Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Bertie Wooster » Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:42 pm

Utter fcuking garbage - fcuk off Keith Hill, that was abysmal. For a NYD match it was one of the worst crowds & atmosphere's ever experienced, the Bolton public are certainly not backing Keith Hill (to be honest I'd rather have Harry Hill managing)

Great start two great goals and we should have kicked on from there, but WTF after that we just absolutely surrendered, we didn't compete, backed off constantly and let them have the ball, you could see all of their goals coming, horrendous defending and general organisation but shocking tactically.

Hill on the side in his jeans trying to be cool again was shocking, its all about him IMO he's so up his own arse he thinks he's clever but he really is a shit manager. Those players are certainly not playing for him, they play like they hate him. There is no fight, character, no leaders nothing. Keith Hill really is a Sunday League manager at best - he needs to go now as he wont get us out of League 2 next year, he's taking the piss.

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Harry Genshaw » Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:52 pm

A bit surprised at folk writing Hill off already.

First 15 minutes we looked awesome. The angled ball to Dodoo and his directness had them at 6s & 7s. Dreadful defending throughout the side then let them back into it.

Appalling ref (again) compounded our own shortcomings.

Theres a reason most of the defenders at our club were without an employer prior to the transfer window. Today they all demonstrated their inadequacies at the same time so players who were throwing their bodies on the line last Sunday and boxing day, suddenly looked like they'd forgotten how to defend.

Weir looked nervous to begin with but grew into the game and was the unanimous MotM amongst the 10 of us there today.
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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:58 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:52 pm
A bit surprised at folk writing Hill off already.

First 15 minutes we looked awesome. The angled ball to Dodoo and his directness had them at 6s & 7s. Dreadful defending throughout the side then let them back into it.

Appalling ref (again) compounded our own shortcomings.

Theres a reason most of the defenders at our club were without an employer prior to the transfer window. Today they all demonstrated their inadequacies at the same time so players who were throwing their bodies on the line last Sunday and boxing day, suddenly looked like they'd forgotten how to defend.

Weir looked nervous to begin with but grew into the game and was the unanimous MotM amongst the 10 of us there today.
The ref got very little wrong. Few niggly tussles perhaps. But everything else he was fine on.

I’d have given Weir a 3/10 at best. So I have no idea what game you were watching.

The lack of organisation and structure shines through and that is the manager and coaching staff. Enough excuses have been made. His tactical changes are also shocking. He’s very limited with choice sure. It’s tough. But we have enough going forward to score goals. But the players behind look like strangers most of the time.

Hill doesn’t convince. Hasn’t since he came in. I doubt he will come close to pitch invasions as manager here.

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:04 pm

To be fair to weir he’s been panned unilaterally by mr motivation since he pitched up; today was his first start in months when everyone was expecting graham to play. He might be a player at this level under a proper manager.

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by nicholaldo » Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:10 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:52 pm
A bit surprised at folk writing Hill off already.

First 15 minutes we looked awesome. The angled ball to Dodoo and his directness had them at 6s & 7s. Dreadful defending throughout the side then let them back into it.

Appalling ref (again) compounded our own shortcomings.

Theres a reason most of the defenders at our club were without an employer prior to the transfer window. Today they all demonstrated their inadequacies at the same time so players who were throwing their bodies on the line last Sunday and boxing day, suddenly looked like they'd forgotten how to defend.

Weir looked nervous to begin with but grew into the game and was the unanimous MotM amongst the 10 of us there today.

We all see things differently but I'm very surprised by that, Harry. I thought he was well out of his depth. Constantly letting the player he was supposed to be marking run in behind him, rarely near enough to press the opposition, unsure of his positioning and generally unable to get into it. To be fair though, he had a decent spell towards the very end, and also in fairness, I expect that was because by that stage he was playing further up the pitch, which seems closer to his natural position. He's certainly no defensive midfielder.

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Bertie Wooster » Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:11 pm

Weir was shocking, as was Wright but saying that I left with 20 mins to go as its was embarrassing - we made them look like Barcelona, no one getting stuck in, no one competing, they looked lost after the 1st 15 mins.

I watched Hill from the WSU and he just stood there all game in his jeans & trainers, he's fcuking unprofessional and sets the wrong tone - the players must think 'what a dick'.

How can anyone who actually turned up today not slag Hill off, he hasn't improved anything in 4 months - we don't compete we just sit back & let them play, no fight, no organisation, no bottle - Hill's Bolton side is soft as shite, there is no leadership on or off the pitch.

He was the cheap as fcuk option for FV, and its now showing

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:12 pm

officer_dibble wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:04 pm
To be fair to weir he’s been panned unilaterally by mr motivation since he pitched up; today was his first start in months when everyone was expecting graham to play. He might be a player at this level under a proper manager.
I think he’s low on confidence for sure. But you can say about any player he might do well under a different manager. Hill has got some playing well. No doubt. My issue is that as a collective since the very first few games we have looked disjointed and poorly organised. And he’s making more and more weird decisions that I fear are little more than an attempt to be edgy. Bridcutt ar CB. Verlinde up front, Buckley up front. It’s just all a bit shit. And if you are going to lose games don’t do it experimenting with weird shit when there is no need.

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Harry Genshaw » Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:14 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:58 pm
Harry Genshaw wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:52 pm
A bit surprised at folk writing Hill off already.

First 15 minutes we looked awesome. The angled ball to Dodoo and his directness had them at 6s & 7s. Dreadful defending throughout the side then let them back into it.

Appalling ref (again) compounded our own shortcomings.

Theres a reason most of the defenders at our club were without an employer prior to the transfer window. Today they all demonstrated their inadequacies at the same time so players who were throwing their bodies on the line last Sunday and boxing day, suddenly looked like they'd forgotten how to defend.

Weir looked nervous to begin with but grew into the game and was the unanimous MotM amongst the 10 of us there today.
The ref got very little wrong. Few niggly tussles perhaps. But everything else he was fine on.

I’d have given Weir a 3/10 at best. So I have no idea what game you were watching.

The lack of organisation and structure shines through and that is the manager and coaching staff. Enough excuses have been made. His tactical changes are also shocking. He’s very limited with choice sure. It’s tough. But we have enough going forward to score goals. But the players behind look like strangers most of the time.

Hill doesn’t convince. Hasn’t since he came in. I doubt he will come close to pitch invasions as manager here.
And I've no idea what game you were watching if you think that ref got very little wrong.

I'm prepared to give Hill a lot of time. He's inherited a shit load of problems and trying to patch a team together that can compete. The footy and entertainment is light years ahead of the previous 2 years dirge I endured. For that, Hill should be afforded the time his contract allows imo
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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:21 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:14 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:58 pm
Harry Genshaw wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:52 pm
A bit surprised at folk writing Hill off already.

First 15 minutes we looked awesome. The angled ball to Dodoo and his directness had them at 6s & 7s. Dreadful defending throughout the side then let them back into it.

Appalling ref (again) compounded our own shortcomings.

Theres a reason most of the defenders at our club were without an employer prior to the transfer window. Today they all demonstrated their inadequacies at the same time so players who were throwing their bodies on the line last Sunday and boxing day, suddenly looked like they'd forgotten how to defend.

Weir looked nervous to begin with but grew into the game and was the unanimous MotM amongst the 10 of us there today.
The ref got very little wrong. Few niggly tussles perhaps. But everything else he was fine on.

I’d have given Weir a 3/10 at best. So I have no idea what game you were watching.

The lack of organisation and structure shines through and that is the manager and coaching staff. Enough excuses have been made. His tactical changes are also shocking. He’s very limited with choice sure. It’s tough. But we have enough going forward to score goals. But the players behind look like strangers most of the time.

Hill doesn’t convince. Hasn’t since he came in. I doubt he will come close to pitch invasions as manager here.
And I've no idea what game you were watching if you think that ref got very little wrong.

I'm prepared to give Hill a lot of time. He's inherited a shit load of problems and trying to patch a team together that can compete. The footy and entertainment is light years ahead of the previous 2 years dirge I endured. For that, Hill should be afforded the time his contract allows imo
Iles today tweeted ‘what’s the opposite of a 4-3 thriller?’ which sums it up for me. I found zero today that encourages me. We lost but in truth were completely outplayed by Burton even at 2-0.

Thee is no atmosphere at all and fans are flat completely because they know how awful we are.

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Bertie Wooster » Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:25 pm

The entertainment for the 1st 15 mins was excellent, we played well & could have been 3 up had Verlinden's shot that hit the post gone in.

But after that until I left it was shocking, possibly the worst Bolton performance in memory, the team just surrendered - they certainly did not play for Keith Hill, no one was running through brick walls for him.

His casual, cocky approach (jeans etc) is now rubbing off on the team, they are way to casual & disorganised

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:30 pm

Bertie Wooster wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:25 pm
The entertainment for the 1st 15 mins was excellent, we played well & could have been 3 up had Verlinden's shot that hit the post gone in.

But after that until I left it was shocking, possibly the worst Bolton performance in memory, the team just surrendered - they certainly did not play for Keith Hill, no one was running through brick walls for him.

His casual, cocky approach (jeans etc) is now rubbing off on the team, they are way to casual & disorganised
We need to be clear the first fifteen minutes were Burton dominating punctuated by two great pieces of play by DoDoo. The signs we were getting battered were there. Had those two goals not been scored could have been a Rugby score really.

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by officer_dibble » Wed Jan 01, 2020 8:44 pm

I imagine it was as bad as Accrington, y’know, last month! We’re having an utter dicking once a month, conceding shitty wanky goals by not concentrating or clearly not having worked on set pieces. Keith’s too busy shopping for chinos and hats, and practising his press conferences.

I know full well he gets time as this was a ridiculously hard job but the big warning signs are he is another Owen Coyle / Holloway type character. Great for a sound bite, fecking useless as a manager. We should be above Southend by now, especially given they were shit enough to lose to us!

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Bruce Rioja » Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:13 pm

Harry Genshaw wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:14 pm


And I've no idea what game you were watching if you think that ref got very little wrong.

I'm prepared to give Hill a lot of time. He's inherited a shit load of problems and trying to patch a team together that can compete. The footy and entertainment is light years ahead of the previous 2 years dirge I endured. For that, Hill should be afforded the time his contract allows imo
All of this bit - absolutely.
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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Bruce Rioja » Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:20 pm

officer_dibble wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 8:44 pm
I imagine it was as bad as Accrington
It wasn't, Dibs. The feeling at Accy was similar to the feeling at Wembley against Stoke, only without being on public display.
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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by dave the minion » Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:37 pm

Reading all this is tremendous.

5 months ago, despite the shitstorm that had rained down on the club for years, it was all "Parky can f*ck off. Get someone else in - don't know who, but anyone - anyone - would be an improvement"

Hill comes in.

Despite the shitstorm that he inherited, 5 months later "Hill has to go. Worst manager we've ever had. Blah blah blah"

Think a lot of Bolton fans need to stand back a minute and have a quick reality check. We are crap, we were very nearly no longer in existence, and we now have a team made up entirely of cast-offs from our competitors, and we started the season on -12 points, yet somehow everyone expects more???
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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by TANGODANCER » Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:58 pm

dave the minion wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:37 pm
Reading all this is tremendous.

5 months ago, despite the shitstorm that had rained down on the club for years, it was all "Parky can f*ck off. Get someone else in - don't know who, but anyone - anyone - would be an improvement"

Hill comes in.

Despite the shitstorm that he inherited, 5 months later "Hill has to go. Worst manager we've ever had. Blah blah blah"

Think a lot of Bolton fans need to stand back a minute and have a quick reality check. We are crap, we were very nearly no longer in existence, and we now have a team made up entirely of cast-offs from our competitors, and we started the season on -12 points, yet somehow everyone expects more???
And I'd imagine that playing with ten men for a fair chunk of two games wouldn't really have helped our case over much Dave....I can hear the rustle of bedsheets and the clash of pitchforks already...that well known Bolton patience.
er, Come On You Whites..... :|
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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Harry Genshaw » Wed Jan 01, 2020 10:21 pm

dave the minion wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:37 pm
Reading all this is tremendous.

5 months ago, despite the shitstorm that had rained down on the club for years, it was all "Parky can f*ck off. Get someone else in - don't know who, but anyone - anyone - would be an improvement"

Hill comes in.

Despite the shitstorm that he inherited, 5 months later "Hill has to go. Worst manager we've ever had. Blah blah blah"

Think a lot of Bolton fans need to stand back a minute and have a quick reality check. We are crap, we were very nearly no longer in existence, and we now have a team made up entirely of cast-offs from our competitors, and we started the season on -12 points, yet somehow everyone expects more???
Not sure how you arrive at that conclusion given the posts on this thread :conf:
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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by nicholaldo » Wed Jan 01, 2020 11:08 pm

dave the minion wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:37 pm
Reading all this is tremendous.

5 months ago, despite the shitstorm that had rained down on the club for years, it was all "Parky can f*ck off. Get someone else in - don't know who, but anyone - anyone - would be an improvement"

Hill comes in.

Despite the shitstorm that he inherited, 5 months later "Hill has to go. Worst manager we've ever had. Blah blah blah"

Think a lot of Bolton fans need to stand back a minute and have a quick reality check. We are crap, we were very nearly no longer in existence, and we now have a team made up entirely of cast-offs from our competitors, and we started the season on -12 points, yet somehow everyone expects more???

For most people I don't think it's a matter of having unreasonable expectations or being insensitive to the challenging circumstances he's working under. What I instead think it is is an expression of concern that his decision-making is increasingly proving, on occasion, to be quite erratic, and also that particular traits of his personality have caused, or have the potential to cause, problems which needn't otherwise arise.

No-one is asking for perfection, with the possible exception of one poster, but I have to be honest and acknowledge that although there are a number of things to be pleased about, Hill has sometimes reacted to what appear to be quite basic, straightforward situations in ways I find confusing and alarming. That's not the same as me thinking he shouldn't be in the job though, it just means that I currently have some doubts about him. Perhaps I just need to have more faith?

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by truewhite15 » Thu Jan 02, 2020 12:37 am

dave the minion wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:37 pm
Reading all this is tremendous.

5 months ago, despite the shitstorm that had rained down on the club for years, it was all "Parky can f*ck off. Get someone else in - don't know who, but anyone - anyone - would be an improvement"

Hill comes in.

Despite the shitstorm that he inherited, 5 months later "Hill has to go. Worst manager we've ever had. Blah blah blah"

Think a lot of Bolton fans need to stand back a minute and have a quick reality check. We are crap, we were very nearly no longer in existence, and we now have a team made up entirely of cast-offs from our competitors, and we started the season on -12 points, yet somehow everyone expects more???
This. A thousand times, this.

Some really fecking short memories on here.

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Re: Brew Years Day - Burton Albion (H) - 01-01-2020

Post by Prufrock » Thu Jan 02, 2020 2:33 am

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:30 pm
Bertie Wooster wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 7:25 pm
The entertainment for the 1st 15 mins was excellent, we played well & could have been 3 up had Verlinden's shot that hit the post gone in.

But after that until I left it was shocking, possibly the worst Bolton performance in memory, the team just surrendered - they certainly did not play for Keith Hill, no one was running through brick walls for him.

His casual, cocky approach (jeans etc) is now rubbing off on the team, they are way to casual & disorganised
We need to be clear the first fifteen minutes were Burton dominating punctuated by two great pieces of play by DoDoo. The signs we were getting battered were there. Had those two goals not been scored could have been a Rugby score really.
Can you pack it in with the awful politician "let's be clear" nonsense especially when you're just putting forward your sus opinion. As others have said, I don't know what game you were waching if you thought the ref got not much wrong, or indeed if you think Burton dominated the first 15 mins.

That's two games in a row where the referees have been absolutely hopeless around correctly sending off a Bolton player. No real big decisions, at least today, just a constant stream of weirdness. Nothing free kicks given for bits and pieces, handfuls of shirts visibly yanked, or big two handed shoves not given. A game of football threatened by a refereeing lottery at any point.

More pressingly, two games in a row where we have been let down by idiotic senior players. Thought Murphy was really goodin the first half, looked to revel in being the senior midfielder, tenacious in the tackle, used the ball well. But that's unforgiveable. You could argue each yellow was a touch harsh especially in the light of what went unpunished but still can't have any complaints at all. "Might havr got away with it on another day" is not an excuse. Even the first one you say OK it's a mad first half he's trying to take a tactical and slow things down (though noting he couldn't even do that properly as they played on and got a shot away) but the second one, 5 mins into the second half, going nowhere inside their own half, absolutely braindead. Him and Lowe can get f*cked.

I'm absolutely not having Burton dominated the first 15 either! Their two centre backs had the ball without pressure three times in that period and managed to miss the pitch! They're one of the worst teams I've ever seen at the Reebok. In the first half their left back had me and our kid joking about going for a run when we got home as the dream isn't over, and in the second the keeper had us googling Boxing Day deals on keeper gloves. They were utter shite. They did boss the second half of the first half, but that's mainly because we have no midfield and our centre halfs, without any protection, had no answer to them rolling balls into Akins who bullied them both. We were well worth our 2-0 lead (though then also worth our 3-2 defecit).

James Weir isn't good enough. He's massively low on confidence but he was non-existent in the first half. No lack of effort but has Verlinden's sense of where to press and when (i.e. none). No fixing that. Not his fault (or Hill's really), but with him and an inexperieced Darcy the back 4 were hopelessly exposed from about 20 mins on.

There are huge mitigating circumstances for why we are where we are (though those who used to beat Parkinson but want to defend Hill can feck off). You can't blame Hill for why we had a really poor midfield out there today. Small squad, injuries, plus idiotic decisions from Lowe and Murphy are out of his control. You can't blame Hill for an experienced defender in Wright managing to get far too tight and get rolled for simple, basic goals in each half (I have more sympathy for the second where the overrun midfield meant Wright got isolated with Boyce and with us needing to nick the ball back, but the first one (their 3rd?) was one of the worse goals I've seen a professional team concede). It's a patchwork team where some signings will work out and some won't.

That said...I don't see what the plan is. We're told he's a "footballing" manager, but that first half was entirely big diags (if we worked hard to force them, or even worse big straight lumpls) to Murphy and Dodoo. I'm not even saying that's wrong, but the rest of the team isn't set up that way. We frig about at the back until the centre-backs are on the edge of our box before Remi nice people it up and then when it's cleared our midifeld 3 have 40 yards to fill between them. If you drop off then you have to try to play out, or if you're going long push up and squeeze the space. One minute we're playing out, the next we're not. BWFCi is absolutely right on the point about Hill trying to be too clever. Dodoo is a number 9. I don't mind him doing a job down the right and he was excellent for the first 20, but taking off Murphy and sticking tiny Verlinden through the middle while Dodoo stayed wide was insane. Then Buckely went central while O'Grady went wide left. Plus the whole Bridcutt nonsense. It's never a good sign when you can't work out what a manager is trying to do.

I know a few folk get frustrated and problably go a bit far with their expectations v when we could expect to be, but I think folk would have a lot more patience if we could work out what's happening. Also, on the other hand, I doubt Burton have a single player on what we're paying the two Murphys (by way of example) and they're not skint by 3rd tier standards, so there is that. We can't expect mircales. We can expect, four months in, a team that looks like it knows what it's doing defending set-pieces. (Or attacking them). We can't complain about not having been able to practice defending with 10 men either, though practicing defending with 11 would be nice too.

We've got (I think) two players contracted beyond June, Brockbank and Edwards, yet neither have seen a minute since coming back from injury. We seem to have a plan for two weeks then tear it up and start again. We need to be deciding wh's going to be here next year, how we're going to play, and treating the rest of this season as a tester for who can cut it and how. Instead it's another combination of journeymen thrown together. Are we going to try to play more, in which case, pick fullbacks who want the ball (cough, Adam, cough). Try to play through the middle. If we give it way trying, great, you've got the luxury of a free hit. Or, go the other way. Be direct, use the strengths of Murphy and Dodoo. They'd be a cracking two with a compact hard working side behind them. At the moment I don't know what they are.

The worst thing about all this is the waste of the fresh start. Burton were largely dreadful but had good players in the final third and punished us. That's enough at this level even with a competition winner in nets and a back four who literally could't kick the ball in the direction they meant to. Shrewsbury were dicks but I thought really impressive. Used the ball well, had a system where everyone knew their job, everyone wanted the ball. They lacked quality in the final third but they have the budget of fecking Shrewsbury. You get more of a free rein than almost any manager ever here. And it's drifting aimlessly.

And, I know but come on, the daft nice person is lolling about in jeans and another Adidas beanie. He's a fecking weirdo. Owen's footballing brain wit Dougie's social skills.

Obviously he gets time, but this is going to end in tears.
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