Administration and recovery

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Adding credence (if you believe it) to the FV don't have the cash story...

For Rioja who's IT is sadly lacking - says FV have approached PFA about a loan...

If this is true, big if ? then why on earth did the admins select them as preferred bidders - it beggars belief. FV are coming across as a bit of a joke, if this carries on for a day or two longer they will be despised as much as Anderson was before the season even starts.

They are coming across as complete novices, and a PR disaster already.

I've addressed this point at least four times previously.
They were preferred bidders because on paper the plan seemed sound and they were the highest bidders.
But when further scrutiny was applied a hole in the funding appeared due to one of the guarantors' of one line of credit turned out to be a company partially owned by one of the creditors - Peter guaranteeing Paul to guarantee Simon will pay Peter.
Basran walked. Funds and guarantees were redistributed to cover the master plan. But hole still exists.

[Bertie Wooster]

Adding credence (if you believe it) to the FV don't have the cash story...

For Rioja who's IT is sadly lacking - says FV have approached PFA about a loan...

If this is true, big if ? then why on earth did the admins select them as preferred bidders - it beggars belief. FV are coming across as a bit of a joke, if this carries on for a day or two longer they will be despised as much as Anderson was before the season even starts.

They are coming across as complete novices, and a PR disaster already.

I've addressed this point at least four times previously.
They were preferred bidders because on paper the plan seemed sound and they were the highest bidders.
But when further scrutiny was applied a hole in the funding appeared due to one of the guarantors' of one line of credit turned out to be a company partially owned by one of the creditors - Peter guaranteeing Paul to guarantee Simon will pay Peter.
Basran walked. Funds and guarantees were redistributed to cover the master plan. But hole still exists.

So in summary as it stands today they haven't got the funds to legally complete ?

[nelson66]

If you had bid for a property at auction - 10% down within an hour of the hammer coming down - and the balance within 28 days
FV need to pull their fingers out before Bassini or Liquidators pile in

[Worthy4England]

Adding credence (if you believe it) to the FV don't have the cash story...

For Rioja who's IT is sadly lacking - says FV have approached PFA about a loan...

If this is true, big if ? then why on earth did the admins select them as preferred bidders - it beggars belief. FV are coming across as a bit of a joke, if this carries on for a day or two longer they will be despised as much as Anderson was before the season even starts.

They are coming across as complete novices, and a PR disaster already.

I've addressed this point at least four times previously.
They were preferred bidders because on paper the plan seemed sound and they were the highest bidders.
But when further scrutiny was applied a hole in the funding appeared due to one of the guarantors' of one line of credit turned out to be a company partially owned by one of the creditors - Peter guaranteeing Paul to guarantee Simon will pay Peter.
Basran walked. Funds and guarantees were redistributed to cover the master plan. But hole still exists.

Yup - I got that bit - you've addressed it at least four times previously...I understand what a circularity is.

[BWFC_Insane]

If you had bid for a property at auction - 10% down within an hour of the hammer coming down - and the balance within 28 days
FV need to pull their fingers out before Bassini or Liquidators pile in

If you bid for a property you offer a price and pay it.

Buying a football club from admin requires - separate deals with each secured creditor, an offer to unsecured creditors of at least 25p in the £, a business plan showing the ability to run the club for 2 years that gains EFL approval, proof of funds (in an account - not just pieces of paper or "credit" as some make out) and passing the various EFL tests...

Its a little more involved and a lot more complicated.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

If you had bid for a property at auction - 10% down within an hour of the hammer coming down - and the balance within 28 days
FV need to pull their fingers out before Bassini or Liquidators pile in

If you bid for a property you offer a price and pay it.

Buying a football club from admin requires - separate deals with each secured creditor, an offer to unsecured creditors of at least 25p in the £, a business plan showing the ability to run the club for 2 years that gains EFL approval, proof of funds (in an account - not just pieces of paper or "credit" as some make out) and passing the various EFL tests...

Its a little more involved and a lot more complicated.

Proof of funds is not dosh in an account, as you make out. It's a lot more complicated than that. And yes, credit notes ARE part of it.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Is it still the case that the transfer window for us will be end of August (rather than start of the season) albeit only for loans (inc loans to be made permanent)? And that we can sign free agents any time up to the eventual cut off in about March. So there's a more than decent chance that we'll be piling everything into getting the takeover done by day 1, starting the season with the pros we have plus kids then trying to fill the squad out with frees and loans.

Are there limits to no of loanees in a League 1 match day squad?

As I understand it:

Prem and Champo transfer registration window closes at 5pm on Thursday, August 8. They can still sell players abroad (Spain, France and Germany close on August 31, Italy on August 18.)

Window closes for League One and League Two clubs - for loans and permanent deals - at 5pm on Monday, September 2. That's a significant chunk of time later.

As for limits:

54.4.1 A maximum of 5 Players registered on a Temporary Loan Transfer can be named in the Players listed on a team sheet for any individual match played under the auspices of The League. This maximum shall reduce to 4 Players where a Club names a Player on the team sheet who is registered on an Emergency Goalkeeper Loan;

54.4.2 No Club may sign more than 4 Players on a Temporary Loan Transfer from another Club (or club) in any Season, of which no more than 2 Players may be over the age of 23. The deadline for determining a Player’s age in this respect shall be as at the 30 June prior to the Season in which the Temporary Loan Transfer is intended to take place. Any Temporary Loan Transfer which subsequently becomes a permanent transfer shall not count against a Club’s quota of such Temporary Loan Transfers for that Season; and

54.4.3 Temporary Loan Transfers may include an option to acquire the Player’s registration by way of permanent transfer. Any such option can be exercised at any time (including during a Closed Period).

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Adding credence (if you believe it) to the FV don't have the cash story...

For Rioja who's IT is sadly lacking - says FV have approached PFA about a loan...

If this is true, big if ? then why on earth did the admins select them as preferred bidders - it beggars belief. FV are coming across as a bit of a joke, if this carries on for a day or two longer they will be despised as much as Anderson was before the season even starts.

They are coming across as complete novices, and a PR disaster already.

I've addressed this point at least four times previously.
They were preferred bidders because on paper the plan seemed sound and they were the highest bidders.
But when further scrutiny was applied a hole in the funding appeared due to one of the guarantors' of one line of credit turned out to be a company partially owned by one of the creditors - Peter guaranteeing Paul to guarantee Simon will pay Peter.
Basran walked. Funds and guarantees were redistributed to cover the master plan. But hole still exists.

So in summary as it stands today they haven't got the funds to legally complete ?

Legally completing is signing a piece of paper somebody else has already signed. It depends what penalties, if any, were in the Heads of Terms, but I'm fairly certain it's the Administrators withholding a signature at this stage....

[BWFC_Insane]

There is a difference between proving funds to buy the business from administrators - which requires cash in a bank account - hence why Bassini's "letters of intent" or credit notes were rejected and proof of funds to the EFL to run the club for two years. The requirements are different.

It is possible that FV have a hole in their business plan - as a result of the hotel or MJs security against it...but not possible that they have a hole in the cash required to purchase from administrators (unless administrators are colluding and lying).

The administrators are definitely NOT the hold up - they say the deal is not in their hands anymore but that from their point of view is absolutely ready to go.

[Prufrock]

Is it still the case that the transfer window for us will be end of August (rather than start of the season) albeit only for loans (inc loans to be made permanent)? And that we can sign free agents any time up to the eventual cut off in about March. So there's a more than decent chance that we'll be piling everything into getting the takeover done by day 1, starting the season with the pros we have plus kids then trying to fill the squad out with frees and loans.

Are there limits to no of loanees in a League 1 match day squad?

As I understand it:

Prem and Champo transfer registration window closes at 5pm on Thursday, August 8. They can still sell players abroad (Spain, France and Germany close on August 31, Italy on August 18.)

Window closes for League One and League Two clubs - for loans and permanent deals - at 5pm on Monday, September 2. That's a significant chunk of time later.

As for limits:

54.4.1 A maximum of 5 Players registered on a Temporary Loan Transfer can be named in the Players listed on a team sheet for any individual match played under the auspices of The League. This maximum shall reduce to 4 Players where a Club names a Player on the team sheet who is registered on an Emergency Goalkeeper Loan;

54.4.2 No Club may sign more than 4 Players on a Temporary Loan Transfer from another Club (or club) in any Season, of which no more than 2 Players may be over the age of 23. The deadline for determining a Player’s age in this respect shall be as at the 30 June prior to the Season in which the Temporary Loan Transfer is intended to take place. Any Temporary Loan Transfer which subsequently becomes a permanent transfer shall not count against a Club’s quota of such Temporary Loan Transfers for that Season; and

54.4.3 Temporary Loan Transfers may include an option to acquire the Player’s registration by way of permanent transfer. Any such option can be exercised at any time (including during a Closed Period).

Obliged.

[Lost Leopard Spot]

There is a difference between proving funds to buy the business from administrators - which requires cash in a bank account - hence why Bassini's "letters of intent" or credit notes were rejected and proof of funds to the EFL to run the club for two years. The requirements are different.

It is possible that FV have a hole in their business plan - as a result of the hotel or MJs security against it...but not possible that they have a hole in the cash required to purchase from administrators (unless administrators are colluding and lying).

The administrators are definitely NOT the hold up - they say the deal is not in their hands anymore but that from their point of view is absolutely ready to go.

Do they? Where do they say that?

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Ha! Silence.

[Bertie Wooster]

So is their a financial hole in their business plan ?, did FV lie to the administrators ?, have they provided concrete proof of required funds ?

The Leopard & Insane appear to have differing opinions, which I agree is not unique

[Lost Leopard Spot]

So is their a financial hole in their business plan ?, did FV lie to the administrators ?, have they provided concrete proof of required funds ?

The Leopard & Insane appear to have differing opinions, which I agree is not unique

I can't speak for the Insane one. I can only answer from my perspective, so in descending order:
Yes.
Not exactly.
Yes which turned out to be No later. The No was amended to a qualified Yes if the hole can be filled. So technically it's still a No.

[Worthy4England]

So is their a financial hole in their business plan ?, did FV lie to the administrators ?, have they provided concrete proof of required funds ?

The Leopard & Insane appear to have differing opinions, which I agree is not unique

It's probably a whole lot not as simple as "did FV lie to the administrators". They might legitimately at the time they submitted their bid have had enough on the table to meet what Admin's said was the requirement. But that's at a moment in time. One of their backers might have dropped out (which is what happened to Holdsworth when Anderson stepped in), one of the secured creditors might have legitimately argued that they were owed more than the Admin's found, they might have had the circularity that LSL refers to (so effectively counting the same money more than once)…

Whole host of things might have occurred - or actually for all we know - none of the above might have occurred but they have a better cashflow position by spinning it out until the last minute...

[bristol_Wanderer3]

Have to say, based on this scale:

1. Stop moaning you bunch of panic fannies.
2. Don't panic
3. DON'T PANIC
4. DON'T MOTHERFECKING PANIC
5. It's over, we're doomed

I am about 2.6.

Up to 4.3.

Starting to wonder if there are complications after our Kenectomy and a follow up operation might be needed, which I am not sure we are strong enough to survive...

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Have to say, based on this scale:

1. Stop moaning you bunch of panic fannies.
2. Don't panic
3. DON'T PANIC
4. DON'T MOTHERFECKING PANIC
5. It's over, we're doomed

I am about 2.6.

Up to 4.3.

Starting to wonder if there are complications after our Kenectomy and a follow up operation might be needed, which I am not sure we are strong enough to survive...

The kenectomy was a minor part of the financeotomy that the patient (BWFC) undertook. Unfortunately the successful allogenic transplantation of the FV organ into the body required more stitches than had been planned for. The patient is now undergoing total parenteral nutrition and mechanical ventilation (provided by Administration), with a pacemaker (supplied by Iles Surgical Co.) and a little bit of dialysis (mainly home supplied by @reluctantnicko).
The patient is in intensive care and the outlook is uncertain but Dr Insane believes he knows the best cure and is adamant that if the patient dies he'll be able to pinpoint the cause, and if the patient lives it's because his advice was followed.

I'm at 2.5
By this Friday if a hospital update hasn't been provided by the surgeon (Mr Appleton) then I'll be at or close to 4.5

[LeverEnd]

An optimistic 4.8

[Lost Leopard Spot]

An optimistic 4.8

[Lost Leopard Spot]

Ha! Silence.

If Olympic Gold Medals were given out to posters who don't follow up, our very own Insano would have more medals than Mark Spitz...