Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

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Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Mar » Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:52 pm

The club is participating in a social media boycott this weekend...

https://www.bwfc.co.uk/news/2021/april/ ... a-boycott/


Whilst I do support action being taken to help bring attention to help lessen the amount of abuse on social media platforms I think the timing of this really is a kick in the teeth for fans, but then again maybe that's the intention in an effort to drive the point home, which seems like another punishment for fans.

I don't think that boycotting social media is going to address the issues and I fear that the fresh call for regulation may end up criminalising free speech online. After all their would be regulations to protect against online harms, which is deemed:

Harmful content and activity would be defined in the legislation as that which “gives rise to a reasonably foreseeable risk of a significant adverse physical or psychological impact on individuals”.

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/re ... 2021-0046/

Whilst that may sound reasonable on the surface what is to say that any critiques of Marvin Sordell or Marcus Maddison wouldn't end up falling foul of the ruling and being considered to be a criminal act. We're supporters first and foremost, we support, judge and critique our team and the opposition and i'd hate to see criticism becoming criminalized.

Now, the majority of us are already out of pocket as a result of season ticket pricing. Season ticket prices have been between £275 to £349 for the average match goer. Which means that it would've been far cheaper for us to have paid on the day via iFollow. I got the one adult and child ticket so i've essentially paid £70 over what it would've cost on the day. Only those under 65's or kids would've got it cheaper than iFollow.

So, not only have we not been able to attend matches, we've also been charged more for the privilege of booking early and are now being told by the club that the fans can't celebrate properly should we get promoted. Heck, now we're being told we can't even celebrate with the club from a distance.

But we're not alone in this. Man City could realistically win the premier league this weekend (should City win and Utd lose). Norwich could seal the championship title, Hull could seal the league one title and Peterborough could seal promotion. We're all aware of the happenings of League Two and what can happen, and whilst i'm not the most attentive social media goer this social media boycott seems like just another slap in the face for the fan.

But hey ho, at least the club have given us discounts for taking more of our money (perhaps this is why the away shirt is still listed at full price): https://www.bwfc.co.uk/news/2020/octobe ... ty/?g4id=3

A discount, no less than 10% on next seasons ticket maybe offset by any price rises the club put on as a result of getting into League One (should we get there).

And whilst this may come across as a criticism of sorts, i'd hope that it would not fall foul of any new fangled regulations, lest I become a criminal for airing an opinion.

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:15 pm

The whole point of the boycott is to put pressure onto social media companies themselves - not onto lawmakers. The argument is clear - twitter, facebook etc allow an incredible amount of abuse, allow for anonymous accounts in their millions to exist and spam abuse to all quarters. Footballers are often targets of this. And the only people who can do something about this are the social media companies themselves.

I fully wholeheartedly support the action. It is needed. And it is timed well. Is it good for Bolton Wanderers? Not really. But there are no guarantees we win Saturday anyway. Regardless a stand needs to be taken to force these companies to do better and stop their services being abused and that abuse impacting the lives of the targets.

Also I'll add IF we beat Exeter on Saturday I really honestly won't give a monkeys that Bolton Wanderers can't post on twitter about it I'll be too bust celebrating and enjoying the moment.

As for the 'costs' and prices - I've been delighted to pay for a ST to help keep my club going. We all went in knowing there was a big likelihood we'd be watching virtually all season. Remember that in many cases 1 ST has allowed a whole household to watch the games - so the benefit and drawback goes both ways. I wouldn't want a refund. I appreciate the fact we still exist. And happy to have played a small part in that.

IF we go up I suspect ST prices go up modestly and I think that is right. I trust SB et al to get the call right - they've nailed everything so far more or less.

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Worthy4England » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:28 pm

There is already legislation around what individuals can and can't say and where they can and can't say it. :-) This just seems to give more incumbency on Service Providers to not allow certain things to happen.

It's a buggers muddle of a White Paper. At one end of the spectrum, it seeks to protect from terrorism and child exploitation, which I suspect no one would take issue with, and at the other end, it brings in trolling and on-line abuse - which I similarly think people would believe is not ok, but then we get into that grey area - that you mention - of some people on an internet forum having a conversation around whether Player X is good/shite, that doesn't involve the person being discussed. I suspect at worst that might involve a code of conduct type breach and you would be requested to remove the offending post.

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Dave Sutton's barnet » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:42 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:28 pm
...then we get into that grey area - that you mention - of some people on an internet forum having a conversation around whether Player X is good/shite, that doesn't involve the person being discussed.
on a somewhat related note, the other night I watched The Australian Dream, a documentary about the Aussie Rules player Adam Goodes and his attempts to thwart racism (he has indigenous heritage). It raises some interesting questions, some of which IMO are fairly straightforward but some of which IMO are fairly unanswerable, such as: if a player has campaigned against racism, is booing him part of the problem?

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:56 pm

Worthy4England wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:28 pm
There is already legislation around what individuals can and can't say and where they can and can't say it. :-) This just seems to give more incumbency on Service Providers to not allow certain things to happen.

It's a buggers muddle of a White Paper. At one end of the spectrum, it seeks to protect from terrorism and child exploitation, which I suspect no one would take issue with, and at the other end, it brings in trolling and on-line abuse - which I similarly think people would believe is not ok, but then we get into that grey area - that you mention - of some people on an internet forum having a conversation around whether Player X is good/shite, that doesn't involve the person being discussed. I suspect at worst that might involve a code of conduct type breach and you would be requested to remove the offending post.
We all know the intent of the white paper. A government appointed regulator decides. That’s rarely well intentioned.

But the call for a boycott is directly aimed at the social media companies. If they sorted their houses out we’d not have the potential for sinister creep of government getting involved.

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Mar » Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:08 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:56 pm
Worthy4England wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:28 pm
There is already legislation around what individuals can and can't say and where they can and can't say it. :-) This just seems to give more incumbency on Service Providers to not allow certain things to happen.

It's a buggers muddle of a White Paper. At one end of the spectrum, it seeks to protect from terrorism and child exploitation, which I suspect no one would take issue with, and at the other end, it brings in trolling and on-line abuse - which I similarly think people would believe is not ok, but then we get into that grey area - that you mention - of some people on an internet forum having a conversation around whether Player X is good/shite, that doesn't involve the person being discussed. I suspect at worst that might involve a code of conduct type breach and you would be requested to remove the offending post.
We all know the intent of the white paper. A government appointed regulator decides. That’s rarely well intentioned.

But the call for a boycott is directly aimed at the social media companies. If they sorted their houses out we’d not have the potential for sinister creep of government getting involved.
Do you honestly think that social media companies will take action based upon a football boycott?

I don't. If anything the next step would be for the football league to be pushing for actual legislation in which the bad intentions from government will come through. In my mind this only serves to push for government to creep into online regulation (see another cookie policy fiasco).

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Let's not lose sight of what would be lost should fresh legislation come into play.

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:15 pm
As for the 'costs' and prices - I've been delighted to pay for a ST to help keep my club going. We all went in knowing there was a big likelihood we'd be watching virtually all season. Remember that in many cases 1 ST has allowed a whole household to watch the games - so the benefit and drawback goes both ways. I wouldn't want a refund. I appreciate the fact we still exist. And happy to have played a small part in that.
I suspect this sentiment is shared by a lot of fans. We've had a lot of crap to put up with from our past owners and this season has been a welcome reprieve. I'm sure there's not been a big clambering for refunds but I think it's worth pointing out that we've overpaid with little to show for it.

Regarding the whole household watching, well that would be the same had we all paid a tenner for each match. Either way we've paid more for the privilege of holding a ST.

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by BWFC_Insane » Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:29 pm

Mar wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:08 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:56 pm
Worthy4England wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:28 pm
There is already legislation around what individuals can and can't say and where they can and can't say it. :-) This just seems to give more incumbency on Service Providers to not allow certain things to happen.

It's a buggers muddle of a White Paper. At one end of the spectrum, it seeks to protect from terrorism and child exploitation, which I suspect no one would take issue with, and at the other end, it brings in trolling and on-line abuse - which I similarly think people would believe is not ok, but then we get into that grey area - that you mention - of some people on an internet forum having a conversation around whether Player X is good/shite, that doesn't involve the person being discussed. I suspect at worst that might involve a code of conduct type breach and you would be requested to remove the offending post.
We all know the intent of the white paper. A government appointed regulator decides. That’s rarely well intentioned.

But the call for a boycott is directly aimed at the social media companies. If they sorted their houses out we’d not have the potential for sinister creep of government getting involved.
Do you honestly think that social media companies will take action based upon a football boycott?

I don't. If anything the next step would be for the football league to be pushing for actual legislation in which the bad intentions from government will come through. In my mind this only serves to push for government to creep into online regulation (see another cookie policy fiasco).

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Let's not lose sight of what would be lost should fresh legislation come into play.
Not as a one off thing but like anything if it builds up steam and spreads to other sports or other sectors and the pressure builds then why not?

The alternative is to do nothing and wait for the government to do whatever they deem is fit. Which happened with the 2019 white paper and subsequently proposed act.

I'm not sure that saying gestures aren't worth it because in reality they won't make any direct difference is reasonable, given gestures are all anyone can offer to try and pressure these companies to clean up their acts.

I'm sure in the 80's climate change activists were told ' do you really think anyone is going to listen?'. Well they're listening now.

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Mar » Wed Apr 28, 2021 4:59 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:29 pm
Mar wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:08 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:56 pm
Worthy4England wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:28 pm
There is already legislation around what individuals can and can't say and where they can and can't say it. :-) This just seems to give more incumbency on Service Providers to not allow certain things to happen.

It's a buggers muddle of a White Paper. At one end of the spectrum, it seeks to protect from terrorism and child exploitation, which I suspect no one would take issue with, and at the other end, it brings in trolling and on-line abuse - which I similarly think people would believe is not ok, but then we get into that grey area - that you mention - of some people on an internet forum having a conversation around whether Player X is good/shite, that doesn't involve the person being discussed. I suspect at worst that might involve a code of conduct type breach and you would be requested to remove the offending post.
We all know the intent of the white paper. A government appointed regulator decides. That’s rarely well intentioned.

But the call for a boycott is directly aimed at the social media companies. If they sorted their houses out we’d not have the potential for sinister creep of government getting involved.
Do you honestly think that social media companies will take action based upon a football boycott?

I don't. If anything the next step would be for the football league to be pushing for actual legislation in which the bad intentions from government will come through. In my mind this only serves to push for government to creep into online regulation (see another cookie policy fiasco).

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. Let's not lose sight of what would be lost should fresh legislation come into play.
Not as a one off thing but like anything if it builds up steam and spreads to other sports or other sectors and the pressure builds then why not?

The alternative is to do nothing and wait for the government to do whatever they deem is fit. Which happened with the 2019 white paper and subsequently proposed act.

I'm not sure that saying gestures aren't worth it because in reality they won't make any direct difference is reasonable, given gestures are all anyone can offer to try and pressure these companies to clean up their acts.

I'm sure in the 80's climate change activists were told ' do you really think anyone is going to listen?'. Well they're listening now.
I can see the point your trying to make and I agree that something should be done, preferably without government intervention. I do not believe that this stance would have the desired outcomes but I get that it'll help take a step towards drawing attention to the problem. I just believe that it'll just adversely affect the vast majority of sensible fans out there. It's punishing everyone instead of the few that are using racist and aggressive behaviour. Should government intervene and impose more regulations on what constitutes free speech then it's a slippery slope to removing freedoms.

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Harry Genshaw » Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:04 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 2:15 pm
Also I'll add IF we beat Exeter on Saturday I really honestly won't give a monkeys that Bolton Wanderers can't post on twitter about it I'll be too busy fretting about next season
Fixed that for you :wink:

Excellent post otherwise though :D
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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Mar » Thu Apr 29, 2021 12:00 pm

Might be coincidental but since my post the club have updated their sales lines and put up a message on the website about the 'wall of fame'. I'd like to think this is not a coincidence and, like the on field actions, the club have a finger on the pulse.

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Bruce Rioja » Sun May 02, 2021 5:16 pm

Had an email from the club saying that my contract with them is now finished/cancelled and that no further monies will be taken.

I've no idea what they have going on behind the scenes or with who, but clearly those of us who pay via DD can't just let this season roll into next this time.
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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sun May 02, 2021 5:44 pm

Bruce Rioja wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 5:16 pm
Had an email from the club saying that my contract with them is now finished/cancelled and that no further monies will be taken.

I've no idea what they have going on behind the scenes or with who, but clearly those of us who pay via DD can't just let this season roll into next this time.
Same. I’m fairly sure that all they’ve done is what they were always meant to do and officially stop the payments and communicate as such. In theory at least IF they choose to keep the scheme and use the same operator there is nothing to stop them doing automatic opt in again using the same details. However they didn’t do that last time did they?

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Re: Social Media Boycott, Ticket Pricing

Post by Bruce Rioja » Sun May 02, 2021 6:29 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 5:44 pm
Bruce Rioja wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 5:16 pm
Had an email from the club saying that my contract with them is now finished/cancelled and that no further monies will be taken.

I've no idea what they have going on behind the scenes or with who, but clearly those of us who pay via DD can't just let this season roll into next this time.
Same. I’m fairly sure that all they’ve done is what they were always meant to do and officially stop the payments and communicate as such. In theory at least IF they choose to keep the scheme and use the same operator there is nothing to stop them doing automatic opt in again using the same details. However they didn’t do that last time did they?
They didn't, but understandably the whole shebang needed setting up again from scratch ahead of this season.
I must say though, the communication from the club this season has been absolutely first class, so I guess this is more of that, although I do get the impression that they may be using someone else to collect monies due next term.
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