A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Prufrock » Tue Dec 17, 2019 12:08 pm

I'm not sure it really counts as an Americanism at all if there is no concise way of saying it in British English, but hey ho, I'm like totally fine with it.
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:50 pm

Since time immemorial, well since we invented it, full-backs and half-backs have been a part of the game of Football ( I was picked as right half for St Joseph's Junior School team in 1950, cough! when shirts were numbered 2-11, Green jumpers didn't have numbers)

If we have to have quarter backs, and I'm not sure why we should, (my son played there in an American football team over here before moving to California to live), it would stand to sense (in the rules of division ) for a quarter back to be positioned between full back and half back in football, till the whistle blows of course; then it just becomes a tag, as anything can happen. John Harrison's chronometer could well blow up trying to track longitude and latitude on anybody in a White shirt.

History and tradition....pah, old hat.... ae:)

:D
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Prufrock » Tue Dec 17, 2019 3:50 pm

:D it's a metaphor!

Though the holding midfielder playing that role does sort of sit between where a half-back and (old style) full back would go and I assume that is where the name in American Football comes from (in the same way you still have halves in both codes of Rugby).
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Dec 17, 2019 3:58 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 3:50 pm
:D it's a metaphor!

Though the holding midfielder playing that role does sort of sit between where a half-back and (old style) full back would go and I assume that is where the name in American Football comes from (in the same way you still have halves in both codes of Rugby).
Er, yes.... :lol:
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Harry Genshaw » Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:36 pm

Feck the Americanisms, can we not be more European for now and refer to Bridcutt as our Libero?

Quarter back indeed. It'll be root beer and waffles at the kiosks before you know it!
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Prufrock » Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:43 pm

Nah, not when he's playing on midfield anyway, a libero is essentially a sweeper, plays behind the back line, Sammer or Matthaus like.

Bridders when he plays in midfield still plays in front of the back line. He's not a regista, not mobile or high enough. I don't like American football, but I stand by my metaphor. It's the most appropriate phrase.

(And I'm not sure wanky sub-Richardson Italianisms are the answer either, you ristretto drinking Chiacchierone :D)
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Harry Genshaw » Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:06 pm

^
I stand corrected. I always had a libero as a sweeper type who played in front of the back four rather than behind. I nearly choked on mi biscotti :D
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:23 pm

TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:50 pm
Since time immemorial, well since we invented it, full-backs and half-backs have been a part of the game of Football ( I was picked as right half for St Joseph's Junior School team in 1950, cough! when shirts were numbered 2-11, Green jumpers didn't have numbers)

If we have to have quarter backs, and I'm not sure why we should, (my son played there in an American football team over here before moving to California to live), it would stand to sense (in the rules of division ) for a quarter back to be positioned between full back and half back in football, till the whistle blows of course; then it just becomes a tag, as anything can happen. John Harrison's chronometer could well blow up trying to track longitude and latitude on anybody in a White shirt.

History and tradition....pah, old hat.... ae:)

:D
Interesting you mention half-backs - as strictly speaking a centre-half is what we'd now call a midfielder, which sounds suspiciously new-fangled... :D

(unless of course language changes in its attempt to be illustrative. I didn't have Hobo down as a Cardinal Richelieu-style prescriptivist, but life's for learning...)

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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Abdoulaye's Twin » Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:27 pm

Just call him a Poundland Campo> Folk will know what you mean without referring to that team advert thing interspersed with fat blokes running into less fat blokes etc :)

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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Harry Genshaw » Tue Dec 17, 2019 6:05 pm

Abdoulaye's Twin wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:27 pm
Just call him a Poundland Campo>
I think we have a winner!
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue Dec 17, 2019 6:30 pm

See, for me it still doesn't work.

For all the brain-dead revisionism of Allardyce as a one-dimensional proto-Pulis, the teams Campo played in had creators all over the pitch. With team-mates like Djorkaeff, Okocha, Stelios, Diouf, Frandsen, Speed, Nolan, Davies and Anelka, we were far from reliant on one man for Good Ideas and general lock-picking.

Now I don't know much about american football, which seems to me so much of a nonsense that it somehow manages to make rugby look nuanced, but from what I do know it seems that almost every move goes through the creative linchpin of the quarterback. Which is why it's such a fitting term for Liam Bridcutt, whose presence and passing range seem to make every team-mate seek him out with the ball, even if he's stood ten yards behind the centre-backs (or -halves).

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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Dec 17, 2019 7:59 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:23 pm
TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:50 pm
Since time immemorial, well since we invented it, full-backs and half-backs have been a part of the game of Football ( I was picked as right half for St Joseph's Junior School team in 1950, cough! when shirts were numbered 2-11, Green jumpers didn't have numbers)

If we have to have quarter backs, and I'm not sure why we should, (my son played there in an American football team over here before moving to California to live), it would stand to sense (in the rules of division ) for a quarter back to be positioned between full back and half back in football, till the whistle blows of course; then it just becomes a tag, as anything can happen. John Harrison's chronometer could well blow up trying to track longitude and latitude on anybody in a White shirt.

History and tradition....pah, old hat.... ae:)

:D
Interesting you mention half-backs - as strictly speaking a centre-half is what we'd now call a midfielder, which sounds suspiciously new-fangled... :D

(unless of course language changes in its attempt to be illustrative. I didn't have Hobo down as a Cardinal Richelieu-style prescriptivist, but life's for learning...)
We live and learn (we of the Methusala club :) ). A centre half, I thought, was the modern term for a central defender. What happened to "If it ain't broke" etc?
The wisest and the best of men, nay, the wisest and best of their actions, may be rendered ridiculous by a person whose first object in life is a joke...Darcy. Pride and Prejudice.

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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:46 pm

TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 7:59 pm
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:23 pm
Interesting you mention half-backs - as strictly speaking a centre-half is what we'd now call a midfielder, which sounds suspiciously new-fangled... :D

(unless of course language changes in its attempt to be illustrative. I didn't have Hobo down as a Cardinal Richelieu-style prescriptivist, but life's for learning...)
We live and learn (we of the Methusala club :) ). A centre half, I thought, was the modern term for a central defender. What happened to "If it ain't broke" etc?
Precisely my point, Tango - as with most language, terms and usage come and go. Most folks now use "centre-half" and "centre-back" interchangeably but the "half" bit betrays an older time of 2-3-5 and W-M; meanwhile, conversely, the "full-back" is rarely fully back, and even in a back four you'll often get them whizzing past wingers and being the furthest players forward. As formations and styles change, some of the old descriptions become overly simplistic if not downright misleading. So we sometimes need new terms of engagement... :D

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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:10 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:46 pm
TANGODANCER wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 7:59 pm
Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:23 pm
Interesting you mention half-backs - as strictly speaking a centre-half is what we'd now call a midfielder, which sounds suspiciously new-fangled... :D

(unless of course language changes in its attempt to be illustrative. I didn't have Hobo down as a Cardinal Richelieu-style prescriptivist, but life's for learning...)
We live and learn (we of the Methusala club :) ). A centre half, I thought, was the modern term for a central defender. What happened to "If it ain't broke" etc?
Precisely my point, Tango - as with most language, terms and usage come and go. Most folks now use "centre-half" and "centre-back" interchangeably but the "half" bit betrays an older time of 2-3-5 and W-M; meanwhile, conversely, the "full-back" is rarely fully back, and even in a back four you'll often get them whizzing past wingers and being the furthest players forward. As formations and styles change, some of the old descriptions become overly simplistic if not downright misleading. So we sometimes need new terms of engagement... :D
Actually, D.S.B, (and I'll stand correction as I was one myself around then), the term "overlapping wing-back" became commonly associated with the game via Alf Ramsey using George Cohen and Ray Wilson ( who were both quite nippy) as such in the 1966 World Cup campaign. Although somewhat new to some of us at the time, and unless added later, the team were listed as below:

1 Gordon Banks, Leicester (GK)

2 George Cohen, Fulham (RB)

3 Ray Wilson, Everton (LB)

4 Nobby Stiles, Man United (DM)

5 Jack Charlton, Leeds (CB)

6 Bobby Moore, West Ham (CB)

7 Alan Ball, Blackpool (M)

9 Bobby Charlton, Man United (AM)

10 Geoff Hurst, West Ham (S)

16 Martin Peters, West Ham (M)

21 Roger Hunt, Liverpool (S)
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:46 pm

Overlapping wingbacks or overlapping fullbacks?

Also worth noting, as your bracketed positions do, that yon team was what would now be called a diamond midfield - but possibly not by those allergic to neologisms... :)

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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by TANGODANCER » Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:40 pm

Dave Sutton's barnet wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 9:46 pm
Overlapping wingbacks or overlapping fullbacks?

Also worth noting, as your bracketed positions do, that yon team was what would now be called a diamond midfield - but possibly not by those allergic to neologisms... :)
The term probably was "overlapping full backs" in Alf Ramseys 'time in charge. We hadn't long dispensed with a quick pint and a Woodbine at half-time back then. :lol:
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Re: A very Posh affair, hope it keeps fine for it. Versus Peterborough away 14-12-2019

Post by Hoboh » Sat Dec 21, 2019 7:37 am

Bloody hell I've started something here, sorry chaps but the quarterback made me think we will be calling football by it's Yankee name next, bloody Trump!
Carry on Pru, I know you will, bloody youth :D

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