The Politics Thread

[Worthy4England]

I think it's great he's going to return manufacturing to the US heartlands...That'll be loads of heavily automated, "people light" production processes then, by the time they build them. Glad the thick fcukers will be teased by looking at their shiny new factories with fck all employees in them.

[KeyserSoze]

Calling out working class americans as thick bastards and perpetuating their own downfall is completely self-serving and misses the point. The rust belt hasn't voted Republican since the eighties. What was it that was so wrong with the status quo that drove millions to vote for a demagogue?

[Worthy4England]

Calling out working class americans as thick bastards and perpetuating their own downfall is completely self-serving and misses the point. The rust belt hasn't voted Republican since the eighties. What was it that was so wrong with the status quo that drove millions to vote for a demagogue?

Like I care much?

The good news is the status quo is challenged successfully, albeit marginally (as BWFCi pointed out, Clinton got more votes and still lost) - so let them get on with it - both Brexit and US. Big promises have been made. Let's see this brave new world. Deliver on those promises.

The elites are dead, I'm looking forward to this much better future we're going to see in the next 5 years. Bring it.

[Hoboh]

Calling out working class americans as thick bastards and perpetuating their own downfall is completely self-serving and misses the point. The rust belt hasn't voted Republican since the eighties. What was it that was so wrong with the status quo that drove millions to vote for a demagogue?

Like I care much?

The good news is the status quo is challenged successfully, albeit marginally (as BWFCi pointed out, Clinton got more votes and still lost) - so let them get on with it - both Brexit and US. Big promises have been made. Let's see this brave new world. Deliver on those promises.

The elites are dead, I'm looking forward to this much better future we're going to see in the next 5 years. Bring it.

On

Merkel's still around

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

^

'These people ' you refer to aren't necessaily racist or sexist. They're just like you and I but with infinitely less job security and employee benefits than we have. They've watched their wages stagnate while one or two individuals have got obscenely wealthy in the same period. Folk largely want to work hard and reap the benefits that used to bring. The American dream and all that. They're not looking to blame ethnic groups.

But they are. I'm not saying that they are racist, but it is far easier to blame immigrants than it is to face the fact that the industry you've worked in for 20 years is dying and there is nothing anyone can do about it. I don't think the majority of Germans were racist in the 1930's. But when things are shit and someone peddles the line that a certain group of people are responsible those views need challenging. Unfortunately it seems pandering to the uneducated is the order of the day. Also the fact is that a significant proportion of mid western and southern state Americans are indeed racist. Homophobic too. And Trump tapped into that alongside the downturn in fortunes of others who perhaps aren't racist but gave them a 'blame valve'. A quick, imaginary fix. Build a wall. That'll fix it....

What are the 'established politicians' meant to do about it? These people don't want socialist ideals. They want blame and absolving of their own part in anything that has gone wrong. It simply isn't reality. The issue is that the recession was caused by the very sort of greed and profiteering their new saviour was involved with. But instead of accepting this, they want to blame an establishment that whilst complicit in not tackling the underlying problem certainly aren't able to wave a magic wand now.

Oh and I've just read that the final irony in this tale, especially to the likes of Hoboh and Brexit majority banger on's, is that Clinton polled more votes than Trump. So the most popular candidate has lost.

Lets takes steel as an example...

Why is the steel industry on it's arse? It's not like lots of tall buildings don't get built is it? People like Trump have been buying cheap steel from abroad for years. The government could have done something about this and didn't. The people running the factories could have diversified, specialised or partnered up the car makers in the US. The industry might have needed to slim down a little, but the workers deserved more than shit management (ask anyone that's worked for an American company) and politicians with little interest.

It's the same in the UK. The government has frustrated attempts by the EU to impose higher tariffs on Chinese steel. They've failed to specify the steel required for massive infrastructure projects that would rule out cheap imports and make British steel more viable.

Not all these industries die on their arse because they are no longer needed, often it's incompetence and indifference from those that can make a difference.

[BWFC_Insane]

^

'These people ' you refer to aren't necessaily racist or sexist. They're just like you and I but with infinitely less job security and employee benefits than we have. They've watched their wages stagnate while one or two individuals have got obscenely wealthy in the same period. Folk largely want to work hard and reap the benefits that used to bring. The American dream and all that. They're not looking to blame ethnic groups.

But they are. I'm not saying that they are racist, but it is far easier to blame immigrants than it is to face the fact that the industry you've worked in for 20 years is dying and there is nothing anyone can do about it. I don't think the majority of Germans were racist in the 1930's. But when things are shit and someone peddles the line that a certain group of people are responsible those views need challenging. Unfortunately it seems pandering to the uneducated is the order of the day. Also the fact is that a significant proportion of mid western and southern state Americans are indeed racist. Homophobic too. And Trump tapped into that alongside the downturn in fortunes of others who perhaps aren't racist but gave them a 'blame valve'. A quick, imaginary fix. Build a wall. That'll fix it....

What are the 'established politicians' meant to do about it? These people don't want socialist ideals. They want blame and absolving of their own part in anything that has gone wrong. It simply isn't reality. The issue is that the recession was caused by the very sort of greed and profiteering their new saviour was involved with. But instead of accepting this, they want to blame an establishment that whilst complicit in not tackling the underlying problem certainly aren't able to wave a magic wand now.

Oh and I've just read that the final irony in this tale, especially to the likes of Hoboh and Brexit majority banger on's, is that Clinton polled more votes than Trump. So the most popular candidate has lost.

Lets takes steel as an example...

Why is the steel industry on it's arse? It's not like lots of tall buildings don't get built is it? People like Trump have been buying cheap steel from abroad for years. The government could have done something about this and didn't. The people running the factories could have diversified, specialised or partnered up the car makers in the US. The industry might have needed to slim down a little, but the workers deserved more than shit management (ask anyone that's worked for an American company) and politicians with little interest.

It's the same in the UK. The government has frustrated attempts by the EU to impose higher tariffs on Chinese steel. They've failed to specify the steel required for massive infrastructure projects that would rule out cheap imports and make British steel more viable.

Not all these industries die on their arse because they are no longer needed, often it's incompetence and indifference from those that can make a difference.

Agreed. It ultimately comes down to greed from the likes of Trump though...the irony is not lost on me!

[Hoboh]

And this kid would know exactly what about life?

Oh, she read it on Facebook from the mainly leftie troll pages.

[Hoboh]

Panicked EU chiefs have scurried to invite Donald Trump to discuss trade negotiations over fears he would rather deal directly with Britain. 
The move would be a hammer blow to Brussels, which is still reeling from the UK's decision to leave Europe in June. 

Next a scaling down on NATO cover for some of the EU states, pay your 2% or else.

[BWFC_Insane]

And this kid would know exactly what about life?

Oh, she read it on Facebook from the mainly leftie troll pages.

Given most of the stuff you post, I suspect she has a better understanding than you.

[Hoboh]

And this kid would know exactly what about life?

Oh, she read it on Facebook from the mainly leftie troll pages.

Given most of the stuff you post, I suspect she has a better understanding than you.

And given the bollocks you continually spout with your world love in (btw how many migrants are at yours now?, I hope you are being responsible and paying their way).
You morons just don't accept democratic ways anymore unless it suits you, lose and you throw the toys out the pram!

[BWFC_Insane]

And given the bollocks you continually spout with your world love in (btw how many migrants are at yours now?, I hope you are being responsible and paying their way).
You morons just don't accept democratic ways anymore unless it suits you, lose and you throw the toys out the pram!

Accepting democratic views eh?

Back in 2012 when Trump, incorrectly thought Romney had won more votes than Obama, had this to say...

https://twitter.com/JoshCrewsReally/sta ... 92/photo/1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He was urging people to march on Washington in protest. Is that accepting the democratic ways?

Trump has just won an election with less votes than his rival. What should those who didn't vote for him do? Should they take Trump's own advice?

[Hoboh]

And given the bollocks you continually spout with your world love in (btw how many migrants are at yours now?, I hope you are being responsible and paying their way).
You morons just don't accept democratic ways anymore unless it suits you, lose and you throw the toys out the pram!

Accepting democratic views eh?

Back in 2012 when Trump, incorrectly thought Romney had won more votes than Obama, had this to say...

https://twitter.com/JoshCrewsReally/sta ... 92/photo/1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He was urging people to march on Washington in protest. Is that accepting the democratic ways?

Trump has just won an election with less votes than his rival. What should those who didn't vote for him do? Should they take Trump's own advice?

Just found a comment replying to Owen Jones theory that the leftie and liberal types merely need to find 'a new populism', just bout sums most of your types up

And hence is your problem Owen, you go on about speaking the language of the working classes yet you speak the language of the metropolitan elites. Going on and on about things like multiculturalism, a failed project which the majority don't accept. Your obsession with LGBT I mean most people are live and let live but do we have to have it rammed down our throats constantly.
And then there is the new great word, misogyny, every male that looks at page three or whistles at a pretty girl is a sexist pig. What Trump said about woman was 'locker room talk' go to any gathering of men be it in a pub or football match (you know where working classes congregate) and you will hear a lot worse, (I will exclude Islington dinner party's from this) why, because men will be men and most sensible women know that, hence the reason Trump picked up a fair share of their vote.
The problem for you is that the liberal metropolitan elite are obsessed with minorities and political correctness, and this does not go down well with the working classes, especially outside London. In fact people are sick and tired of having it rammed down their throats by smug lefties and that is why you have lost the argument. I sit back in amusement at your outrage that the majority don't accept your point of view. Long may it continue.

[BWFC_Insane]

And given the bollocks you continually spout with your world love in (btw how many migrants are at yours now?, I hope you are being responsible and paying their way).
You morons just don't accept democratic ways anymore unless it suits you, lose and you throw the toys out the pram!

Accepting democratic views eh?

Back in 2012 when Trump, incorrectly thought Romney had won more votes than Obama, had this to say...

https://twitter.com/JoshCrewsReally/sta ... 92/photo/1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He was urging people to march on Washington in protest. Is that accepting the democratic ways?

Trump has just won an election with less votes than his rival. What should those who didn't vote for him do? Should they take Trump's own advice?

Just found a comment replying to Owen Jones theory that the leftie and liberal types merely need to find 'a new populism', just bout sums most of your types up

And hence is your problem Owen, you go on about speaking the language of the working classes yet you speak the language of the metropolitan elites. Going on and on about things like multiculturalism, a failed project which the majority don't accept. Your obsession with LGBT I mean most people are live and let live but do we have to have it rammed down our throats constantly.
And then there is the new great word, misogyny, every male that looks at page three or whistles at a pretty girl is a sexist pig. What Trump said about woman was 'locker room talk' go to any gathering of men be it in a pub or football match (you know where working classes congregate) and you will hear a lot worse, (I will exclude Islington dinner party's from this) why, because men will be men and most sensible women know that, hence the reason Trump picked up a fair share of their vote.
The problem for you is that the liberal metropolitan elite are obsessed with minorities and political correctness, and this does not go down well with the working classes, especially outside London. In fact people are sick and tired of having it rammed down their throats by smug lefties and that is why you have lost the argument. I sit back in amusement at your outrage that the majority don't accept your point of view. Long may it continue.

So what about that marching on Washington eh? Or would you rather not answer that.

[LeverEnd]

And this kid would know exactly what about life?

Oh, she read it on Facebook from the mainly leftie troll pages.

A young woman doesn't need to be old and wise to conclude that a bloke who goes on about grabbing pussies is not her cup of tea as president.
Maybe This new presidential reboot of Trump will look at the protests and tone down his hateful bullshit.

[Hoboh]

And this kid would know exactly what about life?

Oh, she read it on Facebook from the mainly leftie troll pages.

A young woman doesn't need to be old and wise to conclude that a bloke who goes on about grabe.

What points to that being the reason for her protest or are you just guessing?

I don't particularly like Trump, he strikes me as a little unhinged at times to be honest and I'd much rather have had a more stable republican (If there is one).
Right, now that's out the way I'm pleased he won because I like many others are sick of faux socialists with their hands in the pockets of large corporations who are far removed from the majority trying to dictate everything and labelling everyone who does not agree fascists etc.
Clinton was no change and all the bullshit spouted about the great Obama years is responsable, remind me who it was sat back and did little while ISIS romped around Iraq despite the despite all the so called US commitment to that country?
Gun massacres seem to have increased during his term, wages have been at best frozen, he stupidly got involved in Syria and now Europe is paying a hefty price for his policy, no wonder folk didn't want someone tainted by that as President, woman or not.

[TANGODANCER]

And hence is your problem Owen, you go on about speaking the language of the working classes yet you speak the language of the metropolitan elites. Going on and on about things like multiculturalism, a failed project which the majority don't accept. Your obsession with LGBT I mean most people are live and let live but do we have to have it rammed down our throats constantly.
And then there is the new great word, misogyny, every male that looks at page three or whistles at a pretty girl is a sexist pig. What Trump said about woman was 'locker room talk' go to any gathering of men be it in a pub or football match (you know where working classes congregate) and you will hear a lot worse, (I will exclude Islington dinner party's from this) why, because men will be men and most sensible women know that, hence the reason Trump picked up a fair share of their vote.
The problem for you is that the liberal metropolitan elite are obsessed with minorities and political correctness, and this does not go down well with the working classes, especially outside London. In fact people are sick and tired of having it rammed down their throats by smug lefties and that is why you have lost the argument. I sit back in amusement at your outrage that the majority don't accept your point of view. Long may it continue.

Despite having little or no time for most politicians, I must admit to the sense ( and indeed truth) in this...

[boltonboris]

And hence is your problem Owen, you go on about speaking the language of the working classes yet you speak the language of the metropolitan elites. Going on and on about things like multiculturalism, a failed project which the majority don't accept. Your obsession with LGBT I mean most people are live and let live but do we have to have it rammed down our throats constantly.
And then there is the new great word, misogyny, every male that looks at page three or whistles at a pretty girl is a sexist pig. What Trump said about woman was 'locker room talk' go to any gathering of men be it in a pub or football match (you know where working classes congregate) and you will hear a lot worse, (I will exclude Islington dinner party's from this) why, because men will be men and most sensible women know that, hence the reason Trump picked up a fair share of their vote.
The problem for you is that the liberal metropolitan elite are obsessed with minorities and political correctness, and this does not go down well with the working classes, especially outside London. In fact people are sick and tired of having it rammed down their throats by smug lefties and that is why you have lost the argument. I sit back in amusement at your outrage that the majority don't accept your point of view. Long may it continue.

Despite having little or no time for most politicians, I must admit to the sense ( and indeed truth) in this...

[BWFC_Insane]

And hence is your problem Owen, you go on about speaking the language of the working classes yet you speak the language of the metropolitan elites. Going on and on about things like multiculturalism, a failed project which the majority don't accept. Your obsession with LGBT I mean most people are live and let live but do we have to have it rammed down our throats constantly.
And then there is the new great word, misogyny, every male that looks at page three or whistles at a pretty girl is a sexist pig. What Trump said about woman was 'locker room talk' go to any gathering of men be it in a pub or football match (you know where working classes congregate) and you will hear a lot worse, (I will exclude Islington dinner party's from this) why, because men will be men and most sensible women know that, hence the reason Trump picked up a fair share of their vote.
The problem for you is that the liberal metropolitan elite are obsessed with minorities and political correctness, and this does not go down well with the working classes, especially outside London. In fact people are sick and tired of having it rammed down their throats by smug lefties and that is why you have lost the argument. I sit back in amusement at your outrage that the majority don't accept your point of view. Long may it continue.

Despite having little or no time for most politicians, I must admit to the sense ( and indeed truth) in this...

Yes. Let's vote for sexism, homophobia, hatred and bigotry. Brilliant.

I don't give a shit if this upsets people. But it is frightening that people with these views still exist. Nobody has rammed anything down anyone's throats.

All these people who are so keen on sexism, on the repression of those with different sexualities and of a stamping out of political correctness (for PC we can read being a decent human being a not a total nice person) there are many places in the world you may like. Saudi Arabia for one. That would suit the sort of bigotry and hatred that gets spouted from the likes of that commenter. And you'd not have to worry about LGBT or having to treat women as equals.

[TANGODANCER]

Never having been racist, woman-hating or obsessively-politically correct, or even like your good self a persistant drum thumper for most things, I was agreeing with the point- which I assumed was being made-that all people are not idiots, racists, pedophiles and narrow minded and quite capable of sorting things out for themslelves. (ps: I use words, not capital letters to say thing so LBG and all that stuff passes me by)....hope this is clear....

[Dr Hotdog]

"That Obama Creature"