Good on the Irish

[bobo the clown]

So, the EU decide to go large, they create a Treaty to extend its undemocratic process ... which is duly rejected.

They re-package what is essentially the same thing ... tell 3/4 of the countries that it's the same & not to fret ... tell the other 1/4 it's not the same & not to fret.

The various Governments largely know that to ask the people will lead to a rejection. Simple enough ... don't ask them !

Unfortunately for this bunch of shysters one country, by its constitution, HAS to hold a referendum. That's Ireland. 3m of the 470m overall population.

It holds it's referendum, but almost all the 'legitimate' parties campaign for a yes & threaten its citizens with the dire consequences of voting "no". The country votes clearly against it ... as would 100's of millions of other voters if they were allowed to express their will.

Still they vote "no" and the treaty is dead. Or is it ?? ... already we are hearing the shape-shifters saying how much of it can be implemented anyway. Last time the Irish did this they were instructed to re-ballot until they got it right.

Watch this space.

[enfieldwhite]

So, the EU decide to go large, they create a Treaty to extend its undemocratic process ... which is duly rejected.

They re-package what is essentially the same thing ... tell 3/4 of the countries that it's the same & not to fret ... tell the other 1/4 it's not the same & not to fret.

The various Governments largely know that to ask the people will lead to a rejection. Simple enough ... don't ask them !

Unfortunately for this bunch of shysters one country, by its coonstitution HAS to hold a referendum. That's Ireland. 3m of the 470m overall population.

It holds it's referendum, but almost all the 'legitimate' parties campaign for a yes & threaten its citizens with the dire consequences of voting "no". The country votes clearly against it ... as would 100's of millions of other voters if they were allowed to express their will.

Still they vote "no" and the treaty is dead. Or is it ?? ... already we are hearing the shape-shifters saying how much of it can be implemented anyway. Last time the Irish did this they were instructed to re-ballot until they got it right.

Watch this space.

The Irish had a system of government and a parliament when most of these 'Europeans' were still bartering with Dung. Up yours Delors (or whoever the feck it is nowadays.

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

Hear hear. Well done the Irish indeed.

[ratbert]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented... but organised scaremongering DOES press all the wrong buttons in people.

We're from the geographical continent of Europe folks, get used to it.

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented...

Ok, so you would use that as an argument for a 'yes' vote?

[Hoboh]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented... but organised scaremongering DOES press all the wrong buttons in people.

We're from the geographical continent of Europe folks, get used to it.

26 miles of water says we ain't.

I'm English, then British, then maybe if pushed European.

I elect my goverment to govern in my country not johnny bloody forigner thankyou.

[Prufrock]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented... but organised scaremongering DOES press all the wrong buttons in people.

We're from the geographical continent of Europe folks, get used to it.

26 miles of water says we ain't.

I'm English, then British, then maybe if pushed European.

I elect my goverment to govern in my country not johnny bloody forigner thankyou.

So Isle of Wight aint English, or Skye Scottish? Greek islands not Greek? I'd rather be part of Europe than America. Unions are the new empires, and i'd rather be an equal democratic power in the EU, than America's lapdog. That said enough people in enough countries seem to be against this idea that they should realise and drop it. Don't get me wrong, i dont think there should be one governing body throughout Europe and us all lumped in together, but i think the idea of cutting ourselves off altogether is quite, well, insular.

[Hoboh]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented... but organised scaremongering DOES press all the wrong buttons in people.

We're from the geographical continent of Europe folks, get used to it.

26 miles of water says we ain't.

I'm English, then British, then maybe if pushed European.

I elect my goverment to govern in my country not johnny bloody forigner thankyou.

So Isle of Wight aint English, or Skye Scottish? Greek islands not Greek? I'd rather be part of Europe than America. Unions are the new empires, and i'd rather be an equal democratic power in the EU, than America's lapdog. That said enough people in enough countries seem to be against this idea that they should realise and drop it. Don't get me wrong, i dont think there should be one governing body throughout Europe and us all lumped in together, but i think the idea of cutting ourselves off altogether is quite, well, insular.

The channel cuts us off and we were gratefull enough when Adolf was on a roll with his tanks!!!
How many times have the French, Spanish, potugese, Germans tried to smash us!!! and you want them to have a say in running our country We should give up all our forefathers fought to keep without even a vote!!!!! the commies are coming!

[mummywhycantieatcrayons]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented... but organised scaremongering DOES press all the wrong buttons in people.

We're from the geographical continent of Europe folks, get used to it.

26 miles of water says we ain't.

I'm English, then British, then maybe if pushed European.

I elect my goverment to govern in my country not johnny bloody forigner thankyou.

So Isle of Wight aint English, or Skye Scottish? Greek islands not Greek? I'd rather be part of Europe than America. Unions are the new empires, and i'd rather be an equal democratic power in the EU, than America's lapdog. That said enough people in enough countries seem to be against this idea that they should realise and drop it. Don't get me wrong, i dont think there should be one governing body throughout Europe and us all lumped in together, but i think the idea of cutting ourselves off altogether is quite, well, insular.

Who has suggested cutting ourselves off altogether?

[Prufrock]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented... but organised scaremongering DOES press all the wrong buttons in people.

We're from the geographical continent of Europe folks, get used to it.

26 miles of water says we ain't.

I'm English, then British, then maybe if pushed European.

I elect my goverment to govern in my country not johnny bloody forigner thankyou.

So Isle of Wight aint English, or Skye Scottish? Greek islands not Greek? I'd rather be part of Europe than America. Unions are the new empires, and i'd rather be an equal democratic power in the EU, than America's lapdog. That said enough people in enough countries seem to be against this idea that they should realise and drop it. Don't get me wrong, i dont think there should be one governing body throughout Europe and us all lumped in together, but i think the idea of cutting ourselves off altogether is quite, well, insular.

The channel cuts us off and we were gratefull enough when Adolf was on a roll with his tanks!!!
How many times have the French, Spanish, potugese, Germans tried to smash us!!! and you want them to have a say in running our country We should give up all our forefathers fought to keep without even a vote!!!!! the commies are coming!

Our forefathers fough against invading armies, its hardly the same is it? No-one is advocating us being ruled by anyone else, but the EU is massively important. We are in it, and we aint coming out an time soon, so i personally would rather we went and had our say in it. If that say, or the say of enough countries is agaisnt a certain proposal, it should be dropped.

as for the emboldened bit, come on! The Armada has got the square root of f all to do with this. Its history. Are you suggesting that Germany is still full of secret nazis who can't wait for the chance to come and have another pop at invading? France full of short Corsican Admirals? It is the very notion that everyone is out to get us, and that we are superior to all of Europe and the world that in fact makes us more likely to go out and try to 'smash' them. We could learn a hell of a lot from the rest of Europe, France has the best health service in the world for example. What have we got, obesity and idiocy. Go UK!

I am not saying for a second that this constitution is a good idea, or that we should all become one super country, but there always seems to be a lot of anti-EU feeling just for the sake of it.

[Prufrock]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented... but organised scaremongering DOES press all the wrong buttons in people.

We're from the geographical continent of Europe folks, get used to it.

26 miles of water says we ain't.

I'm English, then British, then maybe if pushed European.

I elect my goverment to govern in my country not johnny bloody forigner thankyou.

So Isle of Wight aint English, or Skye Scottish? Greek islands not Greek? I'd rather be part of Europe than America. Unions are the new empires, and i'd rather be an equal democratic power in the EU, than America's lapdog. That said enough people in enough countries seem to be against this idea that they should realise and drop it. Don't get me wrong, i dont think there should be one governing body throughout Europe and us all lumped in together, but i think the idea of cutting ourselves off altogether is quite, well, insular.

Who has suggested cutting ourselves off altogether?

That's what i took the two emboldened bits to mean, although i may have misinterpreted them. However i think hoboh's comments overall suggest he is pretty anti-EU. Again just my inferences. If true, tis an opinion he is entitled to, i just strongly disagree.

[TANGODANCER]

And to think, Britain once ruled the world.

[Prufrock]

And to think, Britain once ruled the world.

and by rule we do mean exploit right ?

[InsaneApache]

The headline read...

'Fog in the channel, Europe cut off..."



Give it six months and the Irish will be forced given the opportunity to refect and rethink their disgusting ingratitude to the EU. Place your bets here.

How many times have the French, Spanish, potugese, Germans tried to smash us!!!

In the case of the potugese, I mean Portuguese, none. They are our oldest ally.

[Mar]

How many times have the ...potugese... tried to smash us!!! and you want them to have a say in running our country We should give up all our forefathers fought to keep without even a vote!!!!! the commies are coming!

I read somewhere that England and Portugal have one of the longest held peace treaties in the world and we've rarely ever been to war with them. Unlike the Germans its a completely different story with Portugal.

[Worthy4England]

Not that anyone would notice any day to day difference to their lives if it was implemented... but organised scaremongering DOES press all the wrong buttons in people.

We're from the geographical continent of Europe folks, get used to it.

We certainly need to be part of a European trading bloc. Most economists are not divided on this. That said, the stirring of nationalism around keeping the pound etc. all done for no noble reason particularly other than to garner popular support for votes adds little value. I think there is a difference between trading bloc and governed by Brussels, although realistically would muppets from Brussels be any worse than the governments we've had over my 44 years on the planet? I think not.....

[TANGODANCER]

You may think it silly ,I know, but being British has always been something I'm exceedingly proud of. Previous fights with neighbours can be-and have been- forgotten, and I don't mind inviting them to tea ocasionally. I'n not quite so keen on them telling me what to do or tramping all over my living room at will though. Does that sound terribly wrong?

[Prufrock]

You may think it silly ,I know, but being British has always been something I'm exceedingly proud of. Previous fights with neighbours can be-and have been- forgotten, and I don't mind inviting them to tea ocasionally. I'n not quite so keen on them telling me what to do or tramping all over my living room at will though. Does that sound terribly wrong?

Not at all TD, but if there was a hedge between your two gardens, surely you would consult them, and expect to be consulted by them should they want to change it? Also if there was a big neighbourhood dispute, you would surely be on the side of your neighbour as opposed to that of the pushy bully from across the street ( completely randomly lets call it Atlantic Street)? Also you would expect to be completely in control of your own house, but you would also expect a democratically equal share in any decision made by a neighbourhood watch group (for protection) or in a local election (for power). In that way the EU is massivly important and, IMO, undervalued, in this country. You might like it, you might not, fact of the matter is it is here to stay and i really really hope people in this country would rather align themselves with the general views of the EU, rather than the general views of the US. We can argue all we like about self rule, but for reasons of trade and in particular finance (the main source of Britains wealth atm given we have no exports but a massive financial centre in London) we have to align ourselves to certain global conglomerations, i would prefer the EU to America.

[Verbal]

People always seem scared that we'll become part of some kind of 'United States of Europe' and lose our autonomy. It won't happen.

[Worthy4England]

You may think it silly ,I know, but being British has always been something I'm exceedingly proud of. Previous fights with neighbours can be-and have been- forgotten, and I don't mind inviting them to tea ocasionally. I'n not quite so keen on them telling me what to do or tramping all over my living room at will though. Does that sound terribly wrong?

When electing Governments, there's always a them and us. Realistically there's only two parties in the UK that in the current climate are likely to be elected, Conservative and Labour, and invariably, they get elected on about 40% of the vote, so there's more people don't want them as do. So we're quite happy to have someone who's been elected on effectively a minority vote but have a big hang up on where in the world they sit...