Loanees available

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Re: Loanees available

Post by Harry Genshaw » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:16 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:17 am
Harry Genshaw wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 10:07 pm
Cheeky loan bid for Will Grigg in the next window? His penalty miss tonight felt like the final nail in his Sunderland coffin
He's shite. And we have 3 strikers who all look capable in different ways.

All efforts have to be midfield and back four where we completely lack in numbers and in terms of fit players, quality and experience.
How long have we got the 3 strikers for?

Agree that right now midfield is a priority. This 23 we can register. Is it 1 in 1 out? If Weir leaves and we terminate any loans or short term deals because of injury can we get someone else in or do we just have 1 place left available?
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Re: Loanees available

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:23 am

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:16 am
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 9:17 am
Harry Genshaw wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 10:07 pm
Cheeky loan bid for Will Grigg in the next window? His penalty miss tonight felt like the final nail in his Sunderland coffin
He's shite. And we have 3 strikers who all look capable in different ways.

All efforts have to be midfield and back four where we completely lack in numbers and in terms of fit players, quality and experience.
How long have we got the 3 strikers for?

Agree that right now midfield is a priority. This 23 we can register. Is it 1 in 1 out? If Weir leaves and we terminate any loans or short term deals because of injury can we get someone else in or do we just have 1 place left available?
I believe the strikers are on deals till end of season. DSB can correct me if I'm wrong.

The 23 rule means we can have 23 "first team" players registered at any one time. We have 22 - some of the kids who played enough games or were over 21 are by the rules included in that number.

So we could theoretically add another free agent in. Come January loans are all up - we can of course try to extend them but equally if some return to their clubs it would free us up to sign some new players up to the 23 limit. We cannot change the registration position till January - so for example should we "release" a player he'd still count in our quota till the transfer window opens.

We have one space left to sign a free (at least we think so based on Hill's comments which have sometimes been contradictory re numbers).

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Re: Loanees available

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:26 am

I’d of been on the blower to Gary o neill last night!

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Re: Loanees available

Post by Harry Genshaw » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:34 am

Cheers Insane.

Dibs - it still surprises me that we never went back in for O'Neill, or for that matter that no one else did. He still looks in great nick too but I imagine he wouldn't be game ready for at least a month
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Re: Loanees available

Post by Bertie Wooster » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:37 am

Another way of looking at this based on Hill's post match interview last night, is that perhaps he's asked FV if he can sign more players or another player (if we are limited to 23 ?) & more staff (he mentioned not having enough staff last night), and perhaps they (FV) have said no - who knows apart from BWFCI.

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Re: Loanees available

Post by nicholaldo » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:42 am

Maybe this isn't quite the right theead for it but I wonder if there's any possibility of the registration embargo not being quite so inhibitive by the upcoming transfer window?

We don't know how long it's meant to be in place for, and I expect there's no definite end date because much of these restrictions appear to be solely at the discretion of the EFL. However, it's been reported that we plan to pay all outstanding football creditors (how I've not missed having to type those words out recently) in next month's payroll. Suppose that happens then we will, presumably, begin the new year with no overdue footballing debts. No doubt, part of the reason we're under a registration embargo is as punishment for entering administration so hope of a complete lifting of the restrictions is fanciful, but I'd hope there's at least scope for a relieving of them.

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Re: Loanees available

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:43 am

Bertie Wooster wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:37 am
Another way of looking at this based on Hill's post match interview last night, is that perhaps he's asked FV if he can sign more players or another player (if we are limited to 23 ?) & more staff (he mentioned not having enough staff last night), and perhaps they (FV) have said no - who knows apart from BWFCI.
Staff are the ones leaving to join Parky at Sunderland.

We are under a wages and squad size embargo. Hill has previously said there aren't the players out there ready to come in and do a job - when there were in DoDoo he signed him. But the free transfer pool now is not exactly going to be brimming with ready made options. Crawford a huge blow as I think he was integral to what we did. But bottom line - we're going to get another points deduction. We're not surviving - get the bad luck out of the way before we win league two next season.

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Re: Loanees available

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:44 am

Contract expiry thread is here. viewtopic.php?f=4&t=23114&p=1085335#p1084073

Basically: it's January for the four loanees (Jake Wright, Josh Earl, Bridcutt and T-Bone), because the EFL only allows us to borrow window-to-window, plus Buckley, presumably because we played safe. Everyone else expires next June except Brockbank (2021) and Liam Edwards (2023).

Further to Nicko's last post, I'm not sure on squad limits but I was wondering last night how many are taken up by the kids who made early-season appearances. In the league, Regan Riley made one sub appearance, Finlay Hurford-Lockett two subs, De'Marlio Brown-Sterling one start plus two subs, Jordan Boon 1+2, Joe White 3+1, Callum King-Harmes 3+2, Eddie Brown 4+1. Apart from maybe King's Arms, none of these are likely to trouble the first team again soon. I dunno whether they count against the quota but if so we should be either appealing special measures - or, possibly, could we loan them out in January to get them off the quota? If the latter, we should again plead that it wouldn't necessarily be best for their development to send them to Workington or something.

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Re: Loanees available

Post by Bertie Wooster » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:45 am

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:34 am
Cheers Insane.

Dibs - it still surprises me that we never went back in for O'Neill, or for that matter that no one else did. He still looks in great nick too but I imagine he wouldn't be game ready for at least a month
Its not like years ago though when players were on the piss & unfit in the off season and needed to run up and down hills with bags of bricks in rucksacks to get fit in pre season - a lot of these current out of contract players will already be fit (maybe not completely match fit) but they will be fit enough to maybe play 45-60 mins - look at O'Grady, Dodoo, Chicksen who all came in 'so called' not fit but played straight away.

I appreciate that its not ideal (the fitness of out of contract players) but at the moment I would say 'needs must' unless we are to go backwards waiting for all of these injured players to return, and some of these out of contract players have probably been on trial or training with other teams, so they wont be totally unfit - unfortunately beggars cant be choosers or something like that !

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Re: Loanees available

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:46 am

nicholaldo wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:42 am
Maybe this isn't quite the right theead for it but I wonder if there's any possibility of the registration embargo not being quite so inhibitive by the upcoming transfer window?

We don't know how long it's meant to be in place for, and I expect there's no definite end date because much of these restrictions appear to be solely at the discretion of the EFL. However, it's been reported that we plan to pay all outstanding football creditors (how I've not missed having to type those words out recently) in next month's payroll. Suppose that happens then we will, presumably, begin the new year with no overdue footballing debts. No doubt, part of the reason we're under a registration embargo is as punishment for entering administration so hope of a complete lifting of the restrictions is fanciful, but I'd hope there's at least scope for a relieving of them.
Its two years. I can't see them lifting restrictions because the punishment is for the administration.

But we'll see.

I'm not sure it makes much difference. Our issue is now - January the loans free up spaces so we can rejig. Now though we are short and I think the window for adding frees ends soonish anyway.

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Re: Loanees available

Post by nicholaldo » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:57 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:46 am
nicholaldo wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:42 am
Maybe this isn't quite the right theead for it but I wonder if there's any possibility of the registration embargo not being quite so inhibitive by the upcoming transfer window?

We don't know how long it's meant to be in place for, and I expect there's no definite end date because much of these restrictions appear to be solely at the discretion of the EFL. However, it's been reported that we plan to pay all outstanding football creditors (how I've not missed having to type those words out recently) in next month's payroll. Suppose that happens then we will, presumably, begin the new year with no overdue footballing debts. No doubt, part of the reason we're under a registration embargo is as punishment for entering administration so hope of a complete lifting of the restrictions is fanciful, but I'd hope there's at least scope for a relieving of them.
Its two years.

Your not the first person who's stated this as fact to me but I can't find any reference to it in the EFL's Regulations. Neither can I find any mention of it in the EFL's public communications concerning administration. It's plausible that the restrictions will end up being in place for two years, but it doesn't seem to be an automatic penalty as often implied. In fact, the only person involved in football I can tell who's publicly stated it is is our erstwhile chairman.

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Re: Loanees available

Post by Prufrock » Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:28 am

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:44 am
Contract expiry thread is here. viewtopic.php?f=4&t=23114&p=1085335#p1084073

Basically: it's January for the four loanees (Jake Wright, Josh Earl, Bridcutt and T-Bone), because the EFL only allows us to borrow window-to-window, plus Buckley, presumably because we played safe. Everyone else expires next June except Brockbank (2021) and Liam Edwards (2023).

Further to Nicko's last post, I'm not sure on squad limits but I was wondering last night how many are taken up by the kids who made early-season appearances. In the league, Regan Riley made one sub appearance, Finlay Hurford-Lockett two subs, De'Marlio Brown-Sterling one start plus two subs, Jordan Boon 1+2, Joe White 3+1, Callum King-Harmes 3+2, Eddie Brown 4+1. Apart from maybe King's Arms, none of these are likely to trouble the first team again soon. I dunno whether they count against the quota but if so we should be either appealing special measures - or, possibly, could we loan them out in January to get them off the quota? If the latter, we should again plead that it wouldn't necessarily be best for their development to send them to Workington or something.
It was an age thing, I think. Those over 21 (though not sure when they needed to be over 21). So your Zoumas and Edwardses would count, and your Browns and King-Harmeses (Kings-Harmes?) would not.

Not sure where Connor Hall stands in all this. He's 21 now, was 21 at the start of the season, but not the calendar year. Hasn't played yet so presumably isn't registered. Would be typical of his luck (and symptomatic of the EFL's idiotic registration rules) if yet again his development was stiffled by embargo.
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Re: Loanees available

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:39 am

Connor Hall was on the bench at Bristol so he must be registered?

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Re: Loanees available

Post by Prufrock » Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:53 am

That answers that then!
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Re: Loanees available

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Wed Oct 30, 2019 12:33 pm

Ta. As noted on the contract expiry thread, although it's an inexact science around the kids, we seem to have 22 players on pro contracts. In bunches of five for visual ease:

Josh Earl (loan)
Jake Wright (loan)
Liam Bridcutt (loan)
Will Buckley
Thibaud Verlinden (loan)

Ben Alnwick
Remi Matthews
Josh Emmanuel
Jack Hobbs
Joe Bunney

Jason Lowe
Luke Murphy
James Weir

Ali Crawford
Joe Dodoo

Chris O'Grady
Daryl Murphy

Yoan Zouma (pro)
Dennis Politic (pro)
Connor Hall (pro)
Harry Brockbank (pro)

Liam Edwards (pro)

Overpromoted scholars aside, have I missed anyone?

Also, the players in red are the ones Hill/Flicker didn't sign or extend. They're the ones likely to be under threat of being moved out in January if we need embargo-enforced space or wage savings. Some more than others - Earl perhaps, although he's usefully flexible; Weir certainly; Alnwick?; maybe Connor Hall?

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Re: Loanees available

Post by Prufrock » Wed Oct 30, 2019 12:55 pm

The Edwards one is weird to me. I like him, but a four year contract to a 23 year old who's played 2 senior games above the Conference North ever, and hasn't kicked a ball at all for the new management? Especially when noone else has longer than 2 (and that's only Brockers)?

Think he fancies Politic, Brockbank and Lowe (though maybe didn't initially). Think Matthews and Earl will stay if we can keep them (assuming Earl gets and stays fit and in the team). Wouldn't surprise me to see any of the other reds go.
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Re: Loanees available

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Oct 30, 2019 1:59 pm

Earls played two, injured in two. Not looking good.

Alnwick clearly has issues outside of football which is a real shame. I don’t expect to see him play for us again. If that means he leaves in jan and it frees up a place it won’t have any impact whatsoever as we will need to fill it with a keeper.

When is Edwards fit again? He did stand out as being head and shoulders above the rest, including Brockbank. But as Pru points out it is in a handful of games. I wonder if he had an offer from elsewhere?

I’ll be surprised if Weir doesn’t go at this rate.

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Re: Loanees available

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Oct 30, 2019 1:59 pm

Oh - Ronan Darcy. He was the next big thing but seems to have disappeared?

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Re: Loanees available

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Wed Oct 30, 2019 2:28 pm

officer_dibble wrote:
Wed Oct 30, 2019 1:59 pm
Oh - Ronan Darcy. He was the next big thing but seems to have disappeared?
Not on the above list cos he is still a scholar rather than pro

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Re: Loanees available

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Oct 30, 2019 2:42 pm

A-ha
Spotted on the other thread
Presumably the terms of the embargo therefore threaten us playing him, developing him, and him doing a Luca. It’s a kick in the balls isn’t it!

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