman to scrape the froth off and hand the pint back.

I'm not sure the highlighted bit is strictly true. I think he was just the right player for the only way PP knows how to play. Punt it up to the big lad. What I mean is he didn't change his style to suit Madine, it is the only style he has. Look when Madine was sold, we continued to punt it up to the forward. The only problem was that we now had ALF up front on his own. PP is a one trick pony.

[BWFC_Insane]

Magennis is a big lad. To suggest that's all there was to it is nonsense.

Madine will have been involved in 3 promotions in 3 seasons - 2 into the premiership.

He was a very good striker for us once Parky got him going - whether he was a 6M player or not he was leagues and leagues ahead of Magennis and co....

[Worthy4England]

Madine will have been involved in 3 promotions in 3 seasons - 2 into the premiership.

Lemmie get this right - you're crediting Sheffield's (potential) promotion to Gary Madine? And Cardiff's? Well fcuk my old boots.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Every time this comes up everybody seemingly ignores the fact we were in a relegation position when Nadine got passed on to Cardiff. He wasn't the Messiah, he wasn't even very good. Just because Parkinson arranged his entire team and tactics around him doesn't justify that decision. He, Madine, was the frothy cream on a pint of shit. We should have taken the pint back and demanded a fresh one; instead the landlord told the barman to scrape the froth off and hand the pint back.

So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have.

Quick reminder that our top scorers this season have four, and one of them - our main striker this season - has scored one league goal since August. Madine wasn't to everyone's liking, including mine, but to suggest we haven't missed him seems madness to me.

I get and agree that he got our team playing to the best of Madine's ability. His record prior and since hasn't really been stellar. So maybe he can only play well if an entire team bases it's entire footballing ethos around him and his strengths. So maybe Parkinson is at fault here too - because despite us having a squad, it was painfully obvious we didn't have a plan regarding how to use it, in the event Madine got injured. Having signed a couple of lump it up donkeys and not managed to convert them to temporary thoroughbreds, yet.

Yep, fair point, Parkinson's Bolton suited Madine as much as Madine suited Parkinson's Bolton. Since then it's been wing and prayer.

I still wonder how we'd have done had we been able to sign a decent striker last summer - many of the ones we were linked with have done well - but it doesn't change the fact that Parky is an essentially overcautious manager with a station above his ideas.

Strangely enough, at least to my mind, both Worthy and I were making the same point. Funny that, given your response.

[BWFC_Insane]

Madine will have been involved in 3 promotions in 3 seasons - 2 into the premiership.

Lemmie get this right - you're crediting Sheffield's (potential) promotion to Gary Madine? And Cardiff's? Well fcuk my old boots.

Of course not. But he's gone to clubs doing well.

He was our best player and we replaced him with Josh Magennis...it might have worked I guess, and early signs were it had...but in reality odds were heavily stacked against it.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Madine will have been involved in 3 promotions in 3 seasons - 2 into the premiership.

Lemmie get this right - you're crediting Sheffield's (potential) promotion to Gary Madine? And Cardiff's? Well fcuk my old boots.

He's been "involved" in them, if only slightly more than the bloke with a season ticket behind the manager's dugout...

[Worthy4England]

Every time this comes up everybody seemingly ignores the fact we were in a relegation position when Nadine got passed on to Cardiff. He wasn't the Messiah, he wasn't even very good. Just because Parkinson arranged his entire team and tactics around him doesn't justify that decision. He, Madine, was the frothy cream on a pint of shit. We should have taken the pint back and demanded a fresh one; instead the landlord told the barman to scrape the froth off and hand the pint back.

So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have.

Quick reminder that our top scorers this season have four, and one of them - our main striker this season - has scored one league goal since August. Madine wasn't to everyone's liking, including mine, but to suggest we haven't missed him seems madness to me.

I get and agree that he got our team playing to the best of Madine's ability. His record prior and since hasn't really been stellar. So maybe he can only play well if an entire team bases it's entire footballing ethos around him and his strengths. So maybe Parkinson is at fault here too - because despite us having a squad, it was painfully obvious we didn't have a plan regarding how to use it, in the event Madine got injured. Having signed a couple of lump it up donkeys and not managed to convert them to temporary thoroughbreds, yet.

Yep, fair point, Parkinson's Bolton suited Madine as much as Madine suited Parkinson's Bolton. Since then it's been wing and prayer.

I still wonder how we'd have done had we been able to sign a decent striker last summer - many of the ones we were linked with have done well - but it doesn't change the fact that Parky is an essentially overcautious manager with a station above his ideas.

Strangely enough, at least to my mind, both Worthy and I were making the same point. Funny that, given your response.

That mighta confused them!

[Lost Leopard Spot]

"So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have."

An especially terrible habit when that half a season was the first half and we were in a relegation position at the end of it. Even more terrible when after getting rid of the ten goal wonder we managed to stay up.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

"So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have."

An especially terrible habit when that half a season was the first half and we were in a relegation position at the end of it. Even more terrible when after getting rid of the ten goal wonder we managed to stay up.

Do you think we became a better team without Madine?

[Lost Leopard Spot]

"So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have."

An especially terrible habit when that half a season was the first half and we were in a relegation position at the end of it. Even more terrible when after getting rid of the ten goal wonder we managed to stay up.

Do you think we became a better team without Madine?

The stats would say so...

[Lost Leopard Spot]

"So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have."

An especially terrible habit when that half a season was the first half and we were in a relegation position at the end of it. Even more terrible when after getting rid of the ten goal wonder we managed to stay up.

Do you think we became a better team without Madine?

The stats would say so...

Although to be honest, 'better' is a misleading adjective. More successful without Madine. Possibly because Parkinson was forced to be less 'Parkinsonian' as a result of his absence. Didn't make us better as such, just less shit.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

"So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have."

An especially terrible habit when that half a season was the first half and we were in a relegation position at the end of it. Even more terrible when after getting rid of the ten goal wonder we managed to stay up.

Do you think we became a better team without Madine?

The stats would say so...

The stats are that we got 0.929 points per game before Madine left, 0.645 ppg since. Pertinently, 0.929 goals per game* when he left, 0.645 goals per game since.

* The two averages with Madine are the same because we had the same number of goals and points when he left: 26, compared to 29 goals and 32 points so far this season.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

"So we were a shit team. In which he scored 10 goals in half a season. Terrible habit to have."

An especially terrible habit when that half a season was the first half and we were in a relegation position at the end of it. Even more terrible when after getting rid of the ten goal wonder we managed to stay up.

Do you think we became a better team without Madine?

The stats would say so...

The stats are that we got 0.929 points per game before Madine left, 0.645 ppg since. Pertinently, 0.929 goals per game* when he left, 0.645 goals per game since.

* The two averages with Madine are the same because we had the same number of goals and points when he left: 26, compared to 29 goals and 32 points so far this season.

Sorry, don't mean to be obtuse. I'm talking about last season when we sold him. During that season, before we sold him, we were in a relegation spot. After we sold him we ended up in a non relegation spot. Those are the stats I'm stating.