First Team vs Squad

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GhostoftheBok
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First Team vs Squad

Post by GhostoftheBok » Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:44 pm

I'm wondering what people think of the lads we have under contract for next season in terms of first 11 vs squad players.

Obviously we're pretty short on numbers right now, but how many first team positions do people think we have nailed down for next season and how many do we need to make signings for?

Did Little do enough at the end of the season to make you confident in him playing next season as first choice right back, for example? Is Vela certain to retain his place in the middle? Are both the main signings we've made going to be first 11 players?

Interested to know where people think we are in terms of first 11 strength.

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Re: First Team vs Squad

Post by truewhite15 » Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:20 pm

Well, considering we've really only got enough players for a first 11...

There are positions we still need to strengthen. Looking at the squad as it is, we're playing 4-5-1.

Alnwick - he'll do, unless a belter becomes available.

Little - he'll do too.
Wheater - he'll do. But (as much as I love the man) we should perhaps have better as first choice.
Beevers - see above, but more so.
Taylor - definitely need better.

Vela - at the moment, he'll be playing defensive midfield. Not his best position. Need a first-choice destroyer
Lowe - decent free signing. Walks straight into the side, but he's an unknown quantity
Oztumer - as above.

Noone - showed skill in patches last season, and has a good track record at this level. But probably need better.
Buckley - as above, but worse.

ALF - Does a job up front on his own, but ideally needs a partner. If he's not in the first 11, he needs to be replaced by someone who can both hold it and score. If he gets the partner, then it's not going to be 4-5-1.

Current "squad" has Turner, Amos, Darby, Earing and Hall. All of which, unless the young'uns have an astounding breakthrough, you can file under "need better". Team and squad, therefore, are long way off.

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Re: First Team vs Squad

Post by Peter Thompson » Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:42 pm

We need numbers in & quickly....I think as a minimum at least 8 first team players + squad fillers (Hall etc)

We are very, very short on quality IMO if we are to improve, personally I think that we need at least 3 more quality defenders (with pace), we need at least another 2 central midfielders including at least one big 6ft plus energetic, imposing box to box destroyer type (under 30 years old) as I'm not sure that Vela is good enough as 1st choice, plus another winger (as good as CYL) - plus 2 new decent strikers.

And another goalkeeper, hopefully as 1st choice (i.e. better than Alnwick)

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Re: First Team vs Squad

Post by TANGODANCER » Mon Jun 18, 2018 5:34 pm

Peter Thompson wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:42 pm
We need numbers in & quickly....I think as a minimum at least 8 first team players + squad fillers (Hall etc)

We are very, very short on quality IMO if we are to improve, personally I think that we need at least 3 more quality defenders (with pace), we need at least another 2 central midfielders including at least one big 6ft plus energetic, imposing box to box destroyer type (under 30 years old) as I'm not sure that Vela is good enough as 1st choice, plus another winger (as good as CYL) - plus 2 new decent strikers. And another goalkeeper, hopefully as 1st choice (i.e. better than Alnwick)
Meanwhile, back in reality land....
Si Deus pro nobis, quis contra nos?

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Re: First Team vs Squad

Post by GhostoftheBok » Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:00 pm

It's a tricky one, for me. I agree there's a lack of quality in the few players we have left, but the thing that concerns me more is that the players we have at the moment don't look like a capable team as a collective. We're slow at the back, which means we have to sit deeper or get picked off. In order to deal with that you need pace in attack for the counter, but we have none. Leicester won the title with a slow centreback pairing, but they had rockets up front who could tear people to bits when the turn-over came.

When I look at the possible/probably starters for next season in the current squad, I don't see an obvious way of picking up wins. We've a number of players who are decent at this level, but the team is currently less than the sum of its parts, for me. That's why I'm interested in who people think has really nailed down a place in the starting 11. It informs what we need and where to form a competitive team.

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Re: First Team vs Squad

Post by Peter Thompson » Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:07 pm

GhostoftheBok wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:00 pm
It's a tricky one, for me. I agree there's a lack of quality in the few players we have left, but the thing that concerns me more is that the players we have at the moment don't look like a capable team as a collective. We're slow at the back, which means we have to sit deeper or get picked off. In order to deal with that you need pace in attack for the counter, but we have none. Leicester won the title with a slow centreback pairing, but they had rockets up front who could tear people to bits when the turn-over came.

When I look at the possible/probably starters for next season in the current squad, I don't see an obvious way of picking up wins. We've a number of players who are decent at this level, but the team is currently less than the sum of its parts, for me. That's why I'm interested in who people think has really nailed down a place in the starting 11. It informs what we need and where to form a competitive team.
On that point, for me then its just Lowe & Oztumer - with possibly Alnwick & Little....

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Re: First Team vs Squad

Post by truewhite15 » Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:36 pm

Peter Thompson wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:07 pm
GhostoftheBok wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 6:00 pm
It's a tricky one, for me. I agree there's a lack of quality in the few players we have left, but the thing that concerns me more is that the players we have at the moment don't look like a capable team as a collective. We're slow at the back, which means we have to sit deeper or get picked off. In order to deal with that you need pace in attack for the counter, but we have none. Leicester won the title with a slow centreback pairing, but they had rockets up front who could tear people to bits when the turn-over came.

When I look at the possible/probably starters for next season in the current squad, I don't see an obvious way of picking up wins. We've a number of players who are decent at this level, but the team is currently less than the sum of its parts, for me. That's why I'm interested in who people think has really nailed down a place in the starting 11. It informs what we need and where to form a competitive team.
On that point, for me then its just Lowe & Oztumer - with possibly Alnwick & Little....
Given we're not even at pre-season, I don't think any of them have got a starting place set in stone. Let's face it, the squad we had last season was barely good enough to survive. You could argue we've kept the best of that bunch, but there are still massive improvements needed to drag us up the table.

There are a mere handful that I'd be happy having a starting place next season, but all on the proviso that there is talented and credible back up options available - Alnwick, Little, Wheater, Vela, ALF. I don't know enough and I've not seen enough about the newbies to say whether they should be starting or not.

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Re: First Team vs Squad

Post by mullayo » Tue Jun 19, 2018 1:11 am

I agree with Ghost's assessment of us being less than the sum of our parts - not integrated with a disconnect between the backs and forwards.
We are an island of misfit toys but we have to take what we can get.
We got rid of the worst which left us with marginal at best Champ level talent.
For me it's not about first team and squad but the sheer level of ability to play at this level.
KEY
7: key player to build team around
6: Champ level starter
5.5: Unknown proven at lower level/overseas
5: Just under Champ level
4.5: Backup cover for injury
4: Young unfinished maybe
3: Mistake never be

GK: Ben Alnwick 6, Ben Amos 5, Jake Turner 4
RB: Mark Little 6, Stephen Darby 5
LB: Andrew Taylor 5,
CB: David Wheater 6, Mark Beevers 6
DM: Jason Lowe 6,
AM: Oztumer 5.5, Josh Vela 5, Joe Pritchard 3
RW: AMEOBI 6, Craig Noone 5
LW: Will Buckley 5,
ST: Adam Le Fondre 5.5, Conor Hall 4
TS:
What could've happened; did.

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