Deal or no deal? - Summer 2022 Transfer gossip!

[GhostoftheBok]

You've all got massively giddy too. He's a bottom half Championship player. I want him back, but only if we're confident he can get through a whole season or the money means we can have top quality competition. My first phone call this summer would be Kane Wilson over Fossey.

The other thing with Marlon is he brings most value as a wing back (I think he'd be a good full back but would have less of an effect). But if you play with wing-backs they're one of the most important positions, and as we're painfully re-learning, it's not a position you can just bung someone. So you're kind of building your team around him. Which is an issue if his knee goes again.

To apply the Rioja formula, it's not 20 games of Marlon OR 40 of Gordon, it's 20 of Marlon and consequently 26 of Gordon because Marlon is injured and you had no budget for a back up.

I'd happily take Kane Wilson and yeah, would do so over Fossey over concerns about Marlon's knee.

FGR have a couple I think would be good additions.

Wilson and Cadden would both fit and are on frees. No idea what their wage demands would look like after good seasons, but in both cases Bolton would be a massive move for them - though Wilson may get 'massiver' offers.

[BWFC_Insane]

Insane. You've just said a medical does a risk assessment. Which is exactly an assessment of there being a greater than average risk of injury or not.

I feel like you're arguing with yourself at this stage, rather than anything I've said.

It’s not really a predictive risk is the point I’m making. It’s about quantifying existing risk.

Although it may be used in a predictive way it’s not really what it’s intended for. And the point is not about Fossey at all. In general it’s very hard to predict in a sport like football. Not least because knee injuries tend to be contact or contact or situation induced or whatever.

Hamstrings or repeated soft tissue strains can be down to a particular running style. Knees not so much. The thing with any player will be the extent of damage and what recovery is possible. But you can’t predict whether one is more pre disposed to getting another knee injury over another in contact sport.

[BWFC_Insane]

I don’t think any of us know the situation on Marlon or what the injuries even were in detail beyond the one here. So I’d leave that to the experts with the scans and whatever.

Whilst we don't know what the three injuries were in detail as you say, it's not like they were ingrowing toe nail, vaginal warts and a stiff neck. We know they were all associated with the same knee? Of course no one on here could say "don't sign him" with any degree of certainty, like no one could say "sign him whatever, no debate" for the same reason. They couldn't say that if he had no injuries, because we don't know the fee and personal terms he might want either or even if a perm move to us is something he's after.

I'm sure we'd all love the 46 game a year Fossey on terms whereby Fulham paid us to take him and we sell him in 3 years coz he's not quite PL. I would also be looking at other possible candidates (as I'm sure indeed they will be)

You seem to think I’m arguing we sign him. I’m saying it’s down to the medical experts to make that determination if it comes to it. Certainly not to me. And if they say it’s a no go then it’s sad but obviously we will have to just move on.

I certainly don’t want an injured player. It will then be a case of finding those qualities in other players we bring in. Because our biggest weakness is balance in the sorts we have and that is sticking out like a sore thumb. I don’t care if it’s Fossey or a another so long as they are capable of doing the things required.

[GhostoftheBok]

If we sign Fossey I will be delighted. I have concerns over his fitness and I feel those are justified, but he's a talented player and the club will have a much better handle on the details of his injury issues than I do.

If we don't sign him I will put it entirely on his fitness and pretend it can only be a good thing not to sign a sicknote.

Either way I get to feel good about it.

Fossey's level will be the minimum we aim for for those key positions we've talked about. If we can do the work we hope to then next season will be fun. Fossey (or similar level RWB), right centre back, 'keeper and a midfielder at a high level would make us competitive at the top end of the table.

I think that if Evatt wants to win the league he'll want a special centre forward. We have good forwards right now, but I think we'll still be in the market for something that elevates the entire team. A genuine terror.

[BWFC_Insane]

If we sign Fossey I will be delighted. I have concerns over his fitness and I feel those are justified, but he's a talented player and the club will have a much better handle on the details of his injury issues than I do.

If we don't sign him I will put it entirely on his fitness and pretend it can only be a good thing not to sign a sicknote.

Either way I get to feel good about it.

Fossey's level will be the minimum we aim for for those key positions we've talked about. If we can do the work we hope to then next season will be fun. Fossey (or similar level RWB), right centre back, 'keeper and a midfielder at a high level would make us competitive at the top end of the table.

I think that if Evatt wants to win the league he'll want a special centre forward. We have good forwards right now, but I think we'll still be in the market for something that elevates the entire team. A genuine terror.

If we want to win the league, and I think that’s a good aim then we don’t want to be playing Johnston.

We need to decide on a system. If we aren’t signing Fossey then reverting to a back four makes sense in the context of then needing a RB to cover Jones or to improve on him.

Rather than needing two RWBs and another LWB which are specialist positions.

Up front is an interesting one. If we are playing two up there we are probably sorted. If we go four at the back and it’s a 4123 or whatever then I’m not sure we’ve got one good enough all round to be the main man.

[GhostoftheBok]

System doesn't really matter to me, but I'm fairly sure Evatt's work over the summer will focus on being able to play that hybrid 5-3-2 4-3-3 he's been talking about for nearly 2 years.

John on the left being matched up with a really attacking wing back/winger to challenge him for that slot in the 5-3-2, whilst Johnston can compete for leftback in the 4-3-3, is probably where we will head. Same goes on the right, with a Fossey-sort competing with Izzy in the 5, but with Jones in the 4.

I think Johnston is a good player on the left of the three and I'm fine with him playing the majority of games there. Evatt thinks he's a top Championship defender in the making and will thus back him, as he's also an investment that the board will expect to make money on later.

If Santos stays, as I've said before, we all know he's now first name on the teamsheet for Evatt. The "best defender outside the Premier League" will start every game he is fit for. I think we'll then add another centre back who can play on the right of the three who would probably also partner Santos in a 4, plus a left-footed centre back if we can find one.

That's my view of it, anyway, a squad where every player has a role in either system, if needed.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

It's an interesting conundrum. I can see BWFCi's point that we don't want to recruit for a system we might abandon, but I also think Evatt wants the flexibility to change mid-game not just mid-season. That requires flexible players and it's one reason I think we'll not be trying to move on Isgrove, who works both as a cover RWB and as a RW (probably cover or sub).

The question that brings up is whether a back four reading Geth-NewLad-Santos-Johnston would be attacking enough. I guess Gethin will be happy to overlap if allowed, and Johnston has proved he's mobile. And if we're playing a back four against a lesser team, we could play the less defensively adept Declan and Fossey (or similar RWB) there.

The worry, especially after this season, is still injuries: if we're rolling along with (say) Dec and Fossey as wingbacks and one or both get injured, which would hardly be a surprise, are we forced to abandon the system? Then again, if we *can* change system, is it worth trying to recruit a back-up who (1) only works in one system and (2) would weaken the team anyway, as a round peg but of lower quality? The answer to that is unknowable, but it seems to come back to how well we manage that flexibility.

[GhostoftheBok]

The worry, especially after this season, is still injuries: if we're rolling along with (say) Dec and Fossey as wingbacks and one or both get injured, which would hardly be a surprise, are we forced to abandon the system?

The issue right now with the 5-3-2 isn't that Fossey is injured, it's that Fossey is injured at the same time as Izzy. Its further that Fossey and Izzy are injured when Evatt clearly doesn't want to put Baps in an 11 and Aimson doesn't offer the same threat as a wide centre back as Jones, who is the third cover for that wing back slot on the right. I think better squad depth cures a lot of those potential ills and delivers the redundancy we currently lack due to being one CB short on paper and two in reality (as we don't play Baps). We are also, in reality, one LB/LWB short as Evatt no longer seems to have any interest in playing Gordon. We are limping along now 3 defenders short before we factor in injuries, leaves of absence etc.

The system we play right now is almost always somewhere between a 4-3-3 and 5-3-2 anyway. So we need "odd" sorts of players anyway. Players who have fallen through the cracks because they're not quite any position. MJ Williams is a CB, only he isn't, but he's also not really a midfielder...but he very much is a holding player in our 4-3-3. John isn't quite a left back and isn't quite a left winger, so the fact we need a LWB or super-attacking left back works.

We need wonky players.

[GhostoftheBok]

The question that brings up is whether a back four reading Geth-NewLad-Santos-Johnston would be attacking enough.

On this one, probably not; but we typically are a bit asymmetric in our 4-4-2 when we play it. So we'd likely want John on the left of that four, or Fossey on the right of it - meaning one of them really bombs on and the other tucks in a bit to act as a third CB who can under/overlap as needed.

Again, Wonky.

[Jim_McDonuts]

Again, Wonky.

Oh, Wonky Wonky...

[Mar]

Rico looking likely to be out for the rest of the season. The cynic in me thinks that this is down to a transfer deal or big money move in the pipeline. I think Rico's probably done enough to get a transfer elsewhere and I can't imagine that Bolton, Santos or another club would want that risked by him partaking in the rest of the season.

On the flip side of the coin he might genuinely be injured.
I hope he stays on at the club. Been a great servant so far and definitely looks like a good baseline for success going forward.

He's massively stood out for us and I suspect he'll be in for a Prem move as a competent backup player. Heck I think he's a lot better than Ream and he managed to get to the Premiership.

[GhostoftheBok]

Rico looking likely to be out for the rest of the season. The cynic in me thinks that this is down to a transfer deal or big money move in the pipeline. I think Rico's probably done enough to get a transfer elsewhere and I can't imagine that Bolton, Santos or another club would want that risked by him partaking in the rest of the season.

I'm a bit lost on this one, depending on what you're saying. Are you saying they entirely faked the injury, or that they're fudging the extent of it to wrap him in cotton wool?

The former seems a bit odd, given him coming off in the middle of a game. The latter is possible, now we have not much to play for.

[Mar]

Rico looking likely to be out for the rest of the season. The cynic in me thinks that this is down to a transfer deal or big money move in the pipeline. I think Rico's probably done enough to get a transfer elsewhere and I can't imagine that Bolton, Santos or another club would want that risked by him partaking in the rest of the season.

I'm a bit lost on this one, depending on what you're saying. Are you saying they entirely faked the injury, or that they're fudging the extent of it to wrap him in cotton wool?

The former seems a bit odd, given him coming off in the middle of a game. The latter is possible, now we have not much to play for.

I don't think they would fake the injury, especially not midgame. I suspect that they are protecting their saleable asset till the deal goes through given that our season is essentially over.

No point risking him if there's millions of pounds in play and blaming it on an injury seems like a way of not upsetting the fans. Just sensible business practice to be honest and something i'd expect the club to be doing if we were put in that situation.

There's not many times where we've had the opposite happen once we've agreed a sale, the only one that springs to mind is when Cahill had his Chelsea deal done and still played for us before making the big money move.

[BWFC_Insane]

He has a hamstring injury. That in most cases would mean end of season anyway at this stage.

No conspiracy stuff needed.

[The_Gun]

Yeah, I doubt there's more to that one than what Evatt's come out with. Unless Santos has already told the club that he won't be signing a new deal then it seems unlikely the club would already be preparing to sell him.

[GhostoftheBok]

He has a hamstring injury. That in most cases would mean end of season anyway at this stage.

No conspiracy stuff needed.

I tend to agree with this position.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Interesting words from Evatt on Fossey, Trafford and loanees.
https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/2 ... -trafford/

The best thing I can say about James, and I mean this in the best possible way, is that we haven’t noticed him. We haven’t noticed him because he has not made any glaring errors and he has not been overworked, which is a good sign for how our team is functioning. On Tuesday, he was relatively busy but did not really make any saves that he wasn’t entitled to make.

We are delighted with him, we think he has done really well. He has got a level head on those shoulders and you need it to be a goalkeeper, especially at Manchester City. He is progressing all the time. He is a confident young man and he believes in himself, which is great. He has got a bright future.

The good thing is that these players have had positive experiences here and they have enjoyed themselves. The parent clubs are happy with how we have treated them and how the fans have responded to them, how they are coached. We are gaining that reputation now. There are conversations happening all the time – the big Category One teams, especially in the North West. I think they have all been very impressed with what we are doing. That is something to look forward to for the future, maybe some relationships there. But we are in constant dialogue with everyone involved – Traff, Man City – and will make the best decision we can.

I think we are gaining a reputation for number one, looking after our players and their wellbeing, mentally and physically. But also technically and tactically, we coach them well. The way we play helps. We need to utilise the loan market smartly. It is not all about getting loads of loan players in, we want to build our own. We want to have assets on the football pitch that belong to us and develop those. But they can help, and they have helped in the last couple of years. It is about being smart with our decision-making and making sure we make the right ones.

The bit about Trafford is pitched as Evatt being "keen to get him back next season" but that doesn't sing out to me. I dare say we're sounding him out – and if they release him we'd be daft not to consider it. But "we will make the best decision we can" and (much as he hedges it) not making "any saves he wasn't entitled to make" are both unusually careful for Evatt. I wonder if he's pondering Bazunu, who excelled again today for Pompey (saving 6 of 7 on-target efforts). City may have a bigger stage in mind for him next season but I do wonder.

[GhostoftheBok]

Were Trafford our youth product then he'd be nailed on to start next season and we'd all be amazed that we'd produced a keeper who was that far along at his age. The fact Evatt specifically mentions getting our own assets on the pitch is very important, I think.

Trafford has had a good time here. He's been better than I expected. He will likely be better next season than he has been this. If we loaned him again I'd be okay with it, but I'd like us to explore our options. If we could end up owning him either in the summer or at the end of the loan then I'd also take him very gladly, as I think he'd be a valuable asset after a season or two.

For me, a loan player needs to be much better than anything you could get on a permanent deal. I'm not sure Trafford is that yet.

[officer_dibble]

I certainly think he’s learnt from last summer - arguably we needed to improve on a lot of players he kept around. We need the best players we can get, not the ones we have had before who are good lads or whatever.

[DJBlu]

Highlight of the day is getting blocked by Marc Iles on twitter for saying his autocorrect had replaced shite with scattergun.