The Politics Thread

[Rjs37]

The poster was a deliberate outright lie. There isn't any question or debate to be had of that. Not just the entirely wrong number but the fact they knew it was never going to the NHS.

Just like the point I was making about £4300 figure too. They knew they were taking out of their asses.

Assuming that we have to use the same numbers, but make the two statements more truthful they'd be akin to:

"Before the rebate, we're liable to pay the EU around £350m per week. We also get some money back for various subsidies which we'd probably have to continue paying. We may or may not use some of the leftover money for the NHS*.
*Probably not going to happen. Brexit means Brexit."

"Based on coming to a similar trade deal as Canada, our projected GDP* would be around £4300 less per household than if we stayed in the EU. The GDP is still expected to grow, just a little less.
*i.e. not the average household income. This was also based on incorrect population numbers, and lots of other facts that we've twisted to make the numbers seem worse than what other more accurate projections actually think.

Not exactly as snappy are they?

[BWFC_Insane]

The most idiotic part of the statement is the 'give' bit.

I 'give' Tesco a f*cking fortune every week. The problem is, I eat my cake. I'm not sure what level of moron the till person would take me for if I wanted the goods and my money back.

Which I think is BWFCi's point. I think. I'm sure he'll be happy to correct me.

Well yes. That and the number being completely wrong in the first place.

Well if you over pay for your cake........

I suppose the need for an emergency budget, the £4500 under everyone's sofa and the outbreak of WW3 were true as well

Presenting projections and potential outcomes in a certain light is one thing. We still don't actually know how it will affect wages and the economy longer term. But presenting that in a threatening way is one thing. It is what politicians do, like it or not.

Running a campaign based on a figure that is wrong, making what many see as a promise that you have no power to enact, and swearing blind it is true, till a minute after the vote then retracting it, is of course a lot, lot worse. However you like to spin it.

Having said that people in this country don't seem to care very much for honesty and integrity. So not sure it matters. I mean we have a staunch remainer running the country, trying to pretend she is the face and protector of all things Brexit. Someone has to run that one by me again.....

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

I think staunch is stretching it rather a lot Insano.

[BWFC_Insane]

I think staunch is stretching it rather a lot Insano.

Oh she played a very calculated game in public. Absolutely.

However...

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... out-brexit

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

Nothing there suggests she's a staunch supporter of the EU, just that it could be damaging to business to leave. Some people don't give a shit about what damage might be caused, they just want out. We don't really know where on the spectrum she is.

[BWFC_Insane]

Nothing there suggests she's a staunch supporter of the EU, just that it could be damaging to business to leave. Some people don't give a shit about what damage might be caused, they just want out. We don't really know where on the spectrum she is.

Suggests she was fairly firmly in the remain camp.

Frankly I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth. I find it unbelievable that the British people and media seem to be under her spell.

[Rjs37]

Nothing there suggests she's a staunch supporter of the EU, just that it could be damaging to business to leave. Some people don't give a shit about what damage might be caused, they just want out. We don't really know where on the spectrum she is.

Suggests she was fairly firmly in the remain camp.

Frankly I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth. I find it unbelievable that the British people and media seem to be under he spell.

When the opposition leaders are currently Corbyn, Farron and Sturgeon, you find it unbelievable that people are backing Theresa May?

Plus when you consider that Boris Johnson was the favourite to become PM, I think a lot of people are just counting their blessings at how much worse it could've been.

[BWFC_Insane]

Nothing there suggests she's a staunch supporter of the EU, just that it could be damaging to business to leave. Some people don't give a shit about what damage might be caused, they just want out. We don't really know where on the spectrum she is.

Suggests she was fairly firmly in the remain camp.

Frankly I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth. I find it unbelievable that the British people and media seem to be under he spell.

When the opposition leaders are currently Corbyn, Farron and Sturgeon, you find it unbelievable that people are backing Theresa May?

Plus when you consider that Boris Johnson was the favourite to become PM, I think a lot of people are just counting their blessings at how much worse it could've been.

Ermm yes I do. She's flip-flopped to suit her own career in the most flagrant and blatant of manners. She's a walking vox pop saying whatever she thinks the electorate want to hear at the time. I thought at one point that at least she'd be competent but other than getting away with things no leader in the past 20 years has, she doesn't actually seem very good at anything. But honestly, May is terrible. She's going to win, but still she's terrible. She's about as good as Corbyn. Only the right wing media don't point this out so public perception is way off.

And if we're talking leaders, you may not like her politics, but my god does Sturgeon put her to shame. I'd love to have seen Sturgeon rip May to shreds in the TV debate. May isn't even strong enough to do that. I mean she can't lose this election, so one would have thought a TV debate, whilst it would show her up, would at least demonstrate some bottle and leadership.

This is the first election I can remember where I go into it having absolutely no clue who to vote for.

Do I vote Labour to try and prevent the Tories having too large a majority? But then I don't want to vote and endorse Corbyn.

Do I vote Lib Dem, who I think are probably the best option for me and waste a vote?

Or waste it on some other minority party?

It is a damned if you do damned if you don't situation for me.

[Dr Hotdog]

This is the first election I can remember where I go into it having absolutely no clue who to vote for.

Do I vote Labour to try and prevent the Tories having too large a majority? But then I don't want to vote and endorse Corbyn.

Do I vote Lib Dem, who I think are probably the best option for me and waste a vote?

Or waste it on some other minority party?

It is a damned if you do damned if you don't situation for me.

It's a toughie, but try and focus on policy not personality.

[BWFC_Insane]

This is the first election I can remember where I go into it having absolutely no clue who to vote for.

Do I vote Labour to try and prevent the Tories having too large a majority? But then I don't want to vote and endorse Corbyn.

Do I vote Lib Dem, who I think are probably the best option for me and waste a vote?

Or waste it on some other minority party?

It is a damned if you do damned if you don't situation for me.

It's a toughie, but try and focus on policy not personality.

If I do that I have to vote Plaid Cymru or SNP. As neither will be an option I have an issue.

Think Lib Dems is next closest, but then I am essentially wasting a vote and helping the Tories out.

[Dr Hotdog]

This is the first election I can remember where I go into it having absolutely no clue who to vote for.

Do I vote Labour to try and prevent the Tories having too large a majority? But then I don't want to vote and endorse Corbyn.

Do I vote Lib Dem, who I think are probably the best option for me and waste a vote?

Or waste it on some other minority party?

It is a damned if you do damned if you don't situation for me.

It's a toughie, but try and focus on policy not personality.

If I do that I have to vote Plaid Cymru or SNP. As neither will be an option I have an issue.

Think Lib Dems is next closest, but then I am essentially wasting a vote and helping the Tories out.

Depending on your constituency, aye. I live in the Gorton constituency and that is up there with the absolute safest Red seats in the country. Not sure that a Lib Dem (or George Galloway - LOL) vote would do much from my POV.

[Hoboh]

Nothing there suggests she's a staunch supporter of the EU, just that it could be damaging to business to leave. Some people don't give a shit about what damage might be caused, they just want out. We don't really know where on the spectrum she is.

Suggests she was fairly firmly in the remain camp.

Frankly I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth. I find it unbelievable that the British people and media seem to be under he spell.

When the opposition leaders are currently Corbyn, Farron and Sturgeon, you find it unbelievable that people are backing Theresa May?

Plus when you consider that Boris Johnson was the favourite to become PM, I think a lot of people are just counting their blessings at how much worse it could've been.

Ermm yes I do. She's flip-flopped to suit her own career in the most flagrant and blatant of manners. She's a walking vox pop saying whatever she thinks the electorate want to hear at the time. I thought at one point that at least she'd be competent but other than getting away with things no leader in the past 20 years has, she doesn't actually seem very good at anything. But honestly, May is terrible. She's going to win, but still she's terrible. She's about as good as Corbyn. Only the right wing media don't point this out so public perception is way off.

And if we're talking leaders, you may not like her politics, but my god does Sturgeon put her to shame. I'd love to have seen Sturgeon rip May to shreds in the TV debate. May isn't even strong enough to do that. I mean she can't lose this election, so one would have thought a TV debate, whilst it would show her up, would at least demonstrate some bottle and leadership.

This is the first election I can remember where I go into it having absolutely no clue who to vote for.

Do I vote Labour to try and prevent the Tories having too large a majority? But then I don't want to vote and endorse Corbyn.

Do I vote Lib Dem, who I think are probably the best option for me and waste a vote?

Or waste it on some other minority party?

It is a damned if you do damned if you don't situation for me.

Wee jimmy 'one policy' fish a good leader!!!!!!!

[Lord Kangana]

I'm guessing here, but upon hearing the phrase "a red white and blue brexit" you didn't think to yourself "Jesus, how do you tie your own shoe laces?" did you?

[Abdoulaye's Twin]

Nothing there suggests she's a staunch supporter of the EU, just that it could be damaging to business to leave. Some people don't give a shit about what damage might be caused, they just want out. We don't really know where on the spectrum she is.

Suggests she was fairly firmly in the remain camp.

Frankly I don't believe a word that comes out of her mouth. I find it unbelievable that the British people and media seem to be under her spell.

As you say, she flip flops and u turns like no one else I can think of. Kind of backs up my point...who knows what she really thinks. I find it particularly laughable that a Home Minister with an appalling record of border control, immigration and passports etc is thought to be the best person to deal with Brexit and sorting out er...immigration.

[BWFC_Insane]

Wee jimmy 'one policy' fish a good leader!!!!!!!

Oh, she's good. She's exactly what you want. Someone who fights for her "people." Genuinely. You may disagree with her politics (which actually after the nationalist one are actually very good IMO) but she is a proper leader. You may dislike her. But she has genuine belief and conviction. She's a more convincing leader than any of the others. But you have to see past your dislike.

[Bruce Rioja]

I've just watched the most excruciating party political broadcast I've ever seen. Dragging infants into it. Hang your heads, Labour.

[Worthy4England]

Does this dammed woman never give up?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ard-brexit

It was all to do with parliamentary procedures was it?

Bare faced liar.

I hope not, the bare faced liars promising £350m extra for the NHS need holding to Account.

Oft repeated this was a "promise" rather than the reduction in EU fees could be used for a variety of things including the NHS. Just continuing to state "promise" doesn't make it so.

Well fcuk me. Like I care.

[Hoboh]

Wee jimmy 'one policy' fish a good leader!!!!!!!

Oh, she's good. She's exactly what you want. Someone who fights for her "people." Genuinely. You may disagree with her politics (which actually after the nationalist one are actually very good IMO) but she is a proper leader. You may dislike her. But she has genuine belief and conviction. She's a more convincing leader than any of the others. But you have to see past your dislike.

You really are joking I hope, good leader, good polices? You mean the policies Moody said would give them a basket case credit rating? Or the policies that would leave them with a deficit that would make Greece look rich?
Fcuking hell!
Oh forgot to add, the great leader whose party is not even spending the money allocated to them, then blame the English for poor services, gob on a stick that's all she is.

[Hoboh]

Does this dammed woman never give up?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ard-brexit

It was all to do with parliamentary procedures was it?

Bare faced liar.

I hope not, the bare faced liars promising £350m extra for the NHS need holding to Account.

Oft repeated this was a "promise" rather than the reduction in EU fees could be used for a variety of things including the NHS. Just continuing to state "promise" doesn't make it so.

Well fcuk me. Like I care.

Now it might just be me but I cannot see we promise or we will spend anything on the side of that bus, bit like those slogans, spend less, live better etc. etc.
I would say it is an example of what we could do, not a promise, Georgie boys budget was real though.

[Worthy4England]

Does this dammed woman never give up?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ard-brexit

It was all to do with parliamentary procedures was it?

Bare faced liar.

I hope not, the bare faced liars promising £350m extra for the NHS need holding to Account.

Oft repeated this was a "promise" rather than the reduction in EU fees could be used for a variety of things including the NHS. Just continuing to state "promise" doesn't make it so.

Well fcuk me. Like I care.

Now it might just be me but I cannot see we promise or we will spend anything on the side of that bus, bit like those slogans, spend less, live better etc. etc.
I would say it is an example of what we could do, not a promise, Georgie boys budget was real though.

You'd have to have a fairly particular view of the world to suggest that "Let's fund (which is clearly a reference to "spend money") the NHS instead" didn't constitute any linkage to the £350m up above it.

If you want to bandy shit, I seem to recall George Osborne talked about "illustrative" budget changes which "could" do X or Y to various taxes etc.

I have no reason to defend Osborne either - he's a lying shit too. But the notion that either side were anything but self serving unbelievable turds, isn't one I subscribe too.

The point is, whatever Osborne promised (or suggested in strong "non-promissory terms" that sounded a bit like a promise) - he wasn't in a position post Referendum, to actually carry it out, so he couldn't - had he been, he might have done.

Many of the people who were stood in front of that bus are all in Government or on the Government benches - Liam Fox, Boris, IDS etc. etc. they could and still can make good on their suggestion that this £350m could be spent on the NHS - that doesn't preclude it being spent on other things either - noted. So I await to see which public services they will fund with it, when the good times roll and the money comes in. I can wait for them to account for every last penny.