The Politics Thread

[Worthy4England]

Mate how dare you. We have HS2!

HS2 was first proposed by the Labour government in 2009 under Gordon Brown, and HS2 Ltd was established to explore the possibility of a high-speed rail line connecting London and more northern parts of the country.

Oh that HS2? Labour idea?

Yes - are you suggesting we never look at whether there's a case for long term investment programmes? Labour didn't get anywhere near final proposals or the ongoing mismanagment. There's lots of things get proposed and examined to see if they make sense. The Tory led coalition, reviewed it, proposed some changes, put it out to a new consultation and made a decision to proceed in 2012. Since when we've just seen it spiral and spiral and then they cancelled it.

What's your point?

I see as ever you have no response to anything else. I'd love to live in a world where all I needed to do was say "they did it" and offer no alternatives. To AT's point, just wanna whinge.

[Hoboh]

Mate how dare you. We have HS2!

HS2 was first proposed by the Labour government in 2009 under Gordon Brown, and HS2 Ltd was established to explore the possibility of a high-speed rail line connecting London and more northern parts of the country.

Oh that HS2? Labour idea?

Yes - are you suggesting we never look at whether there's a case for long term investment programmes? Labour didn't get anywhere near final proposals or the ongoing mismanagment. There's lots of things get proposed and examined to see if they make sense. The Tory led coalition, reviewed it, proposed some changes, put it out to a new consultation and made a decision to proceed in 2012. Since when we've just seen it spiral and spiral and then they cancelled it.

What's your point?

I see as ever you have no response to anything else. I'd love to live in a world where all I needed to do was say "they did it" and offer no alternatives. To AT's point, just wanna whinge.

You really take the biscuit don't you?
Calling me a moaner for pointing out that labour are hardly living up to election promises and everything being fully costed etc. etc. are rapidly evaporating. Your constant reference to 'your lot' implying I blindly went along with everything the Tories stood for is really quite laughable.
The fact I don't reply to every single issue dragged up by some is more to do with actual time, ie. not working from home or an office desk, yes despite the fact I own my home outright and have savings I can write a cheque out in emergencies, I am a, despite 2tk latest diffinition, a working person.
Oh bugger another break wasted!

[TANGODANCER]

I suppose telling the truth is a start of sorts?

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

You really take the biscuit don't you?
Calling me a moaner for pointing out that labour are hardly living up to election promises and everything being fully costed etc. etc. are rapidly evaporating. Your constant reference to 'your lot' implying I blindly went along with everything the Tories stood for is really quite laughable.
The fact I don't reply to every single issue dragged up by some is more to do with actual time, ie. not working from home or an office desk, yes despite the fact I own my home outright and have savings I can write a cheque out in emergencies, I am a, despite 2tk latest diffinition, a working person.
Oh bugger another break wasted!

That took you 15 minutes?

[Hoboh]

You really take the biscuit don't you?
Calling me a moaner for pointing out that labour are hardly living up to election promises and everything being fully costed etc. etc. are rapidly evaporating. Your constant reference to 'your lot' implying I blindly went along with everything the Tories stood for is really quite laughable.
The fact I don't reply to every single issue dragged up by some is more to do with actual time, ie. not working from home or an office desk, yes despite the fact I own my home outright and have savings I can write a cheque out in emergencies, I am a, despite 2tk latest diffinition, a working person.
Oh bugger another break wasted!

That took you 15 minutes?

One does eat, grab a brew and have a quick ciggie as well. Anyway, home and tipping points on

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

You really take the biscuit don't you?
Calling me a moaner for pointing out that labour are hardly living up to election promises and everything being fully costed etc. etc. are rapidly evaporating. Your constant reference to 'your lot' implying I blindly went along with everything the Tories stood for is really quite laughable.
The fact I don't reply to every single issue dragged up by some is more to do with actual time, ie. not working from home or an office desk, yes despite the fact I own my home outright and have savings I can write a cheque out in emergencies, I am a, despite 2tk latest diffinition, a working person.
Oh bugger another break wasted!

That took you 15 minutes?

One does eat, grab a brew and have a quick ciggie as well. Anyway, home and tipping points on

You not a multi tasker Hobes?

[Worthy4England]

Mate how dare you. We have HS2!

HS2 was first proposed by the Labour government in 2009 under Gordon Brown, and HS2 Ltd was established to explore the possibility of a high-speed rail line connecting London and more northern parts of the country.

Oh that HS2? Labour idea?

Yes - are you suggesting we never look at whether there's a case for long term investment programmes? Labour didn't get anywhere near final proposals or the ongoing mismanagment. There's lots of things get proposed and examined to see if they make sense. The Tory led coalition, reviewed it, proposed some changes, put it out to a new consultation and made a decision to proceed in 2012. Since when we've just seen it spiral and spiral and then they cancelled it.

What's your point?

I see as ever you have no response to anything else. I'd love to live in a world where all I needed to do was say "they did it" and offer no alternatives. To AT's point, just wanna whinge.

You really take the biscuit don't you?
Calling me a moaner for pointing out that labour are hardly living up to election promises and everything being fully costed etc. etc. are rapidly evaporating. Your constant reference to 'your lot' implying I blindly went along with everything the Tories stood for is really quite laughable.
The fact I don't reply to every single issue dragged up by some is more to do with actual time, ie. not working from home or an office desk, yes despite the fact I own my home outright and have savings I can write a cheque out in emergencies, I am a, despite 2tk latest diffinition, a working person.
Oh bugger another break wasted!

So still no comment on previous policies. I don't have a problem with you supporting a different team, mate. Just be equitable. What is the point you're making about owning house, having savings and writing cheques? What has that got to do the things we were discussing? Don't get it. Pleased for you though.

[Worthy4England]

You really take the biscuit don't you?
Calling me a moaner for pointing out that labour are hardly living up to election promises and everything being fully costed etc. etc. are rapidly evaporating. Your constant reference to 'your lot' implying I blindly went along with everything the Tories stood for is really quite laughable.
The fact I don't reply to every single issue dragged up by some is more to do with actual time, ie. not working from home or an office desk, yes despite the fact I own my home outright and have savings I can write a cheque out in emergencies, I am a, despite 2tk latest diffinition, a working person.
Oh bugger another break wasted!

That took you 15 minutes?

One does eat, grab a brew and have a quick ciggie as well. Anyway, home and tipping points on

You not a multi tasker Hobes?

feck off with your AI multitasking...

[Hoboh]

Mate how dare you. We have HS2!

HS2 was first proposed by the Labour government in 2009 under Gordon Brown, and HS2 Ltd was established to explore the possibility of a high-speed rail line connecting London and more northern parts of the country.

Oh that HS2? Labour idea?

Yes - are you suggesting we never look at whether there's a case for long term investment programmes? Labour didn't get anywhere near final proposals or the ongoing mismanagment. There's lots of things get proposed and examined to see if they make sense. The Tory led coalition, reviewed it, proposed some changes, put it out to a new consultation and made a decision to proceed in 2012. Since when we've just seen it spiral and spiral and then they cancelled it.

What's your point?

I see as ever you have no response to anything else. I'd love to live in a world where all I needed to do was say "they did it" and offer no alternatives. To AT's point, just wanna whinge.

You really take the biscuit don't you?
Calling me a moaner for pointing out that labour are hardly living up to election promises and everything being fully costed etc. etc. are rapidly evaporating. Your constant reference to 'your lot' implying I blindly went along with everything the Tories stood for is really quite laughable.
The fact I don't reply to every single issue dragged up by some is more to do with actual time, ie. not working from home or an office desk, yes despite the fact I own my home outright and have savings I can write a cheque out in emergencies, I am a, despite 2tk latest diffinition, a working person.
Oh bugger another break wasted!

So still no comment on previous policies. I don't have a problem with you supporting a different team, mate. Just be equitable. What is the point you're making about owning house, having savings and writing cheques? What has that got to do the things we were discussing? Don't get it. Pleased for you though.

"In an interview during a Commonwealth leaders' summit, the prime minister was asked whether those who work, but get additional income from assets such as shares or property, would count as working people.

He replied that they "wouldn't come within my definition" - but warned against making "assumptions" about what that meant for tax policy.

He said he thought of a working person as someone who “goes out and earns their living, usually paid in a sort of monthly cheque" and who can't "write a cheque to get out of difficulties"."

Source, a BBC report, hardly a far right stitch up or the Daily Mail

[Worthy4England]

Not gonna answer that topic. Start new moan.

Proper snowflake.

[Hoboh]

On the subject of national interest investment let's have a look.

Supposed costs for half the HS2 costs, dreamed up by labour, implemented by the stupid Tories, £50 billion.

Now consider this;

Britain is one of the most expensive places in the world to build a nuclear power plant, costing around £9.42 million per MW. The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station in Somerset is expected to cost £33 billion.

South Korea is one of the few countries where the cost of construction has steadily decreased, with plants costing around £2.24 million per MW.

Why the huge difference? How useful would £50 billions worth thrown at a stupid toy train set have been in the quest for stability in the power industry if we had South Koreas costs?

Basically, the taxpayers are being ripped off left, right and centre and people actually, well some anyway, think that milliband and his £80 billion or so GB power are going to deliver anything of use?
Seems labours aim is to carpet the rest of the countryside where they cannot build houses with windmills and pipelines ferrying CO2 about.

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

You really take the biscuit don't you?
Calling me a moaner for pointing out that labour are hardly living up to election promises and everything being fully costed etc. etc. are rapidly evaporating. Your constant reference to 'your lot' implying I blindly went along with everything the Tories stood for is really quite laughable.
The fact I don't reply to every single issue dragged up by some is more to do with actual time, ie. not working from home or an office desk, yes despite the fact I own my home outright and have savings I can write a cheque out in emergencies, I am a, despite 2tk latest diffinition, a working person.
Oh bugger another break wasted!

That took you 15 minutes?

One does eat, grab a brew and have a quick ciggie as well. Anyway, home and tipping points on

You not a multi tasker Hobes?

feck off with your AI multitasking...

Don't you be brining intelligence into it

[Hoboh]

Not gonna answer that topic. Start new moan.

Proper snowflake.

Not moans, merely pointing out things people would rather not see

Anyway take comfort from the fact you ain't too worried who is grabbing and spending your ample cash pot Worthy.

[Worthy4England]

Not gonna answer that topic. Start new moan.

Proper snowflake.

Not moans, merely pointing out things people would rather not see

Anyway take comfort from the fact you ain't too worried who is grabbing and spending your ample cash pot Worthy.

It might appear, to the casual observer, that you have a "fair old" cash pot yourself mate.

If you're paying any attention aside from cut n paste drama posts, you might have spotted, I don't agree with...

1) Labour's housebuilding policy
2) I think Starmers statements about "working class" being people with assets is lame.I think they'll go for the easy comparitivr shit, rather than the real problematic
3) Not a page back, I am concerned about whether Reeves plan for investment it economic structural programmes rather than balance the current account

[BWFC_Insane]

On the subject of national interest investment let's have a look.

Supposed costs for half the HS2 costs, dreamed up by labour, implemented by the stupid Tories, £50 billion.

Now consider this;

Britain is one of the most expensive places in the world to build a nuclear power plant, costing around £9.42 million per MW. The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station in Somerset is expected to cost £33 billion.

South Korea is one of the few countries where the cost of construction has steadily decreased, with plants costing around £2.24 million per MW.

Why the huge difference? How useful would £50 billions worth thrown at a stupid toy train set have been in the quest for stability in the power industry if we had South Koreas costs?

Basically, the taxpayers are being ripped off left, right and centre and people actually, well some anyway, think that milliband and his £80 billion or so GB power are going to deliver anything of use?
Seems labours aim is to carpet the rest of the countryside where they cannot build houses with windmills and pipelines ferrying CO2 about.

One of the biggest reasons our infrastructure projects cost so much compared to say South Korea is we keep turning the taps off. Shutting down investment then switching it back on - makes stuff a lot more expensive. South Korea have consistently invested over the last 50 years and are reaping the benefits.

Everything is expensive here because people keep thinking we don’t need to invest in our infrastructure and moan about doing so.

[Worthy4England]

It's reasonably straightforwards. EDF are building Hinkley C...they recover their costs over 35 years through the strike price per MWh. From 2013-2020, it was fairly stable in a range between 40-70. During the energy crisis it spent a long while over £200 and got as high as £500, today it's about £86.

The Tories index linked the original strike price, so EDF win either way and don't care how much it goes up.

The result will be that effectively a regressive tax will be added to UK consumers bills for 35 years...

Osborne was advised by a firm, who at the time were also working for EDF. Oh. Then we asked the Chinese in...

The wonderful power of capitalism. As an aside, we had zero skills in building nuclear reactors...

[Worthy4England]

What with a budget due and most signs suggesting it's going to be a shitshow and MPs thinking it's ok to smack constituents. I think Labour are going to have to explain how they've divided "working people" from errr "working people." It's been an inauspicious start for me...

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

I thought the grown ups were supposed to be in the room and we were getting competence along with our medicine. So far its a more dull version of the last lot.

[Worthy4England]

I thought the grown ups were supposed to be in the room and we were getting competence along with our medicine. So far its a more dull version of the last lot.

Agree mate. I suspect like many Chancellors it might not be quite as bad as some of the messaging, but I think they're going to go for the muppet shuffle, where they just dump more tax on some people already paying tax and reduce tax on some others, whereas I think they need to go after more folks not paying the right tax or none at all, through some sort of avoidance or outright evasion. But no, sitting ducks are....well sitting ducks. I also worry that they haven't hinted at differentiating between "big business" and small/medium business and that's a worry if they go for a dumb tax take of small businesses that are clearly struggling - that isn't boosting growth.

[TANGODANCER]

"The evil that men do lives after them!) Shakespeare's Marc Antony is one source credited with this wisdom. It seems particularly apt as a description of ruling bodies throughout history. We can backtrack a very long way before we find a time when "haves" and "have nots" didn't exist, with the former being heavily linked with any thing other than sheer personal greed. "Government" is actually a self-defining word attempt to justify it all, but how do we unravel multi-centuries of wrong and mend it? I doubt we ever will, It's just, as ever, a power game well protested by its own self-made laws.

This of course is nothing new, just an excuse for a rant.