creeeeeeeekeeeeeet

[TANGODANCER]

No point stressing how critical next test is, but Joe, Root, Ben Stokes and a couple of others with the bat have got to reproduce top form if we want a chance to take us to Test 5. We edged this one today, not won it emphatically, and it took unlikely heroes to do it. Oz know a draw will do for them to keep the Ashes, and only a win will work for us. Some of our suicide shots were straight out of the Loony Tunes manual of schoolboy cricket and the perpetrators must surely know it, so get the videos played lads and remember who you are...The Oz bowlers were good, but it was our badness that made it such hard work. Jonny Bairstowe.? I'm torn between what he can do, and what he does...or doesn't?

[BWFC_Insane]

No point stressing how critical next test is, but Joe, Root, Ben Stokes and a couple of others with the bat have got to reproduce top form if we want a chance to take us to Test 5. We edged this one today, not won it emphatically, and it took unlikely heroes to do it. Oz know a draw will do for them to keep the Ashes, and only a win will work for us. Some of our suicide shots were straight out of the Loony Tunes manual of schoolboy cricket and the perpetrators must surely know it, so get the videos played lads and remember who you are...The Oz bowlers were good, but it was our badness that made it such hard work. Jonny Bairstowe.? I'm torn between what he can do, and what he does...or doesn't?

In fairness I'd say the only difference between the two sides has been Cummins and Starc's extra pace and Lyon's ability when fit.

I think you can say the two styles (Australia bat carefully and slowly we try and score quickly) aren't that relevant in the results. Its the quality of bowling where they have had just a few extra mph on ours and Lyon being the best spinner around at the minute that has meant its 2-1 them not us.

I'm not sure England can 'not make mistakes' and when Boland is on for example you could see how without one of Cummins and Starc I reckon we'd smash them. The extra pace allied to high skill bowling is enough to mean we are going to always be vulnerable. But I don't think its much different if we didn't play shots - I don't think our defences are good enough to see off these bowlers just prodding it round.

They are 'suicide shots' rather than amazing fours merely because their bowling has been so good. The thing is that the Aussies went nowhere in their second innings trying to play cautiously and end result was the same. They all got out. Indeed Head who went aggressive did best for them.

I think Wood has massively helped us and hopefully he can repeat his first innings spell (hopefully because as he said he has struggled to swing it like that in the past which is key). But I don't think we'll not have suicide shots. I don't think we'll change much other than Jimmy for Robinson. Its what we are. I don't think we can change here - cut out 'loose shots' is easy to say but they are always going to take on the drive. There is a narrow margin between a glorious cover drive and 'recklessness'.

The most frustrating one is Crawley who I think technically has an issue with length and probably needs some work because his game looks so good, then he gets out. But he gets out driving on the up and it comes down to his judgement of length.

The rest are, at this point, what they are.

[Worthy4England]

It's interesting conversation, because I would say the same thing. And it certainly plays into the narrow margins conversation.

If I weigh Broad/Robinson (our 2 highest wicket takers) v Cummins and Starc, their two highest wickets takers (bearing in mind another game for Wood or Woakes like the one they've just had would displace Robinson). Cumming / Starc taken 28 for 709 Broad / Robinson (obvs didn't bowl second innings) taken 26 for 683. That gives 25.3 v 26.3 as averages, but it certainly feels like Broad Robinson is less worrisome than Cummins Starc.

Lyon still a difference, even though he only played a game and a half...he grabbed 9/264 - Mo's on 5 / 278.

Overall, I think it's still very fine margins, you could see a route to us winning both the first and second tests - certainly not beyond the bounds - equally, they could've won the third.

Then we come on to Wood / Woakes. 13 for 241 between them.... So who knows where we could land in the next two. C'mon you England!

[Prufrock]

Aye, I'm team fine margins too. They're the slightly better side with the extra pace in the bowling attack, we're at home and have had the better of the conditions. But either team could easily have won any of the three tests. It's been a fantastic series so far.

[Worthy4England]

No change to the squad, meaning Jonny is retained - they must've given some thought to WK...The good news I guess is that three of the bowlers pick themselves, so only a decision to make on Jimmy (as Robinson is expected to be fit).

Number three. There's a thing. Wouldn't be entirely surprised to see Moeen retain 3.

[BWFC_Insane]

No change to the squad, meaning Jonny is retained - they must've given some thought to WK...The good news I guess is that three of the bowlers pick themselves, so only a decision to make on Jimmy (as Robinson is expected to be fit).

Number three. There's a thing. Wouldn't be entirely surprised to see Moeen retain 3.

I'll be amazed if Robinson plays. For me its whether Jimmy or Tongue get the nod. And yes I know...the stats say he's done ok but I feel he's too slow. And frankly his back spasm could reoccur. Too big a risk. Jimmy for me. At his home ground. I think Jimmy, Broad, Woakes and Wood feels pretty balanced. Though admittedly the pace of that track and potential true nature means there is an argument for Tongue.

[jimbo]

Anderson for Robinson for me. (I would have probably gone for Foakes over Bairstow but that’s not happening)

[TANGODANCER]

I don't think previous format or set rules will apply here.

This isn't about just winning a game. The Ashes is massive in terms of England v Australia on the surface, but much more in tradition and almost honour for what is reality wise a small terracotta vase (urn) with uncertain ashes content.

A relevant fact is that Oz only need the draw to retain the series. I'm not sure putting Moheen in at three is a good idea because it's chancy given that what we really need is for our openers to show form. Jimmy taking wickets in a big yes, but that's what we need him doing as he's no Luke Skywalker with a light sabre . Part of me wants us to bat first, part doesn't, but it's all nothing more then opinions so ,as ever, Que Sera.

[Worthy4England]

Oh I'm very not sure about putting Mo at three either, just something Stokes said after Headingly. Sounded like there was some "thinking" done after first innings, sound like they wanted to move Brook back to 5 and Mo put his hand up...

[Prufrock]

Yeah, Mo said he wanted to do it, and they admired the bravery. The issue was he isn't good enough though.

There are no ideal options, but Root there the last worst for me. Obviously he's me comfortable there and averages more, but the fact he's at "4" isn't going to make any difference if Mo is only going to last an over and a half.

[MattySlug]

Texas - Los Angeles on now on game one of Major League Cricket!!!

[jimbo]

Anderson for Robinson for me. (I would have probably gone for Foakes over Bairstow but that’s not happening)

Confirmed as the only change. Moeen to bat at 3.I’m 34, and still younger than the average age of our bowling attack!

[BWFC_Insane]

Anderson for Robinson for me. (I would have probably gone for Foakes over Bairstow but that’s not happening)

Confirmed as the only change. Moeen to bat at 3.I’m 34, and still younger than the average age of our bowling attack!

I think that is the right call on both counts. Jimmy if he finds form will be the difference. Big IF but I don't really see Tongue and Wood in the same attack right now as both would need managing for shorter spells.

Moeen is no number 3 but I think he's less of an issue there than any other option. Stokes clearly doesn't want to go there. Root we know hates it. Losing Root or Stokes early is a massive loss to our innings whereas if Moeen can go in and get a few it helps the likes of Root and Stokes down the order but if he fails then those players haven't really lost too much and will just have to try and rebuild as they would be doing anyway.

[Worthy4England]

I'm not sure how fully match fit Jimmy was in the early matches - Not against him coming in, hope he can get some class to edge through his recent form..

Also not against Mo batting three. It felt fairly obvious Brook isn't a three, and whilst I think either Root or Stokes (or maybe even Bairstow could all give it a go, it seems pragmatic to see if Mo can tie up some overs...

[BWFC_Insane]

I'm not sure how fully match fit Jimmy was in the early matches - Not against him coming in, hope he can get some class to edge through his recent form..

Also not against Mo batting three. It felt fairly obvious Brook isn't a three, and whilst I think either Root or Stokes (or maybe even Bairstow could all give it a go, it seems pragmatic to see if Mo can tie up some overs...

Way I see it is that we're simply giving our middle order (which is our batting strength) a chance of coming in slightly later against a slightly older ball rather than bumping them all one up and probably denying that chance. And harsh as it sounds Mo is a bit of an expendable there. If he survives 20 balls that's probably 5 or 6 overs used up against the opening bowlers before Root has to do his thing.

[Worthy4England]

For sure - that's precisely it. Shield some players who might make better advantage of old ball...Weather may well play a part in this one.

[jimbo]

Joe Denly’s ears have pricked up at the mention of us needing someone to occupy time at number 3 and bowl a bit of spin!

[Worthy4England]

Some strange things in the Mo, camp! Medihoney!

"I got home after the Edgbaston Test and a few days later I got a letter from a lady who said her husband is a big fan of mine," Moeen explained.

"They were watching and saw the gash on my finger and thought the Medihoney would really help me. I tried it and it really healed my finger straight away.

"It's amazing that someone had written to me about this. The only thing I'm really gutted about - I put the letter on the table in my house thinking after the series I will reply, now I can't find the letter."

[BWFC_Insane]

Looking at the weather forecast - Saturday and Sunday currently look washouts. Saturday particularly. Friday also looks like there could be some time lost too. Lets assume the time lost Friday and any surprise on Sunday that allows more play will at best mean this is a three day match.

So England in reality have to find a way to win in 3 days and the Aussies have cunningly strengthened their batting to make that very hard.

Frankly only viable way I see here is England win the toss put em in and get them gone today for less than 200.

If England have to bat first its going to be very very hard to engineer a win unless the forecasts are wildly out.

[TANGODANCER]

Jimmy v The Oz to start. At em James... At least here in Bolton we'll know what the weather's like at Old Trafford.