The Politics Thread

[William the White]

OOh, left libertarian, just past Gandhi.

Interesting little game. Do I have to wear flip-flops now?

I was placed further to the left than gandhi - and more of a libertarian.

that gandhi, petty-bougeois liberal reformist...

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

'Economic justice' isn't a bad thing in itself - amongst other things it means different things to different people.

I was just looking for a shorthand way to describe things I have read from Obama that make me suspect that he's about as left wing as it gets in American politics

Which isn't normally very left wing by anyone elses standards, usually - sort of left of, right of centre. I'm not expecting big levels of support from China on the grounds they're ideological bedfellows.

Sure, he's no communist.

Look, the fact is that nobody really knows what Obama's current set of political beliefs consists of, and that's exactly my point.

I have my suspicions based on past associations and reading things into what he has said and written, and I am happy to let other people have theirs.

If we were talking about a man with any kind of political career behind him, perhaps there would be less need for this discussion.

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

Maybe we should email him this and ask where he ends up?

http://www.politicalcompass.org/test

[email protected]

Well, believe or not, that test has me almost exactly in the centre (0.5 to the right) and more libertarian (2.36) than authoritarian.

Not a great test though - the first question, for example, seems to assume that TNCs and humanity are entirely separate things, which they are not.

[communistworkethic]

don't know if this is a shock or not... 4.75 left and 2.25 libertarian, putting me only marginaly to the right of the Ghandi or Nelson Mandela

[Lord Kangana]

I dunno, I think its pretty accurate myself....its got Thatcher nailed on as being practically off-the-scale right authoritarion

[Worthy4England]

'Economic justice' isn't a bad thing in itself - amongst other things it means different things to different people.

I was just looking for a shorthand way to describe things I have read from Obama that make me suspect that he's about as left wing as it gets in American politics

Which isn't normally very left wing by anyone elses standards, usually - sort of left of, right of centre. I'm not expecting big levels of support from China on the grounds they're ideological bedfellows.

Sure, he's no communist.

Look, the fact is that nobody really knows what Obama's current set of political beliefs consists of, and that's exactly my point.

I have my suspicions based on past associations and reading things into what he has said and written, and I am happy to let other people have theirs.

If we were talking about a man with any kind of political career behind him, perhaps there would be less need for this discussion.

So if you don't know what Obama's current beliefs are, it would be pretty difficult to say you disagree with them? Other than from the standpoint that traditionally Democrats are viewed as mapping to "Labour" and Republicans are viewed as mapping to "Conservative"

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

So if you don't know what Obama's current beliefs are, it would be pretty difficult to say you disagree with them? Other than from the standpoint that traditionally Democrats are viewed as mapping to "Labour" and Republicans are viewed as mapping to "Conservative"

Of course I'm aware of that tradition, but I can honestly just say to you that Obama rubs me up completely the wrong way and has done since he first entered my consciousness. So, as it happens, did Clinton, so perhaps there is a pattern emerging.


I admit that McCain and Palin have shown themselves to be very poor opposition.

The whole thing is a depressing spectacle.

[Hoboh]

We should look after our own interests and politics, sod the USA.
Proberbly half the back country hicks in the US think the UK is a city in Europe some where (if they've even heard of it!), do we really deserve back to back, wall to wall reports about puppets for the vested interests running for President?
It really is a soap opera they run over there, never any real politics, thats done behind closed doors with dodgy commitees.

'Fraid when this is an election to decide the most powerful man in the world, it kinda is important to a few folks hoboh.

You really beleive that Guff don't yer!!!

Cannot find one man, the USA's public enemy no 1 Bin Bag, struggles to beat a load of poorly armed (compared to the vast banks of US weapons) Iraq's, Taliban,Somali's drug dealers in Columbia etc who poison US Citys. the list is endless, most powerfull? excuse me I think I need the loo before I wet myself laughing!!!
He is a powerfull figure head chairman for all those interests who pump dollars into his election machine, that I will conceed.

[BWFC_Insane]

We should look after our own interests and politics, sod the USA.
Proberbly half the back country hicks in the US think the UK is a city in Europe some where (if they've even heard of it!), do we really deserve back to back, wall to wall reports about puppets for the vested interests running for President?
It really is a soap opera they run over there, never any real politics, thats done behind closed doors with dodgy commitees.

'Fraid when this is an election to decide the most powerful man in the world, it kinda is important to a few folks hoboh.

You really beleive that Guff don't yer!!!

Cannot find one man, the USA's public enemy no 1 Bin Bag, struggles to beat a load of poorly armed (compared to the vast banks of US weapons) Iraq's, Taliban,Somali's drug dealers in Columbia etc who poison US Citys. the list is endless, most powerfull? excuse me I think I need the loo before I wet myself laughing!!!
He is a powerfull figure head chairman for all those interests who pump dollars into his election machine, that I will conceed.

Hoboh end of the day the President of the US is very important in dictating a whole variety of things around the world.

Using the "Politicians are all corrupt/have no power blah blah" line cannot take away from the importance of the job.

End of the day the President is the only one who decides whether to press the "nuclear button" or not and hence I think we should all at least take note of who is in the hot seat.

[Verbal]

Last live debate yesterday before the election, polls suggest obama is anything from 5 to 10 points ahead.

[Hoboh]

We should look after our own interests and politics, sod the USA.
Proberbly half the back country hicks in the US think the UK is a city in Europe some where (if they've even heard of it!), do we really deserve back to back, wall to wall reports about puppets for the vested interests running for President?
It really is a soap opera they run over there, never any real politics, thats done behind closed doors with dodgy commitees.

'Fraid when this is an election to decide the most powerful man in the world, it kinda is important to a few folks hoboh.

You really beleive that Guff don't yer!!!

Cannot find one man, the USA's public enemy no 1 Bin Bag, struggles to beat a load of poorly armed (compared to the vast banks of US weapons) Iraq's, Taliban,Somali's drug dealers in Columbia etc who poison US Citys. the list is endless, most powerfull? excuse me I think I need the loo before I wet myself laughing!!!
He is a powerfull figure head chairman for all those interests who pump dollars into his election machine, that I will conceed.

Hoboh end of the day the President of the US is very important in dictating a whole variety of things around the world.

Using the "Politicians are all corrupt/have no power blah blah" line cannot take away from the importance of the job.

End of the day the President is the only one who decides whether to press the "nuclear button" or not and hence I think we should all at least take note of who is in the hot seat.[/quote]

M.A.D. and a whole shed load of protocal will prevent him from taking a unilateral desicion to launch unless attacked first.
If anything it would more than likly to be the UK with our tridents that would go nuke first, our PM also has a finger on a trigger and actually has more power to deploy troops etc anywhere world wide than a US president without seeking a mandate from anywhere.

[InsaneApache]

If anything it would more than likly to be the UK with our tridents that would go nuke first, our PM also has a finger on a trigger and actually has more power to deploy troops etc anywhere world wide than a US president without seeking a mandate from anywhere

IIRC didn't the rules change after the Iraq fiasco? Now they have to put the case to parliament. I understand the concern though, the thought of Brown with his clunking finger on the button will keep me awake for several nights.

Talking of our Great Leader, has anyone noticed how happy he is now that the economy's about to meltdown. The man can't stop laughing, he's like an hyena. Cheers you wassock.

[Lord Kangana]

Under the circumstances (ie control is now in the hands of the fabled 'markets') I'm not sure what else he could do? Democracy being controlled by financial institutions is the problem, and it seems a model we're hell bent on perpetuating. Hence the spectacle of shareholders complaining after taxpayers bailed out the very institutions that had been returning fat dividends to them on the basis of bad lending. Talk about wanting your cake and eating it.

[Hoboh]

Under the circumstances (ie control is now in the hands of the fabled 'markets') I'm not sure what else he could do? Democracy being controlled by financial institutions is the problem, and it seems a model we're hell bent on perpetuating. Hence the spectacle of shareholders complaining after taxpayers bailed out the very institutions that had been returning fat dividends to them on the basis of bad lending. Talk about wanting your cake and eating it.

Frankly its about time it was spelled out in no uncertain terms to shareholders you most be prepared to take the bad as well as the good times, thats the risk!!

In the recent turmoil the phrase Churchill used should be reversed,
"Never has so much been owed by so few to so many" or there abouts.

Share holders it appears are whingeing, whineing, plastic capitalists and they should wake up and realise it's only another form of gambleing! SOB's are happy to rake in dividends but not happy when the market down turns.

"You pays yer money you takes yer chance"

No sympathy!

[Montreal Wanderer]

Sorry I got confused:

Yes - Obama is a Marxist.

Sure, he's no communist.

I think we can agree on the latter view.
Now, if we can get you to see what a terrifyingly stupid person Palin is, we will be getting somewhere.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

The whole thing is a depressing spectacle.

On the contrary, I'm quite enjoying it, although I may be accused of having rosy spectacles. That said, my doom-mongering side still worries about a late collapse.

EDIT: quite interesting overview here

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

Under the circumstances (ie control is now in the hands of the fabled 'markets') I'm not sure what else he could do? Democracy being controlled by financial institutions is the problem, and it seems a model we're hell bent on perpetuating. Hence the spectacle of shareholders complaining after taxpayers bailed out the very institutions that had been returning fat dividends to them on the basis of bad lending. Talk about wanting your cake and eating it.

Frankly its about time it was spelled out in no uncertain terms to shareholders you most be prepared to take the bad as well as the good times, thats the risk!!

In the recent turmoil the phrase Churchill used should be reversed,
"Never has so much been owed by so few to so many" or there abouts.

Share holders it appears are whingeing, whineing, plastic capitalists and they should wake up and realise it's only another form of gambleing! SOB's are happy to rake in dividends but not happy when the market down turns.

"You pays yer money you takes yer chance"

No sympathy!

Well, quite. They're happy to be gently fluffed by Adam Smith's invisible hand, but less chirpy when they're getting fisted.

Sad truth is it might take six months of we taxpayers paying through the eyeballs before governments realise you can't fight it.

[Prufrock]

Maybe we should email him this and ask where he ends up?

http://www.politicalcompass.org/test

[email protected]

SHOCK SHOCK:Four from the bottom, and two from the left you bunch of facists.

[Montreal Wanderer]

Maybe we should email him this and ask where he ends up?

http://www.politicalcompass.org/test

[email protected]

SHOCK SHOCK:Four from the bottom, and two from the left you bunch of facists.

Five from bottom, six from left in the middle of the green somewhere between Ghandi and Prufrock , Mandela and the Dalai Lama.
Economic Left/Right: -4.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.49

Not altogether sure what it all means though.

[Dave Sutton's barnet]

I did yon test about six years ago, I've kept the results somewhere for future reference, to see if the old saying's true. ("He who isn't a socialist at 20 hasn't got a heart; he who's still a socialist at 40 hasn't got a brain". Not saying I agree with it, and nor presumably does Mummy, who's practically unable to type around his protruding bottom lip... )