A switch of the (h) Ips and we're gone..Home V THE Tractor Boys Sat 11th Mar. 3-0'clock

[boltonboris]

I would like to think he'd take N'Lundulu's spot next season, if he can offer as much as he has previously for us.. Other side of 30 on a bad injury though... It's certainly a risk

Also gives us the flexibility to sell Charles if we got a big offer from the Championship (should we not be promoted)

[BWFC_Insane]

I would like to think he'd take N'Lundulu's spot next season, if he can offer as much as he has previously for us.. Other side of 30 on a bad injury though... It's certainly a risk

Also gives us the flexibility to sell Charles if we got a big offer from the Championship (should we not be promoted)

Yeah its a risk but I've not seen us likely to improve on him and certainly haven't as of yet.

I don't see Charles in the championship. Maybe I'm being harsh but the lad has an insane engine, never stops working but I don't think the quality is there for the level up in either movement or on the ball. And whilst he's our top scorer - I'd question the number of chances he takes to score. Not that there is any doubt of his suitability for us right now. He's first or second name on any teamsheet. But I'm not seeing him in the league above - however, teams get desperate and launch money at lots of players so its possible someone would offer a decent wedge - that much is true.

[GhostoftheBok]

GK: [*2]
CB: Toal, Santos, Johnstone, Iredale [+2]
WB: Jones, Williams [+2]
CM: Morley, Dempsey, Lee, Thomason [+2]
Cf: Charles, Ade, Jerome [+1]

Obvs you might pick Jones at CB and need one more WB, or Iredale at WB and one more CB. But that's where I am on numbers.

I waffled again.

Basically I agree with you.

We have a quality base in most areas that will allow us to be quite selective, but we also need numbers. The question will be where we spend and where we look for "value."

We need to add some more youth, but also some more experience. We need more class, but we don't have the budget to add it everywhere. Interesting balancing act.

The '10' will make or break us.

[GhostoftheBok]

All the players we've signed to play Bod's position have had availability issues, so I'm not sure we can judge yet.

As I said above, it'll be the other recruitment that will decided whether we've got enough up top.

If the rest of the team is making enough chances we have enough up there to be at the top end. If not, we need a special player to make us a special team. That special player could be a 9 or a 10, but if we can't sort the flanks and midfield then someone in that final third has to be capable of the sublime.

Ideally, obviously, we get a special attacker AND the team functions smoothly. Then we win the league.

[Bertie Wooster]

All the players we've signed to play Bod's position have had availability issues, so I'm not sure we can judge yet.

As I said above, it'll be the other recruitment that will decided whether we've got enough up top.

If the rest of the team is making enough chances we have enough up there to be at the top end. If not, we need a special player to make us a special team. That special player could be a 9 or a 10, but if we can't sort the flanks and midfield then someone in that final third has to be capable of the sublime.

Ideally, obviously, we get a special attacker AND the team functions smoothly. Then we win the league.

Surely this 'special attacker' or 'special player' would cost decent money, money that you have said we haven't got.

[BWFC_Insane]

All the players we've signed to play Bod's position have had availability issues, so I'm not sure we can judge yet.

As I said above, it'll be the other recruitment that will decided whether we've got enough up top.

If the rest of the team is making enough chances we have enough up there to be at the top end. If not, we need a special player to make us a special team. That special player could be a 9 or a 10, but if we can't sort the flanks and midfield then someone in that final third has to be capable of the sublime.

Ideally, obviously, we get a special attacker AND the team functions smoothly. Then we win the league.

Surely this 'special attacker' or 'special player' would cost decent money, money that you have said we haven't got.

Our budget is top 8 and probably top 6 of this league (it depends how you examine in - total play expenditure, mean wage or highest wage). What we're not going to be able to compete with is the likes of Ipswich throwing silly money at it (nor should we) and relegated championship sides. There will always be 3 teams with higher budgets than us (some of that may be tied up in existing contracts but still you expect those to be good players for this level) and maybe 1 or two like Sunderland or Ipswich chucking money at it or just with very large crowd based turnovers to chuck at it.

That's the reality. I don't think its much different that we've had any point in history except that this league is absolutely as Worthy says beginning to split out into the have's and have nots which drives up the top end points totals. Leaving much less margin for error.

The bottom line is that I don't think we're way short on resources required. What we may be short on is the ability to always get the ready made, ready to go, best in class options that perhaps one or two teams per year can. It doesn't always mean they are successful but it does tend to mean we need to find some alternative solutions.

You also look at it - Adeboyejo cost £500K or thereabouts. He's on 13 goals this season and I don't think many were saying 'nah don't sign him'. But was the money for a player being chased a level up too - was it worth it? Right now you'd have to say there is a question mark there. I think one of the problems as Ipswich have found out over the last few seasons is if you get it slightly wrong down here there isn't enough margin to easily compensate. And the margins are smaller the further down the 'resource table' you go.


I'd like to see more signings like Toal which I suspect is where Evatt will go - exploit markets (and much of Europe is now impossible to exploit thanks to Brexit) where we can find bargains who overperform. There are sadly few English league players who you will sign for a bargain who overperform on the investment - beyond the competitive free transfer market.

[GhostoftheBok]

Surely this 'special attacker' or 'special player' would cost decent money, money that you have said we haven't got.

Not necessarily. Where you lack money you need time to identify the right player and get into the right position. We've been monitoring players for a while, trying to find the right type within budget. We thought maybe it was Assal, but couldn't afford him. We'll not have stopped looking.

This summer is the best chance we've had. We may or may not manage it. On the other hand, Evatt may feel it's Shola. The kid is clearly very good and Evatt raved about him. Maybe he thinks Utd will let him stay and with half a season and then a pre-season under him he'll fly.

Other options would include someone like Ben Woodburn, whose career has fallen off a cliff since being seen as the player who was going to make Wales a force after Bale retired and become a firm part of the Liverpool first team. He's currently failing to make an impact at Preston, but everyone I know who has worked with him remains convinced he can be at least a top Championship player. He's likely to be on a free in the summer, along with quite a few others.

This summer is about which club gets it right. There's a lot of talent available and everyone will feel they have a chance to make strides. Someone's going to hit the jackpot and I'd say Markham has as good a shot as anyone. Anyone we sign is likely to be a risk, but hopefully a properly calculated one.

[GhostoftheBok]

You also look at it - Adeboyejo cost £500K or thereabouts. He's on 13 goals this season and I don't think many were saying 'nah don't sign him'. But was the money for a player being chased a level up too - was it worth it? Right now you'd have to say there is a question mark there.

We didn't spend 500k based on what he's do until the end of this season. He's signed a 3 /12 year deal and we've spent the money based on what we think he'll do over those 4 season.

[BWFC_Insane]

You also look at it - Adeboyejo cost £500K or thereabouts. He's on 13 goals this season and I don't think many were saying 'nah don't sign him'. But was the money for a player being chased a level up too - was it worth it? Right now you'd have to say there is a question mark there.

We didn't spend 500k based on what he's do until the end of this season. He's signed a 3 /12 year deal and we've spent the money based on what we think he'll do over those 4 season.

Yeah sure. I'm not saying he won't be. I just said 'right now there is a question mark'.

[Prufrock]

My issue with Bod is the wages. Always sus but the rumblings were he was one of our top earners. I like him, but wrong side of 30, no resale value, off the back of a bad injury. It's a gamble. He might be willing to come down some, there was partly a premium buying out his Champo wages, and you'd think he's taking a pay cut no matter what.

Ultimately without inside info we don't know, but I think he'll go. Especially given we have Jerome next year as well. Nlundlu hasn't impressed me at all yet, but it's still early days. I think we'll be planning for Charles and Ade to be the two with Jerome +1 as the back up, unless something special is available. These things are never in isolation. Depends what's happening elsewhere. If we can't get what we need at 10 say and have to muddle that, there might be budget for the shiny striker.

But I agree with Ghost that 10 is what will babe or break us, and I'd rather we got the right player there and took more of a gamble on the 4th striker.

[GhostoftheBok]

Yeah sure. I'm not saying he won't be. I just said 'right now there is a question mark'.

Well, yeah. We're half a dozen games into his Bolton career.

[GhostoftheBok]

Ultimately without inside info we don't know, but I think he'll go. Especially given we have Jerome next year as well. Nlundlu hasn't impressed me at all yet, but it's still early days. I think we'll be planning for Charles and Ade to be the two with Jerome +1 as the back up, unless something special is available. These things are never in isolation. Depends what's happening elsewhere. If we can't get what we need at 10 say and have to muddle that, there might be budget for the shiny striker.

But I agree with Ghost that 10 is what will babe or break us, and I'd rather we got the right player there and took more of a gamble on the 4th striker.

As Insane points out, though, we spent 500k in Vik and he'll be "the plan" next to Dion. We don't spend that kind of money and then not give that player a main role - not unless something has gone wrong.

Vik is the shiny striker, you'd imagine - at least in terms of raw investment.

The obvious place to invest next is '10', as we've said. I know it's a cliche, but if you have limited funds you tend to throw them at the attack and then muddle through the rest.

Charles 300k, Vik 500k...thems the main men.

[GhostoftheBok]

Quick visual aid to where we stand with retained players for next season...

Screenshot 2023-03-13 160627.png (48.38 KiB) Viewed 793 times

[TANGODANCER]

Dadi Bodvardson?

[GhostoftheBok]

Dadi Bodvardson?

Bod's deal expires in the summer. I've also not included Nlundulu, who is slated to stay past the summer if reports in the South are to be believed - though there's no deal worked out, according to Marc Iles. We'd also probably like to move John on.

I've just included players we know are currently under contract past the summer. And misspelt Johnston's name.

[Worthy4England]

Yeah sure. I'm not saying he won't be. I just said 'right now there is a question mark'.

Well, yeah. We're half a dozen games into his Bolton career.

I'd think the question mark is can we get him scoring for us, rather than can he score, because we know this season he's bagged a few...

[GhostoftheBok]

I'd think the question mark is can we get him scoring for us, rather than can he score, because we know this season he's bagged a few...

I mean if he'd come in and scored 3 or 4 goals there'd still be a question mark over whether he was worth 500k of a limited budget.

Any player who has played that few games is an unknown.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Interesting Iles piece on the press, etc, using Evatt's postmatch Ipswich quotes.

https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/2 ... ing-curve/

Most eyebrow-raising thing:
"We lost one of our technical analysts to Ipswich in the summer and he pretty much has the blueprint to everything we do; one of their players said to him after the game ‘you were man of the match this week.’"

But plenty of Evatt-quoted detail in there about our tactics – one might argue too much detail; in explaining himself he's not just showing his hand, which would be simple to scout, but what the next phase is.

The plan on Saturday was to press high but to allow the ball to the wider areas – either our wide centre-backs or wing-backs – and their full-backs would jump to create space down the side of the centre-backs. But to create that space you have to be very brave to trigger the press, invite bodies on to you, then to play behind.

I think on Saturday we became nervous with our play, the crowd then became nervous as well, but there is always a method in the madness. This isn’t vanity – we don’t play sideways passes because we want to be the best possession team with the best possession stats, we are doing it to affect the opposition in some way. It might be to fatigue the opposition in some way, or perhaps to trigger presses and create space, so we can then play into it.

All these things we think and talk about. Football is a detailed game. This isn’t about having great possession stats because you can have the best every single week and still lose games. It is having possession with a purpose.

Sometimes it is about recycling the ball and I actually think the last few weeks we have not dominated the ball as I’d like to have done. We have become a bit transitional, and I think we need to get back to dominating the ball and tiring out opposition.

Much more via the link. Worth a peep for anyone discussing the team's tactics.
https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/sport/2 ... ing-curve/

[BWFC_Insane]

^^ Yeah I saw that. I think the problem I have with it all is firstly - a lot is made of 'we do this to create, X-Y-Z or effect X' fine. But I'm not sure it works out like that too often. I can see what we were trying to do against Ipswich. And the players played to instruction obviously given the number of utterly atrocious passes down that channel Evatt describes. The bottom line is we weren't good enough to do it OR it wasn't an effective plan.

I wonder sometimes whether part of the issue is these sorts of 'gameplans' against teams being too clever for the players we have. You know the teams that I've watched that are successful usually have relatively simple plans that don't change game on game. This is how we play, how we build pressure, create chances, react off the ball etc...and yes they tweak stuff - don't show X inside etc or play in these areas as they are vulnerable to this. But it feels like we are trying to do something specific each match that might work or not that we might be capable of doing or not.

And I think this is where the lack of a consistent plan to score a goal really comes back. Whether its POMO or tiki taka isn't really relevant. The best sides know how they will gain territorial pressure and then their best options to convert that into a goal. We seemingly have a different approach game on game. I'm sure Man City do that and have quality to manage most of that. But I do wonder about the idea of imposing yourself on the opposition first and foremost.

Comes back to maybe playing Jones LWB. We were trying to do something that clearly did not work and maybe overthought it. I remember Allardyce talking about early days trying to be too reactive to opponents and not focussing enough on what we did. There is a balance to all this. You can't say every game is the same. But I think the best sides aren't game by game massively changing their patterns of play (and I know some people are going to claim otherwise but I watch Man City, Arsenal and I don't see them one game trying to hit long diagonals, the next playing out from their box down the channels and the next asking Ederson to go long etc...).

Are we just trying to be too clever, too reactive to opponents with players who might do better just let of a leash and times and free to go and impose our game on teams - within reason - and within the bounds of sensible preparation?